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Speculation time: Sony a7V body design and...

  
 
patotts
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p.1 #1 · Speculation time: Sony a7V body design and...


Intro/Context (feel free to skip)
I visited the "Salon de la Photo", the big annual photo show/exhibition in Paris, France. It runs for 4 days, tons of lectures and interviews (all in French though), and retailers are there offering special deals (e.g. I got 30% off a Shimoda Side Street 28 I've been meaning to buy anyhow).

I had the chance to play around this stunning combo - the a1 II with the new 28-70/2.0. If I had the cash, I would run and buy one right away, even if I don't need/would use 89.9% of the features of the A1 II.



Main question:
After trying the Sony a1 II and the a9 III it finally feels like the body design I always hoped Sony would build - it finally fits my fairly large hands comfortably and feels natural in the hands - much like my old Nikons always did (and to some extent Canon R5/II, but let's not go there). Shooting it next to an a7RV body, which I have years of experience with, still feels like a big step back. I know, I know, I'm being overly picky, but I do care about these things.

So the key question is: do you think the upcoming a7V (November announcement?) will have the new "pro body design" as the a1II and a9 III? Or will they differentiate and keep the mid-level/hybrid A7 line of cameras the same?

Being in tech, I humored myself with some ChatGPT Plus and Gemini (can you tell that my wife and kids are out of town this weekend?), both of them - after some pretty extensive prompting - both came to the same conclusion that the a7V will maintain the same a7IV type of square-ish box with sharp-ish corners. Yes, it will feature a 4-flippy screen and a new sensor with faster read-out speed, offering either a 33 MP or 44 MP sensor, depending on sources, more FPS, and no crop 60 fps video, among other improvements, but no real body change.

But what I really want as the a1 II body in a much less capable camera below $3,000. I don't need 30 fps. I would love 40-50 MP, but I'm not after the absurd speed, global shutter, or supreme BIF tracking. I just want that new body!

Am I crazy? Is it too much to ask for? You think Sony will offer it?

Or maybe I should just get a Nikon Z6 III, live with the 24MP and slightly worse AF speed/accuracy, but get a body that I really enjoy holding and using...

[bachelor for a weekend rant off]



Oct 11, 2025 at 06:52 AM
Nifty Fifty
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p.1 #2 · Speculation time: Sony a7V body design and...


patotts wrote:
after some pretty extensive prompting - both came to the same conclusion that the a7V will maintain the same a7IV type of square-ish box with sharp-ish corners. Yes, it will feature a 4-flippy screen

According to recent rumors, the a7v will have the same body as the 7rV.




Oct 11, 2025 at 07:50 AM
chiron
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p.1 #3 · Speculation time: Sony a7V body design and...


patotts wrote:
Intro/Context (feel free to skip)
I visited the "Salon de la Photo", the big annual photo show/exhibition in Paris, France. It runs for 4 days, tons of lectures and interviews (all in French though), and retailers are there offering special deals (e.g. I got 30% off a Shimoda Side Street 28 I've been meaning to buy anyhow).

I had the chance to play around this stunning combo - the a1 II with the new 28-70/2.0. If I had the cash, I would run and buy one right away, even if I don't need/would use 89.9% of the features of the A1
...Show more

At this point, anyone who knows isn't talking. My own preference, different from yours, is for smaller bodies. Sony seems unlikely to make radical changes in body design, so something like the A7RV body seems the most likely. Maybe tweaked a little smaller? I think that Sony has lately shown an interest in smaller bodies, as with the A7Cxx series and the RX1R III. For cameras aimed primarily at pros, for sports or for birds, the larger bodies are probably more desired, and Sony's recent f2.0 zooms probably are more comfortable on a large body. For enthusiast use in other areas, Sony might be continuing to think in terms of smaller bodies that are very portable and that provide an alternative to iPhones.

The camera I am waiting for is a smaller (A7Cxx-size) stacked-sensor body, which I hope will be what the A7CIIIxx cameras turn out to be. I don't hold out much hope that the A7V will be that camera.



Oct 11, 2025 at 08:07 AM
patotts
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p.1 #4 · Speculation time: Sony a7V body design and...


I have been using the a7CII for half a year, and despite enjoying its smaller body size with lenses like the 40/2.5 and the 24-50/2.8, I find myself displeased with the combo. Yes, it is smaller than the A7RIV I used to shoot, but it is not small enough to fit in a jacket pocket, like the Ricoh GRIV. So, you'll still need to bring a sling or a bag. Secondly, the EVF is so small and dark that I had to adjust to shooting from the back LCD and relying on the excellent AI-drive-in AF. But that is like shooting with my iPhone I've come to realize. There is a lack of connection between me and truly viewing the subject, the decisive moment, etc. I'm just holding up the a7CII and snapping away. Sure, it works a lot of the time, but not the type of photography I truly enjoy. And the body and controls are small and fiddly for my somewhat large hands.

I hear what you are saying for the move towards smaller bodies, but not where I want to go, I realize, at least not too small.

What I really want, as explained above, is a Sony body like the a1 II at $2,500-$3,000, or Sony tech inside a Nikon Z6 III type body. Heck, even the upcoming Canon R6 III might be the answer, but I don't love a lot of the Canon glass (and closed mount philosophy)

But as we all know, there is no perfect camera/tool.



Oct 11, 2025 at 08:32 AM
tctmp
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p.1 #5 · Speculation time: Sony a7V body design and...


Regarding same body design, does that include the left dial? I'm pretty sure it won't. So I wouldn't call it same body design in that case.

I'm waiting to see if it will include pre-capture raw. I think pre-capture jpg should be a given considering everyone else already have it. Now Canon R6II/III have pre-capture raw, I wonder if Sony will match that. Maybe that's what holding them up for so long.



Oct 11, 2025 at 10:27 AM
chiron
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p.1 #6 · Speculation time: Sony a7V body design and...


patotts wrote:
I have been using the a7CII for half a year, and despite enjoying its smaller body size with lenses like the 40/2.5 and the 24-50/2.8, I find myself displeased with the combo. Yes, it is smaller than the A7RIV I used to shoot, but it is not small enough to fit in a jacket pocket, like the Ricoh GRIV. So, you'll still need to bring a sling or a bag. Secondly, the EVF is so small and dark that I had to adjust to shooting from the back LCD and relying on the excellent AI-drive-in AF. But that is like
...Show more

Yes, the EVF on the A7Cxx bodies is a compromise. I have gotten used to it. I would expect the next iteration to be better.

When I am traveling, I often carry two A7CR bodies, each with a smallish lens on it, usually a Sigma 45 i and 90 i or a 24 i and 65 i. Either kit will fit nicely in a Wotancraft Pilot 7 bag. If I like, two more Sigma lenses will fit in the long slot-pouch along the front of the bag. That gives me, if I want, two cameras and four lenses in a very compact bag that is still light to carry. On the other hand, if I take just one camera and lens to a family gathering, the one camera with a small lens is a very small and unobtrusive kit. I do find that subjects seem to respond to the size of the camera that is pointing at them.

People do have very different preferences in how they like to use their cameras.



Oct 11, 2025 at 10:31 AM
patotts
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p.1 #7 · Speculation time: Sony a7V body design and...


Having mostly used the a7RV since it came out, and having owned the A1 back when it came out, as well as having used the a7IV and a7CII with the same 33MP sensor, I just spent some time going through older photos from older cameras with e.g. 24 MP (I told you guys wife and kids are out of town, the dog is walked and that great take-out burger is finished, so I have too much time on my hands...).

While I certainly got the shots with those cameras, but after having shot higher MP cameras for so long and being spoiled to pixel-peep at 100% (not only the ability to crop if need be, but also double check critical sharpness, etc) I am not keen to take a step backwards to 24MP again. I'd say 40-45 is the sweet spot for me (I loved the a7RIII 42 MP sensor in terms of size). I'm not a landscape, architect or product photographer who really needs the 61MP of the a7RV. It takes up more space than I need, and the hardware has slower processing times. In reality I don't crop much, but it is nice to be able to trim a bit.

I spent some time shooting the Nikon Z6 III with the 24-120/4, 50/1.8S, and the 40/2 lenses today, and have reviewed a couple of hundred files. I could surely live with that combo, but 24 mp felt adequate, the 24-120/4 is a gem I wish Sony offered, the 50/1.8S is a fine, fine lens, but it ain't no 50/1.4 GM (but hey less than half the price of the GM), the little 40/2. is a no brainer. Sweet little package.

I don't want to go back to the a7RV (61mp, body design, slower read-out sensor). Nikon Z6 III is a step sideways. The a7V might be the most sensible move, but one will have to wait and hope. It doesn't seem like I'll ever get the pro-design body I'm craving in the a7V. Jury is out of the Canon R6 III, and switching to a Canon R5II with a couple of lenses would be too expensive. Fudge.

I'd better go find a movie to watch or a book to read before I get too far down this rabbit hole...



Oct 11, 2025 at 02:44 PM
Lukacs
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p.1 #8 · Speculation time: Sony a7V body design and...


I ordered an A7CR after past 3 years it has been several times on my whist list. While normal A7 bodies not that big, but size difference is still significant, especially compared to A7RV. There are more and more excellent small lenses, like Viltrox 50 air.
The most important upgrade for A7 line in A7V is the latest AI AF. A7IV is excellent camera, still competitive, but every single Sony line camera exceeded in AF with the AI chip. As a hobbyst only choice is the A7CII with every C-line limitation.



Oct 11, 2025 at 03:47 PM
Duramaxjon
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p.1 #9 · Speculation time: Sony a7V body design and...


It would be nice if the A7V has slightly better ergonomics but I doubt that it will


Oct 11, 2025 at 04:16 PM
patotts
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p.1 #10 · Speculation time: Sony a7V body design and...


I know we've discussed this before, but there feels like there is a (gaping) hole in Sony's line-up between the enthusiast value play a7III+IV+V (soon), the a7RV is is a MP monster (and first to get AI chip, 4-swivel back LCD, etc) and then a giant leap up to the a1 II which costs 7500 EURO (8,700 USD) or $7,000 + sales tax in the US.

Both the Nikon Z8 and the Canon R5 II are very excellent performers with MSRPs around $4,000 at this point, street prices even lower. Heck, even the Sony a1, which came out in January 2021 still has an MSRP of $6,200 (even if there is a $500 off ending on Monday).

I can't be the only one wanting something near top of the line, with the best body design, to compete with the Z8 and Canon R5 II?

Yeah, yeah, I know. It is all about the lenses... ;-)



Oct 11, 2025 at 04:59 PM
 


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old-gregg
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p.1 #11 · Speculation time: Sony a7V body design and...


patotts wrote:
I can't be the only one wanting something near top of the line, with the best body design, to compete with the Z8 and Canon R5 II?


From the pricing perspective I see where you're coming from. But from the perspective of capabilities, I do not. For context: I own the A7RV, A1 II and Nikon Z8.

Putting the Nikon aside, the bodies of the A1 II and A7RV feel the same. I shake my head when people talk about the "ergonomic upgrade" offered by the A1 II and A9 III. What upgrade? It's the same body with tiny shaping differences. They are so subtle that I had to get different wrist straps to easily identify a body by feel during a photoshoot.

In the AF-S single-shot mode the Sonys and the Z8 are basically identical. The resolution advantage of the R is negligible in practice, and the IQ is essentially the same across all three.

Once you're in the AF-C continuous shooting mode, the R continues to hold its own for far longer than the Internet gives it credit for. It competently tracks focus and maintains a respectable 7fps in lossless RAW mode. This is more than enough for many, may types of moving subjects, and you can bump it to 10fps if 10-bit RAWs are OK (and they are for 99.9% use cases).

And only once you're in the serioiusly high-speed/sniping mode, the A1 II and the Z8 begin to show their muscle with 20fps+ bursts and pre-capture. I just don't see any other differentiating variables, and therefore there's not much room for a camera that sits above 7fps but below 20fps.

The A1 II and the Z8 are direct competitors. Just because the Z8 is cheaper, don't assume it leaves any capability room for another camera between itself and the A1 II. The Z8 is not "near the top of the line", it is THE top. People sometimes shit on its lower resolution EVF, but one needs to try one to see what Nikon's design goal was. This camera offers a substantial ergonomic differentiation from the Sonys that should automatically make it a winner for those who prefer its body design philosophy.

I believe the gap you see is caused by Sony's pricing. Evidently they enjoy enough demand to command a huge premium for the A1 II.

P.S. Everything above only applies to stills. Videos, as we all know, are not worthy of a discussion and should be banned from the Internet.

[EDIT] typos

Edited on Oct 11, 2025 at 10:52 PM · View previous versions



Oct 11, 2025 at 05:37 PM
EB-1
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p.1 #12 · Speculation time: Sony a7V body design and...


All the a7rV etc. are short for full-sized hands so I have to use the SmallRig Baseplate. I'm not sure if they are different per model or not, but wish the camera bottoms would maintain consistency in the future.

EBH



Oct 11, 2025 at 09:37 PM
Lifeinpictures
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p.1 #13 · Speculation time: Sony a7V body design and...


I have the A9III and the A7RV.
To me the A9III grip feels substantially bulkier. While it does feel firmer to grip, I need to put it work while gripping it. But the bonus is that my little finger is also wrapped around the grip, unlike that of the A7RIII
I have medium sized hands and actually prefer slightly a smaller grip. So, while I find the A9III grip a bit larger, I love the A9III, primarily due to the responsiveness of the global shutter it’s s revelation.



Oct 11, 2025 at 10:29 PM
chiron
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p.1 #14 · Speculation time: Sony a7V body design and...


Lifeinpictures wrote:
I have the A9III and the A7RV.
To me the A9III grip feels substantially bulkier. While it does feel firmer to grip, I need to put it work while gripping it. But the bonus is that my little finger is also wrapped around the grip, unlike that of the A7RIII
I have medium sized hands and actually prefer slightly a smaller grip. So, while I find the A9III grip a bit larger, I love the A9III, primarily due to the responsiveness of the global shutter it’s s revelation.


Can you say more about what you mean by the A9III's responsiveness? BTW, I also find the grip on the A9III and the A1 II requires too much active holding.



Oct 12, 2025 at 01:10 PM
liggy
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p.1 #15 · Speculation time: Sony a7V body design and...


Had an RV and A1. The A9III feels better if you like a bigger camera but not as chunky as a Z8 which feels too big for a daily/casual body for me.

The A9III is just really fast at everything - acquiring focus , shooting - everything.

Then again I still like the A9II except for the startup time which feels sluggish to me.

If you like bigger - can always add a grip. The Smallrig Arca base gives you a nice spot for the pinky if that is important to you.



Oct 12, 2025 at 04:06 PM
patotts
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p.1 #16 · Speculation time: Sony a7V body design and...


old-gregg wrote:
From the pricing perspective, I see where you're coming from. But from the perspective of capabilities, I do not. For context: I own the A7RV, A1 II and Nikon Z8.

Putting the Nikon aside, the bodies of the A1 II and A7RV feel the same. I shake my head when people talk about the "ergonomic upgrade" offered by the A1 II and A9 III. What upgrade? It's the same body with tiny shaping differences. They are so subtle that I had to get different wrist straps to easily identify a body by feel during a photoshoot.

In the AF-S single-shot mode
...Show more

I agree with your general points; the gap I'm referring to is specifically related to Sony's deliberate product and pricing segmentation. I don't view the Nikon Z8 or Canon R5 II as lesser cameras than the a1 II - they are direct competitors in most aspects, but $2,000 less expensive. (I'm not counting the R1, R3, or Z9 because that body design doesn't appeal to me).

The only disagreement is with the refined design of the A1 II. I held both the a7RV and a1 II back and forth today and yesterday, shooting with both, and to me, the ergonomic improvements are meaningful and noticeable. To others, the design difference may be negligible or pointless. It is all good. There is no right or wrong opinion here, only being true to your own opinion and experience.




Oct 12, 2025 at 06:00 PM
freaklikeme
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p.1 #17 · Speculation time: Sony a7V body design and...


My guess is it'll get the same body and screen of the rV but the 7IV's EVF. I'm all for the idea of faster processing sensor (semi or stacked), but I'd have to wonder why that sensor didn't make its first appearance in the FX2. My guess is the FX2 is a good blueprint for that this camera will be in a different form factor. It'll get the AI chip AF and subject recognition and a slathering of PDAF sensors across the frame, a deeper buffer and broader pipe and maybe even a few more FPS, but I have serious doubts the sensor will be different. I could be wrong. Maybe it'll get a tilting EVF. That would help set it apart from the cII.

I think Sony is preparing for the next evolutionary step with their cameras, but I don't think we're going to see many signs of it in this one.



Oct 13, 2025 at 06:55 PM
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p.1 #18 · Speculation time: Sony a7V body design and...


patotts wrote:
Having mostly used the a7RV since it came out, and having owned the A1 back when it came out, as well as having used the a7IV and a7CII with the same 33MP sensor, I just spent some time going through older photos from older cameras with e.g. 24 MP (I told you guys wife and kids are out of town, the dog is walked and that great take-out burger is finished, so I have too much time on my hands...).

While I certainly got the shots with those cameras, but after having shot higher MP cameras for so long and
...Show more

I think the Z 24-70mm f/2.8 S is a better lens than the Z 24-120mm f/4 S because the corner performance is quite a bit better.

The 24-70GMii performs similarly to the Z 24-70mm f/2.8 S, but I would prefer the GMii because its lighter. In fact it weights almost the same (600g+) as the Z 24-120mm f/4 S

The A7RV readout is slow for video, but for photos the effective readout speed is the same as the Z6iii (mechanical shutter = 1/250s)



Oct 15, 2025 at 01:38 AM
A74me
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p.1 #19 · Speculation time: Sony a7V body design and...


freaklikeme wrote:
My guess is it'll get the same body and screen of the rV but the 7IV's EVF. I'm all for the idea of faster processing sensor (semi or stacked), but I'd have to wonder why that sensor didn't make its first appearance in the FX2. My guess is the FX2 is a good blueprint for that this camera will be in a different form factor. It'll get the AI chip AF and subject recognition and a slathering of PDAF sensors across the frame, a deeper buffer and broader pipe and maybe even a few more FPS, but I have serious
...Show more

totally agree, the fx2 is selling like hot cakes to the pro market with first class image/video quality. the a7v is goimg to have the processor clock turned up thats it.



Oct 15, 2025 at 04:49 AM
3catsinky
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p.1 #20 · Speculation time: Sony a7V body design and...


I played with the A9III at the camera store last week. Best Sony body I’ve held. For my smaller, arthritic ridden hands, the A7CIIs fit the best. I’ve been shooting them in all jobs since last October. My Z8 is too big for daily. If I were buying today based on my needs, I’d get an A1II or A9III just for body feel.


Oct 15, 2025 at 04:50 AM
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