I am looking into purchasing a zoom lens for my backcountry expeditions and snowboarding pictures.
I have been debating on the 70-200 f2.8 or the f4. The main question is that since the snow is so reflective, is it necessary to go for the quicker glass?
Also, is it worth considering the newer IS versions (if I will be using a monopod,etc.) , when the first gen. are selling for $400 now?
Comments and suggestions are very much appreciated.
The snow is probably not your subject, so for the fact that it might be blown out in proportion to your subject is not a matter of lens aperture - just proper exposure reading.of your subject.
What f/2.8 gets you over f/4 is less depth of field. That can be a good thing, or a bad thing - depending on your camera, subject and style. And with that extra stop - will you ever need/want it for other subjects: lower light situations?
IS only has the ability to grant the photographer some leeway from hand hold shake/vibration. It can allow you to shoot 1-2 (3?) stops slower in shutter speed and overcome the shooters ability to hold the camera still over that time.
What this is good for is again, low light situations and/or panning shots. Otherwise, most intent when shooting sports is to get a faster shutter speed - IS doesn't do that, aperture and ISO do.
Personally I love my 70-200/2.8 IS, it is fast, has a wide aperture, lovely bokeh and IS when I need it. I prefer having 2.8 even though I don't always use it, the same can be said of IS.
For you, weight might be more of an issue so the 70-200/4 IS might be a better choice, ok you lose a bit of DoF but the exposures in snow are going to be challenging enough to keep you busy and for the pictures you are looking for there probably isn't going to be much difference between f2.8 and f4. Just my 2p worth.
I find the 70-200 works great for the snowboarding, but also I love to get really close up on the jumps with super wides like the 15mm fish and 16-35. The unique angles, starburst sun and saturation of color from shooting so close seem to have a lot more interest than the far away tight cropped shots from the 70-200. That's my opinion though.
As Hammy said...the reflective nature of snow is all about getting the exposure correct, and not about faster lenses.
IS will help some if your hand-holding all the time. I hand hold mostly in the snow as I try to keep my gear light. I also will bump up to ISO 400 or even 800 in a blizzard if I have to, in order to maintain faster shutter if that's the look I am wanting that day.
I'm a skier/climber as well. I would say that if you're doing actions shots (IE - skiing/boarding), the IS probably isn't worth it due to the speed of the athletes. If you're doing mountaineering/rock climbing I've lately been reading that a 25-70 lens or something of that nature is pretty good for everything.
The 70-200 f/4 is MUCH lighter and more compact than the f/2.8. I'd save some money and get the 70-200 f/4 NON IS. And a wide angle lens sounds great too. I'll bet you can catch some awesome shots with a WA.
My main lens for ski and snowboard photography (as well as most anything else) is the 70-200 2.8L IS. This lens is on be camera about 80% of the time. The f4 version I'm sure is a great lens and you can't go wrong with either lens. Most of the photos on my website have been taken with the 70-200. Feel free to check out the results. Camera used for the photos are a 1D and a 1D MKII. Still waiting for Canon to come up with a fix for my MKIII!?!?! Hope the photos and info help you.
I have a question to pipe in. What bag are you folks using in the snow? I have the Burton Zoom Pack. Wondering if there is something better out there. It doesn't seem deep enough for a 30D with the grip attached.
I just got a Dakine camera pouch that is deep enough for the 1D MK II and several lenses. I'm thinking of using it in the Burton Distortion "skateboarding" bag.
Back to the question, if you can carry the weight then the 70-200/2.8 is the one to get, otherwise the f4 will do. I assume you will not shoot at f2.8 much and most of the time you'll be outside in pretty good light.
A 70-200/f4 and a 10-22 Tokina 12-24/Sigma 10-20 sound great.
DubRepublic wrote:
I have a question to pipe in. What bag are you folks using in the snow? I have the Burton Zoom Pack. Wondering if there is something better out there. It doesn't seem deep enough for a 30D with the grip attached.
I used to use a dakine sequence, but now use an Osprey pack that I had modified. Currently I am product testing a new line of bags by a new company called Fstop. They look promissing.
Lens for snow or mountaineering? Hmmm...I have never really thought of it that way.
To start, I do that kind of work for a full time living. I have used any and all combinations of any of my 24 lenses or 8 camera bodies inbounds, in the back country or what ever have you.
I often use a 70-200 2.8 with or without a converter for ski / snowboard shots. If I am climbing a ton, I use a 16-35 and a 85 1.8 in combo or if I want to go real light in super cold weather in which I will be mostly climbing and only pulling the camera out for the money shot, I use either a Leica M6 with a 28/2 and 50/1.4 or a Nikon FM3A with a 20/3.5, 45/2.8 and 105/2.5.
I have also used a Fuji GSW690III, Hasselblad Xpan and other gear for snow and mountaineering.
This season, my D3 and D300 will replace the Canon line up as a perfect tandem setup for using with the FM3A rigs....finally, the right system again..:-)
So you see, snow does not matter, mountaineering does not matter, the image you want to make is what matters.
mtbakerskier wrote:
I used to use a dakine sequence, but now use an Osprey pack that I had modified. Currently I am product testing a new line of bags by a new company called Fstop. They look promissing.
Lets hope they have room for avi gear, food, first aid kit, water, clothing, etc. Out of the possible 14 packs I will put camera gear in, only two are Lowe-pro type, photo nerd only type packs. It's like these guys make packs thinking that all we ever need out there is camera gear.
For what it is worth, I just did 6 peaks in the San Juans and Sangre De Cristio ranges. I used a sweet new Osprey Talus 33 litre. I had a full 100 oz. camelbak, harness, runners, other climbing gear, clothing and my two lens, one camera set up easily reachable and pulled from my handy home made semi-padded stuff sacks.
When it comes to packs from photo companies that I can actually use for all my needed gear, I will believe it when I see it....
Film_Ruled wrote:
Lets hope they have room for avi gear, food, first aid kit, water, clothing, etc. Out of the possible 14 packs I will put camera gear in, only two are Lowe-pro type, photo nerd only type packs. It's like these guys make packs thinking that all we ever need out there is camera gear.
Thats why the Dakine Sequence is the industry standard for ski photogs. You can carry a full load of camera gear plus all of your avy safety gear in addition to an extra layer or two and h20 and food.
The lowe-pro bags suck for skiing as they are not designed to ski very well and are not very durable.
I shoot a lot of alpine ski racing. My favorite lenses for that are the 70-200 f/4 and the 135 f/2.
Size is a big issue if you intend on doing a lot of skiing at the same time. The f/2.8 version of the 70-200 is just too big and heavy. I've never missed f/2.8 on the race course. In fact, it is hard enough to deal with all the light with all that snow around on a sunny day.
I've looked at the DaKine Sequence and don't really care for it. The big problem if you are shooting where it is steep and slippery is taking the bag off and then watching it want to take off downhill.
There really isn't anything good (bag-wise) and that probably is reflected in the DaKine's popularity. However, the new LowePro Primus is probably the perfect bag to date for this since you can access the camera without having to take it off and put it down. I'm going to pick one of these up this fall before the snow flies. Failing that, the Think Tank Photo Changeup should be excellent as well.
JohnJ80 wrote:
I shoot a lot of alpine ski racing. My favorite lenses for that are the 70-200 f/4 and the 135 f/2.
Size is a big issue if you intend on doing a lot of skiing at the same time. The f/2.8 version of the 70-200 is just too big and heavy. I've never missed f/2.8 on the race course. In fact, it is hard enough to deal with all the light with all that snow around on a sunny day.
I've looked at the DaKine Sequence and don't really care for it. The big problem if you are shooting where it is steep and slippery is taking the bag off and then watching it want to take off downhill.
There really isn't anything good (bag-wise) and that probably is reflected in the DaKine's popularity. However, the new LowePro Primus is probably the perfect bag to date for this since you can access the camera without having to take it off and put it down. I'm going to pick one of these up this fall before the snow flies. Failing that, the Think Tank Photo Changeup should be excellent as well.
I dont know of a SINGLE photographer that is regularly working with the larger ski mags that use the F4 version..... That says a lot to me.
Secondly, the Lowe-pro packs dont ski very well, and do not have any room for avy geat etc... Secondly taking the dakine pack off on a steep slope isnt much of an issue at all. Just takes a bit of cordination.
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