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Archive 2007 · ['NEW Fix' UPDATE!] - MkIII AF still broken

  
 
SLD
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p.8 #1 · ['NEW Fix' UPDATE!] - MkIII AF still broken


Jeff,

I remember that someone posted the question that how much will the FIX cost Canon long time ago, and i replied that $500 was calculated in the price of $4500, and i still believe it's true



Dec 14, 2007 at 07:56 PM
Jeff
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p.8 #2 · ['NEW Fix' UPDATE!] - MkIII AF still broken


Hmm, someone less trusting than me...

Whew!




Dec 14, 2007 at 08:02 PM
csm
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p.8 #3 · ['NEW Fix' UPDATE!] - MkIII AF still broken


lidesun wrote:
Jeff,

I remember that someone posted the question that how much will the FIX cost Canon long time ago, and i replied that $500 was calculated in the price of $4500, and i still believe it's true


!!! Now that is both funny and scary.



Dec 14, 2007 at 08:03 PM
AJ Nadershahi
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p.8 #4 · ['NEW Fix' UPDATE!] - MkIII AF still broken


If tha'ts the case then in the words of the computer hacking community, you've been "Owned" by Canon.


Dec 14, 2007 at 08:53 PM
calvillo
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p.8 #5 · ['NEW Fix' UPDATE!] - MkIII AF still broken


timbop wrote:
Nice analysis Jeff. I have a feeling that 2007 will be remembered as the year canon laid 3 eggs*. Oddly enough, it seems that the 40d will probably be the best of the 3 new cams, and it is woefully outclassed by the d300. It's a shame, but canon got complacent in the midrange and suffered from an engineering mistake in the high end.
The good news is that 2008 will (hopefully) see the resurgence of innovation and putting everything into each product.

* OK, the 40D will prove to be a great midlevel camera so it doesn't actually qualify as
...Show more

So you're saying the more expensive 300D has more to offer than the 40D? Shouldn't it?

I agree with you the the D series cameras though, not the way Canon wanted their big anniversary year to pan out I'd bet.

You're also right that these problems are bound to spur Canon to start competing, especially when accompanied by Nikon's intro of the 3D. For $500 more you get more iso, FF, and about the same frame rate as the D III. Combine this with the focus issues and there should be some switching going on.



Dec 17, 2007 at 07:08 PM
hhski
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p.8 #6 · ['NEW Fix' UPDATE!] - MkIII AF still broken


I initially thought the problem might be in the circuit boards with the temp related problems. While reading this I started wondering as did 1 other poster is it the anti dust nature of the sensor. The post where the middle top part of the images being blurred and the ghosting make me wonder where is the sensor fixed and does high shutter sped induce vibration. The other thing is the battery. Is there a small voltage drop in this new very light battery that changes output of the circuit components in burst/servo . My MK3 went back thursday. I hope to see it in another week.


Dec 17, 2007 at 08:00 PM
Jeff
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p.8 #7 · ['NEW Fix' UPDATE!] - MkIII AF still broken


I personally think that it is some physical characteristic of the AF assembly design that has gone awry. I spent some time yesterday looking through some MkIII images, and confirmed that I actually am seeing something that I only 'thought' I might be seeing previously. I wish I had the image here at work to post as an example, but will have to wait until tonight.

I've seen a few people mention AF plane vs. sensor field issues that result in a lateral inconsistency in the field of focus, not quite like the results of a view camera, but something similar. In my case, the image in question that illustrates it best is of a series of ridgelines, each of which is close enough to parallel to the sensor to be considered roughly equidistant (DOF-wise). The ridge is admittedly further away on the left side than the right, but it is >1 mile away (shot with a 70-200/2.8L IS at f/2.8), so I really doubt that the left side could be out of the plane of the DOF while the right side remains within it. The effect that I see in the image is that as you follow the primary ridgeline from right to left (landscape orientation), it becomes more and more out of focus until at the left edge it looks absolutely horrible. It's almost impossible to see with the image 'fit on screen', somewhat hard to see at 50%, but glaringly obvious at 1:1. The image in question printed at anything beyond about 5x7 would look marginal, at best.

There's no way to know whether it's a sensor alignment issue, or a lens mount issue, or related to the dust shaker, or... I can't fathom how it could be a user error phenomenon, though perhaps after the 'sheep incident' someone can point out the error in my ways. Since the variability is horizontal in orientation, I also can't see how it could be related to focus mechanism movement during exposure, as some have postulated for the 'ghosting' issue. I've noted that some 1D MkIII users have reported some images to almost have a very, [very extremely limited depth of field, and what I'm seeing is along those lines.

I'll try to post the image with 100% crops tonight so you all can see what I'm talking about. I've thought that I've seen this before in some of my images, but I never thought much of it, since I never tried to print any of the images. The main thing about this issue is that if it's widespread, it likely affects all types of shooters, not just sports guys shooting fast-paced people sports. Hopefully it's just an issue with mine.

The question in my mind is now this: is this effect related to the secondary image (i.e. 'ghosting') issue? Jeez, I hope that it's related, because if my camera needs a third trip to Canon to make it right, that'll be when I call it enough. 'Lemon Law' or class action lawsuit, if this thing ain't fixed within a year of it's release, something will need to be done, despite how good the camera otherwise is.

[As an aside, my 60" Sony XBR1 SXRD rear-projection TV has a class action settlement going on right now, and it's for a heck of a lot less than this issue with the MkIII. I will likely end up with a brand-new XBR2 (after two strikes of repair attempts) two years after buying it for $4000, so no one should try to say that it can't happen to Canon, too. Oddly, it was a first generation product that, other than the inherent defect in the optical block, gives the finest 1080p HD image out there, bar none. IMHO. ]

Cheers...

-Jeff




Dec 18, 2007 at 09:47 AM
mill4570
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p.8 #8 · ['NEW Fix' UPDATE!] - MkIII AF still broken


Jeff,

The price increase had more to do with dollar / yen exchange rates than anything else. The fact that internet forums were full of "this is what I have been waiting for, I will upgrade my 10D", or "I will pay $5000 if anyone has one" didn't help any. The MKIII was and still is Canon's flag ship sports and PJ camera, the embarresment and lost sales this will cost Canon will be much more than $500. 2007 was a special year for Canon and they intrduced what they thought was a revolutionary product, and it failed. People outside Canon will never know the full impact or the fall out. Some engineers and execs will loose their jobs over this if it makes anyone feel better. It is foolishness to think Canon would release this camera marked up $500 to cover future repair and litigation cost.

As to the issue you have with images, the fact that something else may be wrong with the MKIII is most interesting. I have seen what you are talking about with my MKIII more so than AF issues. It is difficult to describe and I chalked it up to lens issues, but maybe not.

Richard K.



Dec 18, 2007 at 11:13 AM
Jeff
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p.8 #9 · ['NEW Fix' UPDATE!] - MkIII AF still broken


I originally chalked it up to 'figments of my imagination', but after taking a critical look at both my 1D MkIII and 1Ds (MkI) images, I'm now completely convinced otherwise. It's not normal, and not easily explainable (at least by my lowly self) as to a cause. I be purty dang sure it ain't my fault, dag'nabbit...


Dec 18, 2007 at 11:36 AM
mill4570
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p.8 #10 · ['NEW Fix' UPDATE!] - MkIII AF still broken


Jeff,

You said you had an image at home you would post that better indicates the problem. Please do, I would be very interested in seeing it.

Thanks in Advance,
Richard K.



Dec 18, 2007 at 11:49 AM
Jeff
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p.8 #11 · ['NEW Fix' UPDATE!] - MkIII AF still broken


I will tonight, I promise, as currently:

https://www.fredmiranda.com/hosting-data//3590/8393xscuseless.gif

-Jeff



Dec 18, 2007 at 11:55 AM
R Longenbach
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p.8 #12 · ['NEW Fix' UPDATE!] - MkIII AF still broken


hahahah that's funny Jeff!


Dec 18, 2007 at 12:54 PM
Jeff
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p.8 #13 · ['NEW Fix' UPDATE!] - MkIII AF still broken


OK, here it is. I have more where this one came from...







Dec 18, 2007 at 09:57 PM
Wickedfn4u
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p.8 #14 · ['NEW Fix' UPDATE!] - MkIII AF still broken


Are you sure you set your custom functions right


Dec 18, 2007 at 10:17 PM
Jeff
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p.8 #15 · ['NEW Fix' UPDATE!] - MkIII AF still broken


And another example, they're pretty easy to find...

Edited by Jeff on Dec 18, 2007 at 09:09 PM GMT







Dec 18, 2007 at 10:53 PM
Jeff
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p.8 #16 · ['NEW Fix' UPDATE!] - MkIII AF still broken


Normcar21 wrote:
The four scope thing appears a bit confusing to me. The right frame is on the right, and is clearly in focus, the remainder are a touch oof, so this means?


I'm not sure exactly what your question is, but clearly the right edge of these images is the 'most' in focus, and gets progressively more out of focus as you move toward the left edge of the frame. Regardless of (what should be the proper) focal plane.

It simply doesn't make any sense. And, if that's just a 'touch' out of focus, I can fully see why you didn't entertain the notion of your camera having any problems up until recently.



Dec 18, 2007 at 11:04 PM
Jeff
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p.8 #17 · ['NEW Fix' UPDATE!] - MkIII AF still broken


Normcar21 wrote:
depth of focus explains it unless all of these points of interest were on the exact same focal plane. Am I missing something here? One point will be majorly in focus, the point that is grabbed by the camera. Everything else will be, well, not within the focal area. That's all that I see in the above shots, points either in or out, and only one plane is "in" focus


There is simply no way that where the orange line meets the left edge of the frame is the same distance to the camera as the point where it meets the right edge of the frame. No possible way.



Dec 18, 2007 at 11:10 PM
Jeff
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p.8 #18 · ['NEW Fix' UPDATE!] - MkIII AF still broken


Have you ever in your life used a view camera? A tilt-shift lens? If the MkIII were a view camera, this would make perfect sense, but it isn't, and thus it doesn't.

Norm, how's about you just 'leave it'? I don't really have too much interest in discussing this with you, for obvious reasons.




Dec 18, 2007 at 11:14 PM
Wickedfn4u
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p.8 #19 · ['NEW Fix' UPDATE!] - MkIII AF still broken


I think he is just trying to up his post count Jeff.


Dec 18, 2007 at 11:15 PM
python2000
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p.8 #20 · ['NEW Fix' UPDATE!] - MkIII AF still broken


Jeff, based on your focusing and focal length what would you estimate the depth of field to be on your latter sage-brush shot? I also would like to see the loupes again but this time on bushes a bit closer to the camera.


Dec 18, 2007 at 11:27 PM
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