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Q2 -> M10?

  
 
pingflood
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p.1 #1 · Q2 -> M10?


Anyone gone this route?

I have a M10M and a Q2, and I have enjoyed the excellent output from the Q2 on recent trips. However I am not a 28mm fan so I've kept it in 35mm crop mode which still provides a pretty high res file to work with + I like how it feels much like rangefinder framelines.

Anyway, was pondering swapping the Q2 for an M10 -- probably the "base" version since the R is still quite pricey.

Weight wise the Q2 is around 734 grams. The M10 is 660. A Voigtlander VM II 35/1.4 is around 189g, putting the M10 setup with a decent fast 35 at about a hectogram more than the Q.

Disadvantages: no autofocus (duh), likely worse high ISO performance, no image stabilisation (which to be honest isn't stellar on the Q, but at least help out a bit). Lower resolution.

Advantages: can share my existing M lenses, existing batteries (and charger), and I have been shooting M cameras of some sort for a decade so am used to rangefinder focusing. I have an EVF as well for long/wide lenses, this would also work on both cameras.

Those who have / have had both, how much of a practical difference do you find at higher ISO and resolution wise in final prints? I find it hard to believe I'd see much of a difference at A3+/A2 print sizes assuming there's not a lot of cropping involved.



Aug 31, 2025 at 05:59 AM
RustyBug
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p.1 #2 · Q2 -> M10?


The distortion of the Q2 Summilux is well known, and your use of the 35mm crop mode (I use it also at times) mitigates the distortion a bit, but also reduces your pixel count a bit, too. So, if you're planning on shooting an actual 35mm lens on a 24MP pixel camera (M10), you're getting your 24MP, while on the 47MP Q2 you're getting around 30MP. The diff between 24MP vs. 30MP isn't a deal break diff (imo).

Move the bar to a 50mm lens vs. 50mm crop mode and you're around 24MP vs. 15MP.

So, if you aren't using the Q2 at 28mm to get the full 47MP, the difference to the 24MP (or 40MP of the M10R) isn't as meaningful ... depending on what glass you are mounting onto the 24MP, M10.

On a different aspect, the DR of the Q2 isn't up to the same levels as the M10 (compare at P2P). If you tend to "push" your files a bit, you may find (imo) that the M10 (R in my case) files stay cleaner, longer.

The AF diff is obvious, so no discussion there.

The OIS diff vs. M10 ... just take a look at what you are doing with your M10M for handheld shutter speeds. Granted, the M10M operates at a diff base ISO without the BFA, but still ... understanding your limits of hand holding with a given lens focal length, etc. ... can be understood by your M10M use. You know what you're confident with ... vs. where you draw the line for handheld SS.

To that point, yeah ... you can be a smidge more "sloppy" with the Q2, because of the OIS, but again if you are an accomplished M10M shooter (vs. someone coming into M anew), I don't see this as a big deal.

Most of this (imo) adds up to the M10 paired with the M10M (Allen's setup, actually) being sound, even if "different" from the Q2.

One thing not mentioned (might not pertain) is the macro function of the Q2. If that's an aspect of significance for you, then the M10 might be losing that. If you don't go there, then it's another case of being a "not a big deal".

System compatibility of functionality between the M10M and M10 ... and battery / Visoflex / lens compatibility ... is a good thing. Will you miss the Q2? On some level, I think we always miss certain aspects of something we've enjoyed before. Personally, I dig on a leaf shutter, but I also dig on the mechanical shutter release tactile feel of my M's. Here again, you are already aware of those diff's in your M10M.

I've got an M10R and Q2 ... also, an M246 (instead of M10M) and SL2-S. When I shoot events and want AF, I'll pair up my SL2-S and Q2, so I can shoot two AF bodies without a lens change. But, my Q2 and M246 are the least of my shots. My M glass (either on M10R or on SL2-S) are easily more than my Q2. I still dig on it, but I use it FAR LESS than my M10R. I realize the resolution of the M10R vs. M10 isn't apples to apples, but my salient point is that I think you'll transition to life without the Q2 just fine. YMMV.

Anyway, just some .02 brain fodder, fer ya.




Aug 31, 2025 at 01:39 PM
pingflood
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p.1 #3 · Q2 -> M10?


Thank you! I forgot about the macro feature of the Q2 which tells you how much I've been using it.

Realistically, I think the only time I'd miss the Q2 would be when handing it off to someone else to use briefly. I "traded cameras" with a guy at a spot recently so we could both get family photos and I told him to just frame and push the button and it'd be fine. But I suppose I could just hand over my iphone next time....

FWIW I find the M bodies easy to handhold at slow shutter speeds so I think the practical difference for the Q2 OIS might be a single stop or so.



Sep 01, 2025 at 01:40 AM
jeffersoncasey
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p.1 #4 · Q2 -> M10?


The lens on Q2 is pretty sterile and while it took sharp and detailed images I much prefer to shoot on M with lenses that are less perfect but more "romantic" in rendering.

As for high ISO, M10 hands down, you can really shoot at least 1 stop higher ISO, even at higher ISO the shadow recovery is better still. Highlights recovery is better too (except ISO100).



Sep 01, 2025 at 03:46 AM
pingflood
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p.1 #5 · Q2 -> M10?


I am a bit surprised at the ISO difference since I had in my mind that the Q2 would perform better. So that's an interesting data point.

As for "romantic" lenses, I suspect my Summicron-35 ASPH would fall into the sterile category. It's a superb lens but I can't say it has a lot of character. But I have a Summaron 35/2.8 as well which definitely has more personality at the cost of ultimate sharpness.



Sep 01, 2025 at 04:17 AM
RustyBug
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p.1 #6 · Q2 -> M10?


jeffersoncasey wrote:
The lens on Q2 is pretty sterile and while it took sharp and detailed images I much prefer to shoot on M with lenses that are less perfect but more "romantic" in rendering.

As for high ISO, M10 hands down, you can really shoot at least 1 stop higher ISO, even at higher ISO the shadow recovery is better still. Highlights recovery is better too (except ISO100).


P2P data suggests this, as well.



Sep 01, 2025 at 08:22 AM
jeffersoncasey
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p.1 #7 · Q2 -> M10?


pingflood wrote:
I am a bit surprised at the ISO difference since I had in my mind that the Q2 would perform better. So that's an interesting data point.

As for "romantic" lenses, I suspect my Summicron-35 ASPH would fall into the sterile category. It's a superb lens but I can't say it has a lot of character. But I have a Summaron 35/2.8 as well which definitely has more personality at the cost of ultimate sharpness.


I had the 35cron asph and that was my favourite lens until I got the thypoch. The cron is still a fantastic lens, wide open it has characters, which is what I would categorize as "transition period" between classic and sharp modern lens, while stop down to f2.8 you still get pretty smooth rendering. The Q2 is leaning heavily on the clean and modern category. Something to do with how it captures or renders contrasts, the Q2 seems to render the highlights harsher and abrupt, while even the 35cron asph renders with more highlight roll offs.



Sep 01, 2025 at 08:38 AM
pingflood
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p.1 #8 · Q2 -> M10?


jeffersoncasey wrote:
I had the 35cron asph and that was my favourite lens until I got the thypoch. The cron is still a fantastic lens, wide open it has characters, which is what I would categorize as "transition period" between classic and sharp modern lens, while stop down to f2.8 you still get pretty smooth rendering. The Q2 is leaning heavily on the clean and modern category. Something to do with how it captures or renders contrasts, the Q2 seems to render the highlights harsher and abrupt, while even the 35cron asph renders with more highlight roll offs.


Which Thypoch is it, the Simera 35/1.4? Curious to hear how you think it compares to the 'cron ASPH.



Sep 04, 2025 at 03:32 PM
jeffersoncasey
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p.1 #9 · Q2 -> M10?


I have the 28mm, compared to the 35cron it's sharper wide open at f1.4, and across the frame, and somewhat having a smoother rendering than the 35cron. Most importantly the Thypoch is cheap enough to add alongside the 35cron...


pingflood wrote:
Which Thypoch is it, the Simera 35/1.4? Curious to hear how you think it compares to the 'cron ASPH.




Sep 04, 2025 at 06:58 PM
 


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pingflood
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p.1 #10 · Q2 -> M10?


jeffersoncasey wrote:
I have the 28mm, compared to the 35cron it's sharper wide open at f1.4, and across the frame, and somewhat having a smoother rendering than the 35cron. Most importantly the Thypoch is cheap enough to add alongside the 35cron...



From what I've read they definitely offer good bang for the buck. 28 isn't for me but the 35 is a bit tempting if I am going to run dual M10 bodies (M10 + M10M) since I want a "good 35" on each one. I've shot a bunch of landscapes with the 'cron and yellow filter on the M10M and I absolutely love the results so will likely keep that combo as-is meaning the future M10 will need a solid "general purpose" 35 for travel and such. The Summaron is nice but I'd want something faster than 2.8 and preferably a bit sharper if I do some landscapes.



Sep 05, 2025 at 01:32 AM
RustyBug
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p.1 #11 · Q2 -> M10?


Well ... a 2nd 35 to complement your Cron, could be a lot of things. Kinda depends on how closely you want them to match / overlap / differentiate in their use / rendering. On one hand, you could get a pair of Crons for an "exact match". Although, I gather you're not heading that direction.

From that, there's the Lux, the Voigt's or maybe you stretch your 35 into a 40. I've currently got a vintage (pre-ASPH) Cron 40/2 paired with my 35 Cron ASPH. Let's me "flip" the vibe when I want. Pretty much a 40mm version of the 35 KOB, sorta, on the "differentiation" end of things vs. the 35 Cron ASPH.

The VM 40/1.2 catches my eye a bit as an ASPH update to my 40/2, but so do some other 35's. Several options in that 35 / 40 space.



Sep 05, 2025 at 03:57 AM
pingflood
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p.1 #12 · Q2 -> M10?


RustyBug wrote:
Well ... a 2nd 35 to complement your Cron, could be a lot of things. Kinda depends on how closely you want them to match / overlap / differentiate in their use / rendering. On one hand, you could get a pair of Crons for an "exact match". Although, I gather you're not heading that direction.

From that, there's the Lux, the Voigt's or maybe you stretch your 35 into a 40. I've currently got a vintage (pre-ASPH) Cron 40/2 paired with my 35 Cron ASPH. Let's me "flip" the vibe when I want. Pretty much a 40mm version of the
...Show more

Well, the ideal 35 would have a little character at/near wide open but be as sharp as possible stopped down to 5.6-8 or so. Also nice if it doesn't cost as much as my 'cron. My Summaron has all the character but even stopped down it's noticeably worse than my 'cron, at least on the admittedly demanding 40MP mono sensor in the M10M.

40 I could work with since the framelines aren't that accurate anyway and I use an EVF for landscape framing.



Sep 05, 2025 at 06:06 AM
jeffersoncasey
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p.1 #13 · Q2 -> M10?


I had been a 35 shooter for a decade and Q2 open up the 28mm world for me, and at f1.4 it's way more useful than Q2, and I will not shoot anything slower if it's a 28mm. It's also pretty easy to shoot from the hip with zone focus (even wide open). Never quite had the success with 35cron.

By the way the Thypoch 35mm isn't as interesting as the 28mm in terms of rendering, hard to put down in words, less character if you will.

Edited on Sep 05, 2025 at 11:17 PM · View previous versions



Sep 05, 2025 at 07:04 AM
pingflood
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p.1 #14 · Q2 -> M10?


Unfortunately after three decades of shooting I have just accepted that certain focal lengths aren't for me and 28mm is definitely in that category. Now I may look like an idiot having purchased a Q2 despite knowing this but I really enjoyed it in 35mm crop mode (the files were still large and high res) and I will admit that once or twice it was handy to be able to go wider.

However I have the idea of creating a compact landscape/travel kit with the Ms and at that point I feel like the M10 could just replace the Q2 entirely. So trading a Q2 for an M10 of some sort would give me both a replacement for its intended original purpose and another tool in my landscape kit. Initially I'd have M10 + M10M + 35mm Summicron ASPH + Voigtlander 75/1.9 but might add a couple of more lenses which would still yield a very compact setup. Strangely enough I wouldn't mind a 24mm which I find more useful and easier to work with than 28 (don't ask me why). So maybe a 24 and a longer (135-180mm) option would complete the setup.

If I did my math right, the M10 + M10M + cron + 75 would weigh less than my S1R + 24-90 nevermind a complete kit. So I'd have a light M based kit and a more comprehensive and a lot heavier/bulkier L mount one.



Sep 05, 2025 at 07:25 AM
geoffreyg
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p.1 #15 · Q2 -> M10?


Am presently traveling in Europe w M10R and very small CV 35mm f2.5 Color Skopar. Fits nicely in a handy small side bag, w a pair of sunglasses and a map. The 35 ‘cron is only a bit bigger, but it’s still at Grimes getting its focal plane adjusted as it was back focusing, and seemed soft, which it is not really.
Brought a 21 SEM for wide shots, quite useful, and a lovely 50mm ‘cron, yet to use. Makes a nice kit. Oddly, I can focus quickly w M, not needing glasses, and actually preferably to AF. The CL sits at home (it’s high ISO is a bit limited) and never could get happy w Q lens size, toe bulky for my use. YMMV.



Sep 05, 2025 at 11:01 PM
jeffersoncasey
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p.1 #16 · Q2 -> M10?



You'll be pleased with M10 if rangefinder isn't something you loather. So much more fun to shoot with and nicer rendering. I don't find 24mp lacking but I don't print...
pingflood wrote:
Unfortunately after three decades of shooting I have just accepted that certain focal lengths aren't for me and 28mm is definitely in that category. Now I may look like an idiot having purchased a Q2 despite knowing this but I really enjoyed it in 35mm crop mode (the files were still large and high res) and I will admit that once or twice it was handy to be able to go wider.

However I have the idea of creating a compact landscape/travel kit with the Ms and at that point I feel like the M10 could just replace the Q2 entirely.
...Show more



Sep 05, 2025 at 11:18 PM
pingflood
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p.1 #17 · Q2 -> M10?


Just an update: MPB offered me a very good trade in price for the Q2 and after a week of waiting a decently priced M10 showed up so it's on the way here now. Going to London and Edinburgh next month so it'll be a good opportunity to break it in.




Sep 15, 2025 at 07:49 AM
1bwana1
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p.1 #18 · Q2 -> M10?


pingflood wrote:
Just an update: MPB offered me a very good trade in price for the Q2 and after a week of waiting a decently priced M10 showed up so it's on the way here now. Going to London and Edinburgh next month so it'll be a good opportunity to break it in.



Congratulations on your new camera. I am sure it will bring you years of great images. Feel free to ask any of us here on the FM M camera boards any questions you may have as you learn this great camera system.



Sep 15, 2025 at 10:13 AM







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