I am looking into getting a Leica Summicron-M 50mm and would like to get thoughts on V4 vs V5. While both have the same optical formula, are there any differences in the coatings or anything else that would result in a different rendering/color/flare? Also, I would appreciate input on use in terms of handling between the two as there are some differences (shape, focus tab, hood).
I have a extremely well kept version four. I am tremendously dissatisfied with the coatings. With the sun in the frame and or other strong source of light the ghosting is very significant. This restricts also its usage in night photography. I like the rendering though. It is small too.
My advice, having also the Loxia 50/f2 which is the same optics as ZM 50/f2: get the Zeiss. But this is only me. Of course YMMV.
I have the Leica 50/2.0 M Version V. Great lens optically, very sharp, beautiful bokeh. My lens copy has a quite wobbly internal hood element which also is easily pushed back inside while carrying camera and lens. I read that this is a known issue with Version V, and Leica can fix it and make it stiffer. Not sending my copy in to pay $$$ to have it fixed though. It's my only Leica M lens with internal protruding hood element, and I am not thrilled by it. I rather have the hood being separate.
hanay78 wrote:
I have a extremely well kept version four. I am tremendously dissatisfied with the coatings. With the sun in the frame and or other strong source of light the ghosting is very significant. This restricts also its usage in night photography. I like the rendering though. It is small too.
My advice, having also the Loxia 50/f2 which is the same optics as ZM 50/f2: get the Zeiss. But this is only me. Of course YMMV.
The ghosting is something that I have seen mentioned in discussions about the Summicron. Certainly something to take into account. It is a shame that it does not perform better in that regard. Thanks too for the suggestion of the Zeiss - I had not considered it and will look into it. I have a Sonnar 50/1.5 but it is really quite a different lens from the Planar.
In looking at used lenses online, it also seems that v4 may have some issue with haze/de-lamination. I have no idea if that problem was addressed in V5 or not, but I have not seen as many V5's with it in what I have seen so far on the used market.
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retrofocus wrote:
I have the Leica 50/2.0 M Version V. Great lens optically, very sharp, beautiful bokeh. My lens copy has a quite wobbly internal hood element which also is easily pushed back inside while carrying camera and lens. I read that this is a known issue with Version V, and Leica can fix it and make it stiffer. Not sending my copy in to pay $$$ to have it fixed though. It's my only Leica M lens with internal protruding hood element, and I am not thrilled by it. I rather have the hood being separate.
Thanks for mentioning this issue with the built-in hood. I wonder if Leica has taken care of that problem with later serial numbers of not. Like you, I would not pay big bucks to have it fixed either. I don't know how annoying that problem would be for me, but it certainly would be to some degree. It is such a nice lens that it might be worthwhile to deal with the problem if it crops up.
Abuttolph wrote:
The ghosting is something that I have seen mentioned in discussions about the Summicron. Certainly something to take into account. It is a shame that it does not perform better in that regard. Thanks too for the suggestion of the Zeiss - I had not considered it and will look into it. I have a Sonnar 50/1.5 but it is really quite a different lens from the Planar.
In looking at used lenses online, it also seems that v4 may have some issue with haze/de-lamination. I have no idea if that problem was addressed in V5 or not, but I have not seen as many V5's with it in what I have seen so far on the used market.
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Thanks for mentioning this issue with the built-in hood. I wonder if Leica has taken care of that problem with later serial numbers of not. Like you, I would not pay big bucks to have it fixed either. I don't know how annoying that problem would be for me, but it certainly would be to some degree. It is such a nice lens that it might be worthwhile to deal with the problem if it crops up.
I bought my 50/2.0 Vers. V in silver chrome used for $1500 in 2014. The price has not changed since - this kind of lens goes for about the same value since more than 10 years now. Where most other Leica lenses I own saw some kind of value increase over time, this one did not. It is a great lens optically, but I also believe it flies a bit under the radar. It might have to do that since other manufacturers like Cosina-Voigtlander released great 50 mm M lens options, and that influencers try to lure people into 50 mm Summilux versions.
retrofocus wrote:
I bought my 50/2.0 Vers. V in silver chrome used for $1500 in 2014. The price has not changed since - this kind of lens goes for about the same value since more than 10 years now. Where most other Leica lenses I own saw some kind of value increase over time, this one did not. It is a great lens optically, but I also believe it flies a bit under the radar. It might have to do that since other manufacturers like Cosina-Voigtlander released great 50 mm M lens options, and that influencers try to lure people into 50 mm Summilux versions. ...Show more →
It is interesting that the lens does not appreciate with time. In fact, with the decline in buying power of the dollar, it actually depreciates in actual value. You may well be right about the competition and the push toward the higher-cost summilux versions. Many of the v5 summicrons are going for >$1500 online and often are not in perfect condition either. The best value can be had here on FM it seems where people don't have to pay an auction site fee or for the overhead at photo stores that sell used gear.
Abuttolph wrote:
It is interesting that the lens does not appreciate with time. In fact, with the decline in buying power of the dollar, it actually depreciates in actual value. You may well be right about the competition and the push toward the higher-cost summilux versions. Many of the v5 summicrons are going for >$1500 online and often are not in perfect condition either. The best value can be had here on FM it seems where people don't have to pay an auction site fee or for the overhead at photo stores that sell used gear.
+1. Depends on your purpose of this lens, but if I would be shopping for a 50 mm M-lens now, I would narrow it to these two options:
Voigtlander 50/1.2 Nokton M
Voigtlander 50/2.0 APO Lanthar M
retrofocus wrote:
+1. Depends on your purpose of this lens, but if I would be shopping for a 50 mm M-lens now, I would narrow it to these two options:
Voigtlander 50/1.2 Nokton M
Voigtlander 50/2.0 APO Lanthar M
Both excellent lenses. I have an older version of the Nokton 50/1.2 and absolutely love it. Interestingly, I just put my Sony mount APO-Lanthar 50 up for sale because I have so much trouble with manual focus on my Sony and find it much easier with Leica bodies. My idea with the Summicron was to have a lighter and smaller lens for when I don't need the faster options, plus I really like the rendering of the Summicron. Looking at the recommended Zeiss 50//2 as well, as recommended above in this thread.
Abuttolph wrote:
Both excellent lenses. I have an older version of the Nokton 50/1.2 and absolutely love it. Interestingly, I just put my Sony mount APO-Lanthar 50 up for sale because I have so much trouble with manual focus on my Sony and find it much easier with Leica bodies. My idea with the Summicron was to have a lighter and smaller lens for when I don't need the faster options, plus I really like the rendering of the Summicron. Looking at the recommended Zeiss 50//2 as well, as recommended above in this thread.
Forgot to mention the newer CV 50/1.5 II ASPH lens. It is a smaller and more affordable lens but optically excellent, too. Voigtlander has many 50 mm options to select from!
Totally agree on the 50/2.2 Color Skopar recommendation. The v5 Summicron is often lauded for its handling, but I think the Color Skopar handles better. It's smaller, has a focusing tab, and its focus throw is buttery smooth (much, much better than the 50/1.5 II).
That said, if your heart is set on a Summicron, I think the v5 with the built-in hood is the one to have if you don't care about the focus tab. It's also easier to find a clean v5 since they're newer.
There are 50mm Summicron-M lenses (vIV) with focus tab if that's part of your (OP) search. I've tested every series (v) of Summicron from ii through VI and they're all extremely close in output. After making sure there's no big dust, oil, haze, fungus in the lens - getting the best deal on a clean lens has always been my search criteria. Read this if you want to compare Leica 50mm lenses; https://www.kenrockwell.com/leica/50mm-summicron-comparison-table.htm
I can’t compare to v5, because I have only had v4, but mine has been a champ. It is easily my single most reliable lens for shooting landscape panos, because of its high degree of correction. I have not had issues with flare mentioned above, and I shoot a lot of landscapes. That said, I also have not really tried to shoot into the sun. I shoot Sony bodies but don’t have reason to believe flaring would be more prevalent on M bodies. The sun is behind a cloud in the foreground in this multi-shot pano and did not cause flare issues, for instance.
Looks like there might be just a few screws in the front of the lens so you could tighten it yourself to save some money? I agree it is an annoying issue
The only differences of note between the v4 and v5 Summicron are ergonomic - focus tab vs built in hood. It's possible coatings may have slightly changed over the years, but flare performance on the v4 and v5 is very similar, if not identical, in it's mediocre performance. For both you will want to use a lens hood.
Personally I use a v4 Summicron with a Squarehood for it's sleeker design vs the original plastic clip on hood. Flare is a non issue with either lens hood.
While I love the v4 for its excellent ergonomics and a great rendering, there are plenty of cheaper and/or better options out there. Zeiss has the Planar f/2 and Voigtlander has a several different options like the Apo Lanthar f/2, Color-Skopar f/2.2, and others. Within Leica there's also the Apo-Summicron f/2, Sumarrit f/2.4 or f/2.5, Elmar-M f/2.8 collapsible, etc as options.
DenverSteve wrote:
There are 50mm Summicron-M lenses (vIV) with focus tab if that's part of your (OP) search. I've tested every series (v) of Summicron from ii through VI and they're all extremely close in output. After making sure there's no big dust, oil, haze, fungus in the lens - getting the best deal on a clean lens has always been my search criteria. Read this if you want to compare Leica 50mm lenses; https://www.kenrockwell.com/leica/50mm-summicron-comparison-table.htm
I own two 50 mm Summicron lenses - the already mentioned Version V and the vintage 50/2.0 dual range lens. The latter is my favorite with one downside that it does not work for infinity attached to my M 240 based cameras (there are described methods to make it work, but they all require filing off some metal part which I dislike to do).
I have the Cron V5, CV 50 2.2, CV 50 1.5II, Cron DR, Lux Asph etc
The Cron V5 is the most delightful lens to use from a handling/haptic sense. Focus throw is crazy smooth and just the right length - fast but not too fast. Size is perfect - small but not too small to make it awkward.
Handling is better than any of the other lenses - even the CV 2.2.
But the biggest flaw is that it flares/ghosts badly. Or goodly depending if you want flare! The CV 50 2.2. is much much better for that. And is a very sweet lens too.
