p.1 #1 · macOS storage demands: Capture One Pro and RAW still photography
Here's a question for more experienced Mac photographers. When shopping for a Mac mini, is there any chance that 256 GB of storage can be enough?
I had a really good time with Aperture back in the day. I haven't had a Mac for over a decade, and I've never used Capture One before. I'm thinking about getting back into RAW instead of only JPEG.
If possible, I'd like to make do with the least expensive Mac mini at 256 GB. Can this cause regret? I don't need to shoot a ton of images, I can be willing to delete, and I can make use of external storage and possibly a remote storage host. I'm not imagining other computing tasks that will demand a great deal of storage.
What do you consider to be minimum storage for a casual Capture One Pro workflow?
p.1 #2 · macOS storage demands: Capture One Pro and RAW still photography
The issue is having enough room to run the OS, apps etc. Of course all photos will be stored on an external but only 256GB SSD is not much these days. The base model is $599 and with only 16gb unified memory. You can probably get by but I would not buy any computer these days with anything less than 512GB of internal storage. The base model does not include the M4-Pro chip so internal pathway processing is also further limited.
As I indicated what you are wanting to do will work but it will not provide the muscle going forward. You can't upgrade the internal RAM or CPU so going with this box makes it kind of a one and done solution that will not grow with you as your photography journey continues. If I was to suggest a Mac mini to someone who is a photographer (not a pro or accomplished amateur) it would be the Mini M4 Pro with 32GB unified memory and 512GB SSD. This unit will provide good service to a progressing photographer for a number of years. JMTC
p.1 #3 · macOS storage demands: Capture One Pro and RAW still photography
schlotz wrote:
If I was to suggest a Mac mini to someone who is a photographer (not a pro or accomplished amateur) it would be the Mini M4 Pro with 32GB unified memory and 512GB SSD. This unit will provide good service to a progressing photographer for a number of years.
Thanks. I might be a little stubborn because I got by fine with the very cheapest new MacBook hardware a couple decades ago. It's hard to imagine that a base Mac mini isn't enough for a casual photographer now. But that's why I'm here asking the question!
p.1 #4 · macOS storage demands: Capture One Pro and RAW still photography
IMO, NO! 512 is mininmal/marginal, 1TB is better. I would also reco 32 gb ram min for operational convenience. The additional ssd space and ram will probably add a good 2 years of future proofing as well.
p.1 #5 · macOS storage demands: Capture One Pro and RAW still photography
Capture One lets you keep the raw images themselves elsewhere than in the main “catalogue”. For example, you could put those on one or more external SSDs and keep the catalogue on the Mac’s internal SSD. Capture One gives you the choice of whether to copy the raw files “into” the catalogue or leave them in place; if you leave them in place you can use Capture One to move them around your storage afterwards.
The catalogue is actually a folder which has a SQLite database file which keeps track of everything, various data files for masks etc., but unfortunately also thumbnails and previews, which will increase the size. I estimate you need ~2.5GB per thousand 24Mpx raw images just for the catalogue, not the images themselves.
Use APFS for any external SSD, not exFAT, which lacks journalling. A live SQLite database on an exFAT drive is IMO a ticking time bomb. Reserve exFAT for when you actually need interchange with Windows or other systems.
Apple sells base Macs to people who do little other than check their Facebook and email. You are not in that category.
p.1 #6 · macOS storage demands: Capture One Pro and RAW still photography
First of all, in C1 you have two options: keep all in one database (Catalogue) or organize a separate folders for anything you want (time periods, different shooting sessions, whatever) called Sessions.
With sessions of course you lose global search among the images etc. but ypu can keep it on separate external drives (even cloud ones) and all RAW conversion settings are stored beside the original files in some sidecar folders. Of course Catalogue can be also stored externally.
So, working on low-inner-storage computer or between two or threes (i.e. laptop and desktop and so on) is usually more convenient via Session system.
Perosnally I've never used C1 Catalogue option - when it was introduced I had already thouthands of picture arranged on external drives (where I moved it after finishing working) like YEARMONTHSESSION NAME or PURPOSE or TOPIC. When I tried to feed some select year (may be half-terabate) to C1 it stuck and I gave up that idea.
p.1 #7 · macOS storage demands: Capture One Pro and RAW still photography
Sessions is more for wedding or commercial photographers, where there’s a defined shoot and when done and delivered it can all be moved to a cold archive somewhere. Also, the tethering functions used on high end commercial shoots are well integrated into sessions.
Catalogues is more for personal projects, amateurs, professional travel or wildlife photographers who sell and publish from a substantial back-catalogue, museums etc.
Obviously loading 5,000 images at once isn’t going to be immediate (this translates into 20,000 file creations/deletions, before you even generate previews). Choose a session or catalogue based on your use case, not short-term performance on the initial load.
p.1 #8 · macOS storage demands: Capture One Pro and RAW still photography
melcat wrote:
Capture One lets you keep the raw images themselves elsewhere than in the main “catalogue”. For example, you could put those on one or more external SSDs and keep the catalogue on the Mac’s internal SSD. Capture One gives you the choice of whether to copy the raw files “into” the catalogue or leave them in place; if you leave them in place you can use Capture One to move them around your storage afterwards.
The catalogue is actually a folder which has a SQLite database file which keeps track of everything, various data files for masks etc., but unfortunately also thumbnails and previews, which will increase the size. I estimate you need ~2.5GB per thousand 24Mpx raw images just for the catalogue, not the images themselves.
Use APFS for any external SSD, not exFAT, which lacks journalling. A live SQLite database on an exFAT drive is IMO a ticking time bomb. Reserve exFAT for when you actually need interchange with Windows or other systems.
Apple sells base Macs to people who do little other than check their Facebook and email. You are not in that category....Show more →
I use exFAT to save images to external drives also use an SSD to work on images from camera, I do transfer files over to PC for backup on dropbox
Is this an issue, should I be using APFS on my external storage drives and just use exFAT on external SSD working drive ?
p.1 #9 · macOS storage demands: Capture One Pro and RAW still photography
350lcpete wrote:
Is this an issue, should I be using APFS on my external storage drives and just use exFAT on external SSD working drive ?
You should not put a Capture One catalogue on an exFAT drive, which does not protect itself against corruption the way modern file systems like APFS (Apple), NTFS (Windows) or ext4 (Linux) do. This is because the catalogue contains a SQLite database, which creates a temporary file while a database transaction is active, and later uses the absence of that file to infer that the transaction completed.
The reason I warned the OP against using exFAT at all was that, although it might be OK for just the raws, if they later run short of space on the internal SSD they might take the apparently reasonable step of then moving the catalogue too to the external drive. At that point they should reformat it as APFS, but they already are low on space on the internal SSD, so would need to go buy another SSD to do the copy. Much better to start with APFS from the start.
Anyway, if it’s affordable it’s a whole lot easier to just get a big internal SSD.
p.1 #10 · macOS storage demands: Capture One Pro and RAW still photography
Rainbow Chaser wrote:
Thanks. I might be a little stubborn because I got by fine with the very cheapest new MacBook hardware a couple decades ago. It's hard to imagine that a base Mac mini isn't enough for a casual photographer now. But that's why I'm here asking the question!
A couple of decades ago in the computer industry is beyond ancient. Both equipment (computers, cameras) and apps have progressed in multiple orders of magnitude. I did say the base mac mini would work but it barely supports today's requirements given both the size of camera files and the processing capability of edit apps like Capture One, Lightroom & Photo Shop. IMO it's being penny wise and pound foolish.
p.1 #11 · macOS storage demands: Capture One Pro and RAW still photography
I have a new Mac Studio and I'm using about 100GB for the system + applications and 400gb for my user directory. This is on a 1TB drive. Past computers, I was close to filling out the 1TB ssd but I cleaned out some crap when I migrated. My library of images (about 10TB) is on an external DAS.
I would consider 1TB the minimum I would recommend to anyone. Yes you can get by on less or you can buy fast external TB NVME drives but I think having such a small main drive will ultimately be a hassle.
In addition, the smaller internal SSDs are slower. If I recall correctly, they have 1/2 the bandwidth. Something like 2-3 GB/s vs 5-6 GB/s. I don't remember if the 512 GB are slower but it does affect the 256GB versions.
p.1 #12 · macOS storage demands: Capture One Pro and RAW still photography
The storage space in your computer means very little, I have redundant external drives that I store my RAW files on with Capture One Sessions. Once the images have been backed up, edited and delivered I delete them from the computer. I've always purchased fast computers with more than average RAM and 500GB storage, it's temporary storage.
p.1 #13 · macOS storage demands: Capture One Pro and RAW still photography
Maybe my AI is hallucinating again, but it's telling me a base-level Mac mini will outperform a far more expensive (not base-level) Windows-based Z2 Mini G1a workstation for Capture One Pro. This answer surprises me given some of the comments in this thread.
p.1 #14 · macOS storage demands: Capture One Pro and RAW still photography
Apple M series chipped machines that came about in 2021 really outperformed the Intel based machines. Since then I believe that gap has shrunk some as Intel continues in it's attempt to catch up. What's different now vs back in Jan when you first posted is that the actual base mini configuration is no longer available. Believe the lowest config now available is the M4 (not Pro), 16GB ram and 512GB SSD @ $799 + tax. To that you will still need a monitor, keyboard and mouse/trackpad, so there's more $$ to add to the total cost. Can this serve to edit photos on, yes but I wouldn't suggest it given the current status of today's ram hungry eating apps and the size of camera files. Going forward those issues are most likely to get worse.
Yeah I know, things like this always seem to come down to the dollars involved. If it just has to be a mini my suggestion is to get the M4 Pro with at least 24GB of RAM (32BG is better).
p.1 #15 · macOS storage demands: Capture One Pro and RAW still photography
I use Capture One Pro 20 with AMD Phenom II 945 X4, 8GB 1333MHz DDR3, 1GB AMD Radeon 7850. Base Mac Mini should be more than enough for Capture One, unless you are editing very high MP files, or your workflow requires lots of other programs running simultaneously. Capture One themselves state 8GB RAM and first gen Intel i3 as the minimum, so don't let anyone fool you into thinking you need 32GB RAM or M4 Pro.
p.1 #16 · macOS storage demands: Capture One Pro and RAW still photography
I use Capture One on a MacBook Pro with a built in 2TB SSD. I thought that was enough, and it is certainly serviceable, but I wish I had gone for the 4TB so I could keep more files locally. So IMO 0.25TB is nowhere near enough.
I offload all my processed image raw files on to a NAS, but you will need to keep any production files and the catalog itself on your local SSD for speed reasons. I have 66.5k photos in my C1 catalog and the catalog file itself is 229.92GB, so a bit higher than melcat's 2.5GB/1000 photos estimate at 3.5GB/1000 photos (a mix of files from 16 to 61 MP cameras over the years). I could very easily take up 300 GB just with my catalog and production image files.... On top of that, you always want to leave some space free on your internal SSD to avoid slowing the computer down.
You certainly don't need all the processing power of the M4 chip for casual photos so I'd say your money would be much better spent on a used M1/2/3 machine with more built-in storage.
p.1 #18 · macOS storage demands: Capture One Pro and RAW still photography
Hi Rainbow, I went down the road you are now. I was stuck between the min Mac and the studio, my choice was the studio with a up grade to 1TB internal drive.
Now the reason why the studio.
Ethernet connection would need to up grade on the mini. Since I'm using my own NAS for storage.
Video core speed, was not an obligation since I don't shot any video. But it's there
And a few more.
For sure 1TB minimum even if you using a NAS for storage need the space has a scratsh drive if running Photoshop plus it's nice to freedom of space.
p.1 #19 · macOS storage demands: Capture One Pro and RAW still photography
This sounds lazy and unnecassary to me, why do you keep so many RAW files on your primary machine? No one needs that many images and should be offloaded to an NAS or multiple external drives, it sounds like an NAS would work well for you. In my thirty plus year career, I've only kept RAW files on my primary machine long enough to cull, back up and then for a client to make their selects.
p.1 #20 · macOS storage demands: Capture One Pro and RAW still photography
This sounds lazy and unnecassary to me, why do you keep so many RAW files on your primary machine? No one needs that many images and should be offloaded to an NAS or multiple external drives, it sounds like an NAS would work well for you. In my thirty plus year career, I've only kept RAW files on my primary machine long enough to cull, back up and then for a client to make their selects.
