This is not meant as a bait/troll/ type of post. It's a legitimate question based on some recent observations and concerns I've had.
A few months ago I noticed that used film gear spiked up in price. This past week I finally decided to gather up some old equipment I rarely use anymore and try to sell it (Mamiya RB67 ProS, Mamiya 645J, Nikon F2A, Canon FT QL, etc.). The prices have dropped on the used market to almost half of what they were just a couple of months ago!
I did some research and came across an article about how Kodak is in financial ruin with almost zero possibility of recovering this time around. Not good news.
Yesterday I dropped off a roll of 35mm color film at my local film developing lab. It was $18.00 just for developing without prints!!!
I'm saddened and concerned about this possible trend, especially since I still own a bunch of film gear (two F3HP's, two FM2N's, F with standard prism, F with FTN Photomic Viewfinder, F2A, F100, F5, N80, two Pentax Super Programs, 4 Canon FT QL's, Mamiya RB67 ProS, 645J, 645E, plus a bunch of lenses for all these cameras in near pristine condition).
snegron7 wrote:
SW Florida. Plus, $.50 per print, so a roll of 24 exposure, 35mm film costs me $30 for developing + printing. That's not including the price of film.
Lumping printing into the price isn't really valid, that's another service entirely.
Been paying $9/roll up to 36 for years in Dallas for just dev.
snegron7 wrote:
SW Florida. Plus, $.50 per print, so a roll of 24 exposure, 35mm film costs me $30 for developing + printing. That's not including the price of film.
snegron7 wrote:
The prices have dropped on the used market to almost half of what they were just a couple of months ago!
Maybe the market is temporarily saturated: a lot of people started shooting film again, but once they had gotten a camera or two or six they didn't need any more. Even if Kodak stops making film there are other makers (Ilford, Fuji, Foma, some up-and-coming makers in China including Light Lens Lab, etc.), so I don't think the supply will dry up but options for colour film will be reduced. Expired films will become more expensive as a result.
There's a fad for film that may or may not have crested, but there's also a steadier undercurrent of people who always shot film and continue to prefer it, or people who like to shoot film as well as digital, so I think there'll be a market for film and film cameras as long as there's film to shoot and chemicals to develop it.
snegron7 wrote:
SW Florida. Plus, $.50 per print, so a roll of 24 exposure, 35mm film costs me $30 for developing + printing. That's not including the price of film.
That's the fault of your lab sticking it to you. They are over 100% more expensive than most other places.
Time to switch labs and/or go to mail order. Or shoot B&W and dev it yourself - super cheap and easy.
Desmolicious wrote:
That's the fault of your lab sticking it to you. They are over 100% more expensive than most other places.
Time to switch labs and/or go to mail order. Or shoot B&W and dev it yourself - super cheap and easy.
I need to find a quick refresher tutorial on developing my own B&W film. I used to do it decades ago, but I've forgotten. For every 10 Google searches I do, there are 11 different methods people use. I don't remember it being so complicated.
snegron7 wrote:
I need to find a quick refresher tutorial on developing my own B&W film. I used to do it decades ago, but I've forgotten. For every 10 Google searches I do, there are 11 different methods people use. I don't remember it being so complicated.
The Ilford video is very straightforward and worked for me:
?si=lFfo7rRQ4n6I2EIl
The big thing to know is that you don't need a darkroom (unless you want to print with an enlarger). You can put everything into a changing bag and once the film is in the tank and the funnel lid is locked, you can do everything else in broad daylight. And get an instant-read thermometer instead of the old-fashioned ones; you'll get your temperature readings immediately, no waiting.
snegron7 wrote:
I need to find a quick refresher tutorial on developing my own B&W film. I used to do it decades ago, but I've forgotten. For every 10 Google searches I do, there are 11 different methods people use. I don't remember it being so complicated.
You can cheat and use Cinestill DF96 Monobath like I do. One liquid - reusable 16 times - to do it all.
An ADOX representative did a talk a couple years about and one of the amazing take aways is that film is consistently growing in market share. Much like vinyl records, it will never be hegemonic as a medium, but at the proper scale it's actually pretty healthy and steadily growing.
The 2,000 lbs gorilla in the room is Kodak (and to some extent Fuji) neither of which is actually a consumer film company despite it's legacy. If Hollywood shut down it's film demand tomorrow I think Kodak would shutter its film coating operations entirely. Consumer film is hardly a blip on it's balance sheet. This is why, as Hess says, we NEED to support ACTUAL film producers like Harmon, etc. (I would also add, go to the theater and see movies .shot on film and bring a bunch of friends).
I do think the lab network is a problem. In SoCal there are labs popping up everywhere on top of the ancient dusty shops that are still chugging along. But I have friends elsewhere that are struggling to find good labs. One in Southern France told me the nearest lab is an hour drive away and he is considering self-developing C41.
I joked with my wife the other day that I need a business complete that is workout gym in the morning, photo lab / dark room by afternoon and band space by evening.
Yeah, it's time to find a new lab. I use Mike's Camera because they're local and, if I'm not mistaken, the last lab in CO that does E6 on-site. You have to join their "smile club" to get the best pricing ($25 for the first year, $20 for renewal) but then you can get $7.50 dev only, or $14.99 for dev and 24 4x6" prints on your choice of glossy or matte Fuji paper. Tack on $4 for 36 prints. Push services are also available for an extra cost ($2, if I remember correctly, but that might be per stop). I've never had an issue with them scratching the film or poorly developing either E6 or C41. The do offer mail-in service, if you're interested.
Desmolicious wrote:
You can cheat and use Cinestill DF96 Monobath like I do. One liquid - reusable 16 times - to do it all.
I've been using DF96 when I just want to get the film dev'd fast and it's great. Just don't over agitate. I also use other developers (XTOL, Perceptol and Nucleol) when I want finer grain. B&W can be dead simple and very rewarding.
Pixelpuffin wrote:
I agree
Last winter due to boredom I picked up 4 working film bodies and a dozen rolls of film
The plan was to have a go…
But the cost of process and print for a measly 36 shots is horrifying.
So instead I bought a pair of cheap used 256 & 512 MB sd cards…
Shooting JPEG’s in my canon 6D the camera said 37 shots available …yay 😎👍🏻
If I turn off every single auto feature except AF
I feel as tho it’s as close as I can get to shooting film without the expense of actually doing so
You never can get the real film experience shooting digital until you can somehow figure out how to forget to rewind your SD card before you remove it, thus ruining all your images.
ottokbre wrote:
An ADOX representative did a talk a couple years about and one of the amazing take aways is that film is consistently growing in market share. Much like vinyl records, it will never be hegemonic as a medium, but at the proper scale it's actually pretty healthy and steadily growing.
The 2,000 lbs gorilla in the room is Kodak (and to some extent Fuji) neither of which is actually a consumer film company despite it's legacy. If Hollywood shut down it's film demand tomorrow I think Kodak would shutter its film coating operations entirely. Consumer film is hardly a blip on it's balance sheet. This is why, as Hess says, we NEED to support ACTUAL film producers like Harmon, etc. (I would also add, go to the theater and see movies .shot on film and bring a bunch of friends).
I do think the lab network is a problem. In SoCal there are labs popping up everywhere on top of the ancient dusty shops that are still chugging along. But I have friends elsewhere that are struggling to find good labs. One in Southern France told me the nearest lab is an hour drive away and he is considering self-developing C41.
I joked with my wife the other day that I need a business complete that is workout gym in the morning, photo lab / dark room by afternoon and band space by evening. ...Show more →
No idea who Hess is, but he sounds like an extremely good looking dood and true humanitarian.
Every time Kodak makes some dire announcement, it's like an edict proclaiming the end for film photography. There are plenty of other manufactures and even innovations in new emulsions. Harmon is moving into color. Foma, Adox and a number of other European film manufactures have learned to produce a quality product while staying in the EU's environmental guidelines. The Chinese companies that are gearing up for a larger market share.
I've been using Tri-X and other Kodak products for a lot longer than I would like to admit but if it comes to supporting Ilford and their dedication to film, I'll buy more HP-5.
Is film photography dying? Not for me, since I have finally retired after nearly 50 years (DoD, DARPA, teaching) of solid work as a warfighter and engineer. I just bought a mint Linhof Technikardan 45, mint Zone VI (made in Newfane) Version 4 Mahogany & Gold field camera. Got all my lenses ready to go with those 4x5 systems from 75mm out to 400mm. Redoing my darkroom to handle up to 20x24 prints. Still have my Linhof Super Technika V, and Rolleiflex E, and a few Canon rangefinders (P, L1, 7s). That stuff will outlive me, but will be donated to my sons and their families when I am no longer vertical...
I plan on having fun, slowing down to take in much of what has been a blur to me in the literal sense, and let the hobby act as "Ex-Lax" for my brain, which means I can finally unplug from AI, MATLAB, LabVIEW and the rest...
BTW: I'll save the digital stuff for birds-in-flight, sports (HS baseball and gymnastics), and those UAP moments...
