Emile Gregoire wrote:
Actually the unemployment rate in the EU is 7.5% (latest figures; The Economist, Nov. 8). Also noteworthy: consumer prices in the US went up 4.9% year-on-year; in the EU they went up 3.2%. And these last figures are why your other comment:
That's an interesting number, but don't forget that the numbers for France, Germany, and some others are considerably above that. Maybe Great Briton has a lower one that balances it out to some extent.
But don't forget that the economic crisis is hitting Europe as well, and they are just behind us in the timing. Whatever is happening here, to a large extent, will be happening there as well.
Emile Gregoire wrote:
Where do you get your figures? According to the CIA world fact book public debt in the US is 60.9%. In the EU it's 58.7% (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_the_European_Union). Public debt figures don't include household debt, which typically is much higher in the US than most anywhere else in the world.
I didn't check my sources but neither did you
Listen, we can shout figures here like no-one else and be proud of it, but it doesn't really help any discussion if they're incorrect, now does it. And least of all a discussion on the 5DII, which I'll probably be buying somewhere around summer next year. ...Show more →
An article about the economic situation in the NY Times a couple of days ago went through this pretty well, and had charts to go with it.
It doesn't help, because we can't do much about it. I'll be buying the 5D mkII in January. I always like to wait a bit.
Just letting you guys know that, when going through my utilities searching for updates, I came across the Canon RAW Codec for Windows/XP link , and v1.4 of the codec (just a couple of days young) supports the 5D Mk II :
Note I haven't tested it and, IIRC, the first version of this codec a year or two ago actually caused corruption - I assume they have fixed that by now but thought I should let you know
Mel Gross wrote:
That's an interesting number, but don't forget that the numbers for France, Germany, and some others are considerably above that. Maybe Great Briton has a lower one that balances it out to some extent.
But don't forget that the economic crisis is hitting Europe as well, and they are just behind us in the timing. Whatever is happening here, to a large extent, will be happening there as well.
We are all connected these days.
Definitely! In spite of all the talk about decoupling a year ago the saying is still true: when the US sneeze, the rest of the world gets a cold. We've completely caught up I'm afraid: whatever is happening in the US is already happening here, except we don't have a massive sub-prime mortgage problem. Luckily our banks bought heavily into yours
France & Germany have been doing relatively ok these past years and now both stand below 8%. The UK is doing way better (5.7%) as well as the Nordics and the Netherlands (my home country; 3.7%). Even Italy does a somewhat decent (from a historical point of view) 6.8%. Biggest problems are Spain (11.9% but after a hugely succesful period of 30 years of growth), Belgium (10.9%) and Poland (8.9%). And to conclude this morning's facts 'n' figures section: I made a mistake: the 7.5% I mentioned was the Euro area, not the EU as a whole. Sorry!
EyeBrock wrote:
(...) My point was that the whole thing was done quite sneakily by Canon Canada.
The company I work for is proactive at getting good and bad news out promptly and openly.
I guess I expected a multi-national like Canon to do the same. I'm not going to flog this to death but it was badly handled.
Open and frank reasons would have sold way better than the 'delete original price from website and hope nobody notices' approach.
Just bad PR.
I'll still most probably get the 5D2, but Canon have slipped a tad in my estimation.
The other thing that has been suprising is the open hostility some posters have displayed towards us Canadians expressing our particular opinions at paying another $450 for the 5D2. Different. ...Show more →
Well, I'm afraid nothing surprises anymore after the 1D MkIII problems. I feel for you: $450 ain't nothing. I'd wait for half a year before buying; the price will probably be back at its starting point.
Thanks for the AU RRP post above! Any news on dates? Someone at canonrumors.com said she pinned Canon USA down to a retail distribution date of 21st Nov.
Just curious about the source for AU pricing... who's handing you the RRP prices at 10pm on a Monday night? ;-) I'm starting to think that Canon Australia will never put the RRP on their website, just like their lenses. Perhaps this is the start of a new trend.
I just did a quick calculation based on Nov. 9 exchange rates and the prices I've seen quoted for five locales. Here is the table.
Location Price in USD
US 2,699
Canada 2,620
Aus 2,891
UK 3,630
EU 3,193
What is most interesting to me is that the recently increased Canadian price--the one that has created such a furor--turns out to be the lowest when compared to the others when converted to a common currency!
Prices in the EU vary wildly. Cheapest I've seen in the Netherlands is US$ 3000; here in France I see them advertised for US$ 3700. I haven't yet noticed a price increase but must add I haven't been following prices intently as I'm not in the habit of being the first to buy a newly released camera.
burychka wrote:
I just did a quick calculation based on Nov. 9 exchange rates and the prices I've seen quoted for five locales. Here is the table.
Location Price in USD
US 2,699
Canada 2,620
Aus 2,891
UK 3,630
EU 3,193
What is most interesting to me is that the recently increased Canadian price--the one that has created such a furor--turns out to be the lowest when compared to the others when converted to a common currency!
FWIW.
Obviously this forum has influence. All of the Canadian concerns voiced here have been taken into account by the parent company. Ya right
OT OT OT EyeBrock wrote:
The other thing that has been suprising is the open hostility some posters have displayed towards us Canadians expressing our particular opinions at paying another $450 for the 5D2. Different.
Some people are just hostile. It is a symptom of the times in which we live. Personally, I like to look at Canada as a preview the U.S. in future years.
You have an extreme left-leaning government. We have one that is trying hard to catch up.
Your government has all but outlawed personal ownership of handguns and makes it virtually impossible for a citizen to legally carry a concealed handgun. That is one of Obama's goals. Had he been president four years ago, he would have accomplished that goal already with left wing Supreme Court appointments (see Heller vs Washington DC--a recent very close call for the 2nd Amendment to the U.S. Constitution aka the right to keep and bear arms).
You have a largely commodity-based economy. U.S. manufacturing is disappearing little by little, industry by industry. By the time I finish posting the message, GM, Chrysler, and Ford may all be in bankruptcy. The U.S. is buying jet tankers from Europe while U.S. aircraft manufacturers are laying off workers. It won't be long before agriculture and minerals will be all we have left--and we're consuming them faster than we can produce them even now.
So if you detect hostility in posts from the U.S., it may be because they see their own future in Canada's present, and they know they are powerless to stop the transformation.
I have been told that even if you have put a deposit down on the 5D it means nothing. They can raise the price all they want so the answer is - no you have no rights in this matter. I am 3 hours north of the Henrys where I put the deposit down and this coming Sat am going down to get my $600 back. $300 of that was a gift card which I don't think they normally give a refund on. However they know just how pissed I am about this so have said I will get the whole $600 back. I am also no longer doing business with Henrys Camera once I get my $600 back. I no longer intend on buying this camera..... I can live with my XTi and 2 L lenses. I will spend the money on something that makes more sense.
I have already complained to Consumer Affairs and sent them a digital copy of my deposit receipt. I would suggest that other Canadians do the same if they feel screwed by Canon.
You have a largely commodity-based economy. U.S. manufacturing is disappearing little by little, industry by industry. By the time I finish posting the message, GM, Chrysler, and Ford may all be in bankruptcy. The U.S. is buying jet tankers from Europe while U.S. aircraft manufacturers are laying off workers. It won't be long before agriculture and minerals will be all we have left--and we're consuming them faster than we can produce them even now.
The handgun issue doesn't have much to do with the economy, however this second issue you mention is extremely significant--it's at the base of the problems of the US economy--and it's gotten little real notice.
Ironically, perhaps, McCain is on records as saying that the export of production capacity is not a problem (his suggestion was just to train workers to take "better jobs"), while Obama listed it as a major problem to be addressed.
I took an economics class at the University of the Philippines in the mid-80s, where at one point the professor noted: "The Philippines will always be a third world country because we export tomatoes and import tomato paste." He was right, and I've been watching that exact thing happening to the US since 1989.
Notice, this isn't something confined to one party or the other--both parties and our top financial interests have been exporting production capacity to China as rapidly as possible--touting the incredibly stupid concept of "the US is a consumer economy." That's the most imbecilic thing I've ever heard. A "consumer economy" is like a household where nobody has a job and everyone goes to the mall.
In the early 80s, I was on the headquarters staff of the Strategic Air Command. One of my jobs was to periodically place "Request for Proposals" into the Commerce Business Daily. The CBD is a listing of all government desires for things to be built or purchased--kind of like Craig's List.
Back in the 80s, when I submitted an RFP for some new widget to be built for SAC, I'd get a hundred or more proposals from medium and small factories and fabrication plants across the country.
In the late 90s, I was back in the same location and also submitting RFPs. I'd get only a handful of responses--less than a dozen in most cases--compared to the hundred or more I'd get in the early 80s. Our production capacity had dwindled that much.
This is an extreme national security issue, because in a great many cases the military has fallen depending on "single sources" for critical requirements. In some cases, there is no US source at all.
Most people don't realize that the US has depended on its manufacturing capcacity to win wars from the Civil War to today. We might not have the smartest generals, but we've been able to put more good hardware on the battlefield than anyone else.
That depended on having scads of small factories that were able to shift from peacetime to wartime production (the famed Norden bombsite of WWII was produced by a clockmaker--today the US doesn't make any clocks), and having scads of trained technicians in those small factories who could be hired by major factories when those had to ramp up for wars.
Most people don't realize that the Air Force depends on civilian aircraft maintenance companies for depot-level aircraft maintenance. Well, now the US aircraft companies have started sending their planes to China for depot maintenance (the Chinese facilities are cheaper because they don't have to be certified by the FAA or anyone else). But that means fewer jobs for American aircraft techs, and less repair capacity available for the Air Force.
General Motors builds the engines for HumVees...if GM goes down the tubes, the military loses another source of a vital component for one of its most-used vehicles. And GM subsidiary Delco makes radios for the military...if GM goes, there goes Delco.
We're down to one US supplier for tanker and cargo planes, one US supplier for combat uniforms, no US suppliers for laptops, and dwindling suppliers for most electronic components. The last is also critical, because those single suppliers for major weapons systems are increasingly losing US suppliers for their components.
Take a look at the controversy over replacing the Air Force's aging KC-135 tanker fleet (these are actually Boeing-707 aircraft from the 60s!). This is all a result of having to deal with a single source:
Doug Vann wrote:
I have already complained to Consumer Affairs and sent them a digital copy of my deposit receipt. I would suggest that other Canadians do the same if they feel screwed by Canon.
I guess that you couldn't take the time to read my post.
Under the Consumer Protection Act, the company you deal with can break the deal if they please, so long as they give you the opportunity for a full refund. Henry's has done that, and they are in full compliance with the law. Yes, its 300 dollars more, and yes, they are breaking the deal, but if you would have gone with anyone else you would have had the same thing.
Black's only started taking pre-orders a week ago and they are the only ones who are going to honor it probably because they only have a bunch of preorders.
You ranting isn't going to change anything. Plus Henry's is looking into getting something as compensation (last I heard, they were trying to throw in a grip or battery - which for that stupid camera is $200 in Canada for some reason)
Doug Vann wrote:
I have already complained to Consumer Affairs and sent them a digital copy of my deposit receipt. I would suggest that other Canadians do the same if they feel screwed by Canon.
As several have implied here, you are probably wasting your time. The Canon USA website states the price is $2,699† with a footnote that says,
"† Prices and specifications subject to change without notice. Actual prices are determined by individual dealers and may vary." Price and specifications...that gives Canon quite a bit of leeway.
If I recall my business law courses, a contract consists of an offer, acceptance, and consideration (aka money). If your receipt specified a purchase price, and not "estimated price" or "subject to change without notice", I'm pretty sure it would be enforceable here in Texas, USA, and you could sue in Small Claims Court for the difference in price. However, I am neither an attorney nor familiar with Canadian or Canadian Provincial contract law, so there you go.
And, of course, a dealer with sufficient demand could just say OK to your agreement and then keep moving you down the list behind those willing to pay the current price. "I'm sorry we don't have a camera for you yet. If you wish, we can refund your deposit." This is a house game, and we're not the house.
It is for instance probably more efficient to produce tomatoes in the Philippines and import the few percent that get converted into paste back. This doesn't turn any country into a third-world country. Oversimplification is fun but hardly useful. Then again, I didn't follow an economics class in a third-world country; never got any further than a bachelors and masters in it at a reputable university.
I agree that consumerism without production makes for headaches. However, production doesn't have to mean manufacturing only. Services (and there are way better paid services than being cashier at Wal-mart, which we'll be hearing next) have transformed quite a few countries. Name a few you say? Well, the Nordics come to mind, Luxemburg, Ireland, heck: India even counts.
You can't really blame business from seeking better value and more efficiency. In fact you could consider it a compliment that it's cheaper to produce in China than in the US. Or would you rather have wages in the US that can compete? It would solve the "consumer economy" problem though...
Plus there are definite advantages to an interconnect world. Having tight economic links with a lot of countries reduces the risk of war for instance. It's one of the founding principles of the EU and heck - we haven't had war on our turf since its conception.
Anyway, when will you be buying your Japanese produced 5D II?
burychka wrote:
As several have implied here, you are probably wasting your time. The Canon USA website states the price is $2,699† with a footnote that says,
"† Prices and specifications subject to change without notice. Actual prices are determined by individual dealers and may vary." Price and specifications...that gives Canon quite a bit of leeway.
If I recall my business law courses, a contract consists of an offer, acceptance, and consideration (aka money). If your receipt specified a purchase price, and not "estimated price" or "subject to change without notice", I'm pretty sure it would be enforceable here in Texas, USA, and you could sue in Small Claims Court for the difference in price. However, I am neither an attorney nor familiar with Canadian or Canadian Provincial contract law, so there you go.
And, of course, a dealer with sufficient demand could just say OK to your agreement and then keep moving you down the list behind those willing to pay the current price. "I'm sorry we don't have a camera for you yet. If you wish, we can refund your deposit." This is a house game, and we're not the house....Show more →
For the third time, read my posts!
From a conversation with the Consumer Protection Agency in Ontario - Henry's has fully complied with the regulations for consumer protection.
