brainiac wrote:
I got a request by PM about how I did the NR on that 12800 iso file. The answer is I used smart blur on a duplicate layer in photoshop and chose the overlay white option for edges. I then expanded, feathered, and knocked out the white areas and set the layer's blending mode to colour. There are lots of ways to achieve excellent NR just using the built-in Photoshop tools, and typcially it can be done better that way than by any of the commercial NR tools, because it can be suited to each picture, and even particular areas of each picture....Show more →
Wow!! That's a lot to go through just to reduce noise. I hope someone comes out with a free action to do all that stuff.
Yeah I need a step by step tutorial for dummies. I can do basics in photoshop, but masks and whatnot and seperating this from that get a little tricky.
droopy1592 wrote:
Yeah I need a step by step tutorial for dummies. I can do basics in photoshop, but masks and whatnot and seperating this from that get a little tricky.
Lightroom was made for people who hate masks, like me.
droopy1592 wrote:
I received another 7D body, and while it doesn't have the random OOF shot like the last one, instead of all of lenses being globally off on this body by -5 MA, now they are all over the place. The 17-55mm and 50mm f/1.4 need 0 MA, the 85L II needs -6 and it's razor sharp, and the 70-200 I haven't a clue... maybe between -8 and -11 but I don't have a thin enough dof to be sure.
that's the whole point of MFA, since this is often the case, now you rarely need to send them in anymore, very nice!!!! would've save me a lot of grief a couple years ago right before a nat geo expedition when they were apparently so slow with the 1D3 fixes they forgot about my stuff and never got around to it before I had to leave
unless you get a zoom lens that needs different setting say at wide or long end
or something that focuses very differently under 20' vs. over 20'
or have an ultra-thin DOF lens and find it lies say between -3 and -4 then maybe get the body given a half-turn adjustment
It's not meant to be a detail comparison because they were at different FL and distances. I'm mainly looking at noise and shadows and something else that starts with a B or PN (two words) depending on what you want to call it.
yeah, for all the talk about DR and SNR this really does show that it is stuff like pattern noise and banding where perhaps the real differences lie (despite banding being considering the worst and ultimate form of pixel peeping and for more evil than examining even DR and SNR )
the 50D did have just about the worst high iso banding of any canon body
it was the major bugaboo for that model
brainiac wrote:
I got a request by PM about how I did the NR on that 12800 iso file. The answer is I used smart blur on a duplicate layer in photoshop and chose the overlay white option for edges. I then expanded, feathered, and knocked out the white areas and set the layer's blending mode to colour. There are lots of ways to achieve excellent NR just using the built-in Photoshop tools, and typcially it can be done better that way than by any of the commercial NR tools, because it can be suited to each picture, and even particular areas of each picture....Show more →
good job
although for anything but a very select number of ultimate keepers from an important shoot that really, really bogs the work flow down (as it is i am still processing my safari photos for 07-08 ), but for something really special (like the first color-photo of an ivory-billed woodpecker in the USA deep in the depths of a swamp it would be awesome )
Thanks, Brainiac. I've got some practicing to do to get to the level of quality you showed. Question - I'm ending up with LOTS of white edges in the soup can. Most of the words and letters for example end up getting knocked out. Is that proper?
droopy1592 wrote:
i've heard a few say they've sent body in with lenses and the whole system comes back perfect.
A couple of months ago I sent in 3 lenses and my 5DII. They all came back working correctly, but still required a little MA. In fact, they returned my 5DII plus 24-105 in the first shipment to me. Then shipped the 16-35 and 85 in separate shipments over the next two days ... I really don't think the 5DII was even there when they calibrated the last two lenses.
I sent my 5D and 5 lenses in a couple of years ago, and I just sent my new 7D and out of warranty 400 4.5L. No charge to calibrate the lenses either time. I think as long as you report that your in warranty body is having issues with any of your lenses they will calibrate everything no charge. They do request that you send a copy of your invoice or warranty card for each piece, but I think the key is to tell them that the camera is having focus issues with all of the lenses you are sending with it. Hope this helps.
although for anything but a very select number of ultimate keepers from an important shoot that really, really bogs the work flow down...
No it doesn't. Batch export to 8 bit tiff from DPP. Record the action in photoshop. Then batch the recorded action in photoshop. Pretty much as fast as you and your machine. The colour blur method doesn't need to be applied to localised areas - you can do it in a way that is appropriate for a large set of images.
The method is:
- apple J to duplicate image to a new layer
- smart blur with high quality and overlay edges, experiment with radius and threshold to suit your tastes
- use wand with zero tolerance and non-contiguous to select all white pixels
- expand selection by, let's say, 1 pixel
- feather by, let's say, 1 pixel
- hit the delete key
- set layer blending to colour
Obviously, depending on how fast your Mac is the smart blur (or dust+scratches) stage can take a few seconds for each 18 Mpixel image, but if you just batch them as part of your workflow you can go and have a cup of tea.
There are many variations of this, for example you could use dust & scratches instead of blur, and still knock out the edges using smart blur or find edges. You can of course very quickly localise this using a layer mask because the effect is fairly subtle: a big thick brush is perfect and you can just splash the effect in where you want it without much care. But there's no need to localise to match or exceed most commercial NR packages.
BTW, I should mention that I did not learn all of this in some tutorial, but simply used existing filters and photoshop methods to do what chroma NR softwares can be seen to do.
Well how about you email me the action. I'm quad coring it up over here so I shouldn't have any problem with speed. Mac actions do work in windows right?
try droopy at gee mail and let me see this action in, er... uh, action.
droopy1592 wrote:
Well how about you email me the action. I'm quad coring it up over here so I shouldn't have any problem with speed. Mac actions do work in windows right?
try droopy at gee mail and let me see this action in, er... uh, action.
There is a lot of talk out there on how much better an image looks if you take a RAW file and resize it down to sRAW dimensions. I frequently photograph dance performances and I know this not to be true on my 40d. I do not know if this is true on any other camera so I gave it a shot on my new 7d.
The purpose of this test is to show the difference in noise levels between RAW and sRAW/mRAW after being resized to sRAW dimensions. The results are fairly conclusive but not necessarily "winner takes all" for either format.
Processing Details:
- Images have not been sharpened.
- ACR 5.6 used.
- All ACR settings are default. Only color temperature has been changed in post.
- All Lightroom 3 Beta settings are default. (sharpening was disabled) Only color temperature has been changed in post.
- These are 100% crops after image resize to sRAW.
- All noise reduction has been done before resizing
- Noise Ninja settings (Strength 2, Smoothness 10, Contrast 14, USM Amount 0, USM Radius 0.4) I have found that these settings work better than default. This retains more detail, eliminates more color noise and doesn't blur everything in the process. Grain noise good, Color noise bad.
- Photoshop Reduce Noise settings (Strength 6, Preserve Details 60, Reduce Color Noise 100, Sharpen Details 0)
Notes:
- For some reason there is a slight increase in light sensitivity on the 7d when switching from RAW to mRAW/sRAW. Colors seem to change as well. The exposure and color settings are exactly the same in all shots. I am unclear on why this is happening.
- 40d shots are slightly oof. I would have redone that part of the test if this was about sharpness between the two cameras. Alas it is not.
- The 40d sRAW file was upscaled to 7d sRAW dimensions using Genuine Fractals. Although it is slightly softer it clearly shows lower noise levels.
Conclusions:
- sRAW definitely offers a reduction in noise levels when a high ISO is being used
- RAW + Noise Ninja offer a further reduction in color noise levels but still isn't quite as effective as sRAW.
- RAW + Photoshop Remove Noise offers a lower amount of color noise than Noise Ninja however some artifacts are introduced around edges of text. Some non noise related colors are lost. This can be seen around the eye of the Elf.
- RAW creates sharper images than sRAW even after downscaling.
- Lightroom 3 beta noise reducing algorithm is far superior to ACR 5.6 and any additional noise reducing techniques that can be used in post. This method is by far the best choice in reducing color noise. Additional noise reduction techniques can be applied but you are likely only to blur the grain that is left. You will loose detail in the process.
- Lightroom 3 beta puts RAW and sRAW noise levels very close to each other. sRAW still has slightly less color noise, however the resized RAW files are much sharper and the grain size is so much smaller that many individuals may find resizing RAW files yourself the obvious choice.
- Lightroom 3 beta has turned ISO 12800 7d files into a highly usable state. I wouldn't hesitate to use ISO 12800 for my professional work if it required it.
Test Update:
Added RAW + Noise Ninja Test
Added RAW + Photoshop Reduce Noise Test
Added RAW + Lightroom 3 Beta Test
Conclusions to reflect on Lightroom 3 Beta Test
