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Archive 2008 · Canon 35L vs Zeiss, etc?

  
 
Byron Yu
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p.2 #1 · Canon 35L vs Zeiss, etc?


I wasn't able to use a tripod for this shot (the fence was too high) but here's a cityscape with the Leica 35/2

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3032/2609710111_96ff14c632_o.jpg



Jun 25, 2008 at 07:21 AM
Lotusm50
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p.2 #2 · Canon 35L vs Zeiss, etc?


I can't really compare the Zeiss ZF 35mm f2.0 to the 35L or the Leica lens, as I haven't used either, but it I hard to imagine any lens being better. It as sharp and flawless as any lens I have used. Here is a sample image using the lens shot into the sun. No flare, no loss of contrast, no CA in the back-lit trees, and sharp across the frame (this was at f5.6, I believe). Happy to post 100% crops (unsharpened) for those interested.
http://boncratious.com/images/TaosPasture2.jpg



Jun 25, 2008 at 08:33 AM
Sean Mills
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p.2 #3 · Canon 35L vs Zeiss, etc?


Byron Yu wrote:
I wasn't able to use a tripod for this shot (the fence was too high) but here's a cityscape with the Leica 35/2


Looks like you're on the Bathurst bridge... most any tripod would be able to extend above that 'fence'.



Jun 25, 2008 at 09:11 AM
Byron Yu
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p.2 #4 · Canon 35L vs Zeiss, etc?


Ha.. you are correct.. unfortunately i only had my small induro travel tripod with the optional short center column


Sean Mills wrote:
Looks like you're on the Bathurst bridge... most any tripod would be able to extend above that 'fence'.




Jun 25, 2008 at 10:44 AM
rfkiii
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p.2 #5 · Canon 35L vs Zeiss, etc?


At the link below, you will find 35L RAW files from a 5D and 300D at various f-stops. You are welcome to download any or all of them. It's shot at a location I use for testing lenses for landscapes so some folks have seen it before (but not the 35L RAWs from there). I find the lens acceptably sharp in the corners but shots like the one Lotusm50 posts above keeps me all GASed up for the Zeiss 35/2 ZF.

http://www.box.net/shared/ct24xpam2x



Jun 28, 2008 at 06:01 AM
rfkiii
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p.2 #6 · Canon 35L vs Zeiss, etc?


Hi Brainiac,

Do you feel you have an exceptional 35 f1.4 copy or is this performance typical of the lens?

Edit: just realized this was shot with the 200/1.8. Duh!! I was thinking "Man you are good with a manual focus lens". Nevermind.

Here's an example, iso 3200, 1Ds3, Canon 200 f1.8:

http://cyberphotographer.com/1ds3/drjosef/drjosef_lowrez.jpg


Edited on Jun 28, 2008 at 06:20 AM



Jun 28, 2008 at 06:16 AM
brainiac
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p.2 #7 · Canon 35L vs Zeiss, etc?


As a matter of fact I was just talking to a ballet photographer yesterday who was trading his 200 f1.8 for the new f2 version. I asked him if he expects the new lens to have the same magic, and he got a bit nervous. Every photographer I have met who has ever used the 200 f1.8 in anger says the same thing. The best lens ever made, bar none. In my view it is the Zeiss 21 of telephotos. I have used and owned the Zeiss CY 200 f2 and Leica 180 f2. I rate the 200 f1.8 above both of those, and even the very particular Leicaphiles mention the 180 f2 in hushed tones, implying it is the best SLR lens Leica has ever made.

The 200 f1.8 I used to take this picture is quite bashed up, with many visible imperfections on the front element, and some stuff inside. I don't think mine is special at all.

As regards the Zeiss 35 f1.4, I have three, two are as new serviced recently by Zeiss, and one has fairly scuffed up elements. They can all do this:
http://cyberphotographer.com/5D/CZ351.4/0805.jpg

That's a 5D in-camera JPEG, colour-balanced and recompressed, by the way.

However, it is a floating element design, and I think they can get into a state which needs servicing, if they are dropped or abused.

As regards manual focus, I would have no qualms about getting this shot spot on with the 35 f1.4. It has a very nice manual focus action. I would just shoot liberally while continuing to seek best focus. Most would be usable, and one or two would come out like this. With subject movement, and photographer movement, and 21 megapixels, even the 200 f1.8 will not be absolutely spot on every time. Most will be better than good enough and quite a few will be exceptional. I often manually focus the 200 f1.8, sometimes with liveview. I can't quite remember, but I suspect that this was a manually focussed shot via liveview's x10 setting. Servo AF would probably have nailed it just as well, but I don't like having composition forced by focus point position - a problem on the 1Ds3 with its fewer selectable focus points.

What these two lenses have in common with the Zeiss 21, which in my view makes them all stable mates, is that they have a veridical, limpid portrayal of 3D, a quality which I think is a practically a Zeiss trademark. It doesn't feel like a picture, the photographer and the medium sort of disappear, and you are left with the slightly unnerving feeling that you are looking through an open window at the thing itself. That's what I look for in a lens.


Edited by brainiac on Jun 28, 2008 at 01:08 PM GMT

Edited on Jun 28, 2008 at 08:08 AM



Jun 28, 2008 at 06:25 AM
edwardkaraa
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p.2 #8 · Canon 35L vs Zeiss, etc?


rfkiii wrote:
Hi Brainiac,

Do you feel you have an exceptional 35 f1.4 copy or is this performance typical of the lens?


One of the main reasons I use Zeiss is that I don't have to worry about having an exceptional or below par copies. All have been tested before shipment from the factory to the same standards. I have 13 Zeiss lenses, and all performed uniformely as expected except a Vario-Sonnar 28-85 whose previous owner had fooled with the focusing mechanism, probably to get infinity with a 5D or something. It is still being serviced at Contax (I know I should have sent it to Oberkochen, but it would have cost the price of a new lens + inflation).



Jun 28, 2008 at 06:38 AM
brainiac
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p.2 #9 · Canon 35L vs Zeiss, etc?


What is this 'Contax' of which you speak? If I were you I would be worried about whether you will see your lens again! Seriously, though, does Contax still exist? I thought it was extinct.

I have sent quite a few lenses to Oberkochen. The service is great value for money, and the quality control is absolutely superb. I sent them a disaster of a 35 f1.4 which somebody stole my money for on ebay. It cost a fortune, but the lens came back as new, with three beautiful but replaced elements in little bags. Carl Zeiss is Germanly serious about lenses.

Edited on Jun 28, 2008 at 06:47 AM



Jun 28, 2008 at 06:41 AM
Lotusm50
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p.2 #10 · Canon 35L vs Zeiss, etc?


He probably means the factory-authorized or official Contax service representative. Contax (Kyocera) committed to maintaining parts and repair service for 10 years after their withdrawal from the market. In the US, Contax warrranty and service repair is handled for Contax by ToCAD. In the UK, it is Alpha Digital Services Limited. In Germany it is Tritec GmbH.



Edited on Jun 28, 2008 at 07:12 AM



Jun 28, 2008 at 07:12 AM
edwardkaraa
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p.2 #11 · Canon 35L vs Zeiss, etc?


Lotusm50 wrote:
He probably means the factory-authorized or official Contax service representative. Contax (Kyocera) committed to maintaining parts and repair service for 10 years after their withdrawal from the market. In the US, Contax warrranty and service repair is handled for Contax by ToCAD. In the UK, it is Alpha Digital Services Limited. In Germany it is Tritec GmbH.



Yes, you are correct. I sent it to the company that used to be the official Contax importer in Thailand. To my surprise, they are still servicing Contax equipment. For this particular lens, they needed a replacement part from Japan, and I've been waiting for 2 months so far. As Brainiac said, I hope to see my lens again



Jun 28, 2008 at 07:17 AM
brainiac
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p.2 #12 · Canon 35L vs Zeiss, etc?


Just sold my 35L after using it for a few jobs. Close, but no cigar.


Jun 28, 2008 at 08:12 AM
weekh
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p.2 #13 · Canon 35L vs Zeiss, etc?


I've the the 35L and recently bought the ZF35. While the 35L is stellar, it is a little too big. I mainly use it for wedding whereby the fast AF and automation is really important. The ZF 35 though smaller than the L, is relatively huge compared to the other 35 F2 lenses.
What attracted me to get this lens is that the lens is very sharp wide open, even into the corners.


ZF35 + 5D. Bottom cropped off.
http://www.lens-scape.com/article/zf35-002.jpg


Edited on Jun 28, 2008 at 09:48 PM



Jun 28, 2008 at 09:46 PM
DocsPics
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p.2 #14 · Canon 35L vs Zeiss, etc?



The veridical hallucinogenic aspect of photography, has always been seen as a kind of magic: it stops time, and when done well it could be described as 'trompe l'oeil'. What's wrong with calling that deceptive experience 'magic'? I think Cableaddict knew what I meant.



Stopping time is magic. Making it pretty and interesting while you're at it is magestic.


Jun 29, 2008 at 02:16 AM
brainiac
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p.2 #15 · Canon 35L vs Zeiss, etc?


wee, that ZF looks great. gotta get me one...


Jun 29, 2008 at 08:38 AM
photoArne
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p.2 #16 · Canon 35L vs Zeiss, etc?


edwardkaraa wrote: One of the main reasons I use Zeiss is that I don't have to worry about having an exceptional or below par copies. All have been tested before shipment from the factory to the same standards.

Well, my experience doesn't bear this out, as least as far as the new ZM and ZF lines are concerned. My first of these was a used ZM 25 mm Biogon, that except for front focusing has performed impeccably. I then bought a new 35/2 ZM Biogon that had serious blurring on the left side (on a Leica M8), from the edge of the image and covering some 8-10 mm of the sensor. Lens was duly returned ( Robert White, btw.) and a new lens arrived that showed much the same fault but to a somewhat lesser extent. I've kept this copy because it is quite good otherwise, I can mostly work around the weakness.
Latest acquisition was the 35/2 ZF intended for my D3. Initial impression was good until I did a more careful test and discovered a vertical band on the left hand side with doubling of contours and a rather drastic loss of resolution.

I've found that this kind of behavior with sudden areas (spots, bands) of poor performance is much more common than most lens tests would lead one to believe. They would tend to be averaged out if they happen to be measured or seen at all. They are certainly not unique to Zeiss lenses. But I must also say that one good out of four is pretty weak, even Canon can do better (well.. it happens ) So my advice would at least be *caveat emptor* and make sure you can return the lens.



Jun 29, 2008 at 10:30 AM
edwardkaraa
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p.2 #17 · Canon 35L vs Zeiss, etc?


Sorry to hear about your bad experiences. I do not own any ZM or ZF lenses, but it seems that the most common complaints on this forum are stiff focusing rings. I think it would be a good idea to contact Zeiss about the defects, as I'm sure they are very serious about their products, and you might get a free fix or replacement directly from Oberkochen. I've never had any problem with any of my CZ lenses, except for the VS 28-85, and that was messed up by the previous owner.

photoArne wrote:
edwardkaraa wrote: One of the main reasons I use Zeiss is that I don't have to worry about having an exceptional or below par copies. All have been tested before shipment from the factory to the same standards.

Well, my experience doesn't bear this out, as least as far as the new ZM and ZF lines are concerned. My first of these was a used ZM 25 mm Biogon, that except for front focusing has performed impeccably. I then bought a new 35/2 ZM Biogon that had serious blurring on the left side (on a Leica M8), from the edge of
...Show more



Jun 29, 2008 at 10:42 AM
Marcel VanEerd
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p.2 #18 · Canon 35L vs Zeiss, etc?


Is this discussion open to CZJ 35mm f2.4 as well? I might be able to dig up some neat samples from that "legendary" lens, taken on a 20D


Jun 29, 2008 at 10:33 PM
weekh
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p.2 #19 · Canon 35L vs Zeiss, etc?


Marcel VanEerd wrote:
Is this discussion open to CZJ 35mm f2.4 as well? I might be able to dig up some neat samples from that "legendary" lens, taken on a 20D


I've the CZJ 35. It doesn't even come close.



Jun 29, 2008 at 10:55 PM
ovredal73
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p.2 #20 · Canon 35L vs Zeiss, etc?


I am picking up my C/Y 35 1.4 at the postoffice tomorrow and will do some tests against my 35L as I will sell one of them at the end. The tests wont be scientific at all, mostly mood and quality to the image as well as userfriendliness. I am much more preoccupied with the handling than the IQ. I have rarely come across a (well respected) lens that does not have good enough sharpness etc for my use.

For me its more of an issue - which lens inspires me? I think the CY 35 1.4 will
If I see some interesting differences between the lenses I will try to post some images here.I also have the OM 35/2 and the Leica R 35/2. I might do a quick comparison between all of them....

Edited on Jun 30, 2008 at 09:57 AM



Jun 30, 2008 at 09:56 AM
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