p.1 #1 · Nikkor Z 400mm f/2.8 TC VR S vs Nikkor Z 600mm f/4 TC VR S
I have a Z9 Body and would like the opinions of the guys/gals that shoot BIF. Like Kestrels / Owls / Osprey/ Hawks & Song Birds. From experience which would they use or get more use out of? I also have a gitzo tripod with a wimberley WH-200 and a gitzo monopod with a really right stuff MH-02 monopod head.
p.1 #3 · Nikkor Z 400mm f/2.8 TC VR S vs Nikkor Z 600mm f/4 TC VR S
What lens/focal length are you using currently for these subjects?
I think there are two ways of looking at this purchase:
1) Pick the base focal length you will use the most. If you think you will have the TC engaged most of the time with the 400TC then the 600TC is probably a better lens for you.
2) Decide what is more important between having 400/2.8 or 1200/8. As those of the focal lengths that can't be duplicated.
I don't think many people really need 1200mm as atmospherics almost always ruin the shots at 1200mm anyways. So I think the real question for you to answer is if having 400 f/2.8 is useful and or important to you?
I'd also say not to buy 400TC if you are only buying it to use the f/2.8 but aren't going to have subjects fill more than the 600mm FOV. People often think they are buying the f/2.8 to be able to shoot longer into the evening or earlier in the morning but if you crop a 400/2.8 image to the 600/4's FOV you lose the aperture advantage from the 1 stop lower ISO anyways. Only get the 400 if you have subjects that are too big for the 600's FOV.
p.1 #4 · Nikkor Z 400mm f/2.8 TC VR S vs Nikkor Z 600mm f/4 TC VR S
I'll just add that the focal length you use is really dependent on location. Some poeple really do have access to places where a 400mm f/2.8 lens makes sense. Birds in such places frequently fly quite close, and there 400mm and f/2.8 really makes for a great combination. Other places, and I think it's the majority of places, will make the 600 f/4 a much more reasonable lens. If you already shoot with a long lens you should know which one you'll need, and if you haven't started yet, just rent a 180-600 to get a feeling...chances are I think you'll be happier with a 600 rather than a 400.
p.1 #5 · Nikkor Z 400mm f/2.8 TC VR S vs Nikkor Z 600mm f/4 TC VR S
I still own a D6 and upgraded to Z9, I also have a AF-S 600mm f/4. I’ve got the adapter to put my current AF-S lens on the Z9. The AF-S 600 on the D6 is a great combo razor sharp images if conditions permit and I don’t screw it up! The Auto Focus and 3D tracking when bird is selected is just awesome on the Z9.
I was curious if the new Z S series 600mm is sharper hand held the my current AF-S 600mm? For those who have or used both I would be curious to hear what you have learned about the 2 lens!
When I’m not using the AF-S 600mm I usually use the 300mm f/2.8G ED VR II with and with out a 1.4TC
But I’d say I use the AF-S 600mm f/4G ED VR a little more.
Just wasn’t sure the the newer lens produce a sharper image when all conditions are right.
If they did was curious between the 2 lens which most people preferred and why.
JasonTheBirder wrote:
I'll just add that the focal length you use is really dependent on location. Some poeple really do have access to places where a 400mm f/2.8 lens makes sense. Birds in such places frequently fly quite close, and there 400mm and f/2.8 really makes for a great combination. Other places, and I think it's the majority of places, will make the 600 f/4 a much more reasonable lens. If you already shoot with a long lens you should know which one you'll need, and if you haven't started yet, just rent a 180-600 to get a feeling...chances are I think you'll be happier with a 600 rather than a 400....Show more →
p.1 #6 · Nikkor Z 400mm f/2.8 TC VR S vs Nikkor Z 600mm f/4 TC VR S
MKuran wrote:
I was curious if the new Z S series 600mm is sharper hand held the my current AF-S 600mm? For those who have or used both I would be curious to hear what you have learned about the 2 lens!
We tested the G, E, and Z versions using Imatest at Photography Life:
Check it out for a detailed comparison. At f/4, the results in the center respectively were 3061, 3243, 3678. A 300 point difference might be hard to see but I can definitely tell the difference between a 617 point difference, which is the difference between the Z and the G versions. Around 15m subject difference I think you will definitely see the difference with fine feather detail between the Z and the G, especially those kinds of birds with very delicate feathers. Probably a bit harder to see the difference between the E and the Z.
p.1 #7 · Nikkor Z 400mm f/2.8 TC VR S vs Nikkor Z 600mm f/4 TC VR S
Steve explained that very well! 600mm for me. Has anyone here ever used a Z8 or Z9 and figure the Z series lens is actually sharper than the AF-S lens? Thanks for posting!
Mike
arbitrage wrote:
What lens/focal length are you using currently for these subjects?
I think there are two ways of looking at this purchase:
1) Pick the base focal length you will use the most. If you think you will have the TC engaged most of the time with the 400TC then the 600TC is probably a better lens for you.
2) Decide what is more important between having 400/2.8 or 1200/8. As those of the focal lengths that can't be duplicated.
I don't think many people really need 1200mm as atmospherics almost always ruin the shots at 1200mm anyways. So I think the real question for you to answer is if having 400 f/2.8 is useful and or important to you?
I'd also say not to buy 400TC if you are only buying it to use the f/2.8 but aren't going to have subjects fill more than the 600mm FOV. People often think they are buying the f/2.8 to be able to shoot longer into the evening or earlier in the morning but if you crop a 400/2.8 image to the 600/4's FOV you lose the aperture advantage from the 1 stop lower ISO anyways. Only get the 400 if you have subjects that are too big for the 600's FOV.
Steve Perry explains this well in this video:
Also another video discussing your decision" ...Show more →
Check it out for a detailed comparison. At f/4, the results in the center respectively were 3061, 3243, 3678. A 300 point difference might be hard to see but I can definitely tell the difference between a 617 point difference, which is the difference between the Z and the G versions. Around 15m subject difference I think you will definitely see the difference with fine feather detail between the Z and the G, especially those kinds of birds with very delicate feathers. Probably a bit harder to see the difference between the E and the Z....Show more →
Check it out for a detailed comparison. At f/4, the results in the center respectively were 3061, 3243, 3678. A 300 point difference might be hard to see but I can definitely tell the difference between a 617 point difference, which is the difference between the Z and the G versions. Around 15m subject difference I think you will definitely see the difference with fine feather detail between the Z and the G, especially those kinds of birds with very delicate feathers. Probably a bit harder to see the difference between the E and the Z....Show more →
Actually, the center numbers are: G = 3061, E = 3424, and Z = 3678. Not as big a difference between the E and Z. The benefit of being sharper means that when the TC is added you get a better 840mm figure as well.
p.1 #10 · Nikkor Z 400mm f/2.8 TC VR S vs Nikkor Z 600mm f/4 TC VR S
MKuran wrote:
Steve explained that very well! 600mm for me. Has anyone here ever used a Z8 or Z9 and figure the Z series lens is actually sharper than the AF-S lens? Thanks for posting!
Mike
I am mainly a birder, and I had the F mount 400 f2.8E FL VR since 2015 and loved it. I used it up until last year on my Z8 and Z9 and it worked even better on Z mount due to less AF anomalies - No AF fine tune issues, not that there was any AF fine tune issues on my D850 - but I was getting sharper results more often on the Z cameras. What I did find was that I was almost always shooting with the 1.4x TC on my D850 and then also on the Z8 and Z9. Last year a deal came up that I couldn't refuse on a trade-in on my 400 f2.8E FL VR and I was able to afford the Z 600TC. I couldn't be happier, the 600TC is a stunning lens and having the switchable TC is brilliant.
p.1 #11 · Nikkor Z 400mm f/2.8 TC VR S vs Nikkor Z 600mm f/4 TC VR S
Not to mention you can switch between FX and DX with a simple push button on the Z9s camera body!
Lance B wrote:
I am mainly a birder, and I had the F mount 400 f2.8E FL VR since 2015 and loved it. I used it up until last year on my Z8 and Z9 and it worked even better on Z mount due to less AF anomalies - No AF fine tune issues, not that there was any AF fine tune issues on my D850 - but I was getting sharper results more often on the Z cameras. What I did find was that I was almost always shooting with the 1.4x TC on my D850 and then also on the Z8 and Z9. Last year a deal came up that I couldn't refuse on a trade-in on my 400 f2.8E FL VR and I was able to afford the Z 600TC. I couldn't be happier, the 600TC is a stunning lens and having the switchable TC is brilliant....Show more →
p.1 #12 · Nikkor Z 400mm f/2.8 TC VR S vs Nikkor Z 600mm f/4 TC VR S
I have and love the 400 f2.8TC, but I am more of a generalist wildlife photographer who has a strong preference for mammals and animal landscapes. In addition, I prefer a more intimate experience when photographing wildlife. I do photograph birds like owls, cranes, alcids, and so on.... when photographing birds, I find that I must use the built in converter and often add a second converter or crop. The 400mm f2.8TC is not the "best" birding lens. It is quite usable when you are close to birds or photographing larger species, but were I a bird specialist, I'd either have an 800PF or 600mm TC.
Since you indicate that you are specializing in bird photography, it makes sense that you look at Nikon's longer lenses...
p.1 #13 · Nikkor Z 400mm f/2.8 TC VR S vs Nikkor Z 600mm f/4 TC VR S
Thanks Bruce! After watching the videos and seeing that link that showed the results. Plus reading the other comments. I pretty much decided on the 600 f/4TC,
Mike
OwlsEyes wrote:
I have and love the 400 f2.8TC, but I am more of a generalist wildlife photographer who has a strong preference for mammals and animal landscapes. In addition, I prefer a more intimate experience when photographing wildlife. I do photograph birds like owls, cranes, alcids, and so on.... when photographing birds, I find that I must use the built in converter and often add a second converter or crop. The 400mm f2.8TC is not the "best" birding lens. It is quite usable when you are close to birds or photographing larger species, but were I a bird specialist, I'd either have an 800PF or 600mm TC.
Since you indicate that you are specializing in bird photography, it makes sense that you look at Nikon's longer lenses...
p.1 #14 · Nikkor Z 400mm f/2.8 TC VR S vs Nikkor Z 600mm f/4 TC VR S
If I could only buy one, I definitely go with 600/4TC. For me, 600 and 800 ish is probably my most use focal length. However, 400/2.8 focal length can also be very useful in certain situation but for for safari and larger animal rather than for birds except for some bigger bird inflight that depends on your location,
600mm might be a little tight or give you less room to maneuver to track and follow birds easily. In those
situation I prefer looser framing and crop afterward. Of course you can always get 100-400 to supplement 600/4. I use 400/2.8TC and 800PF at the moment and find the combination works well in majority of situation that I have but I am contemplating replacing 800PF with 600/4TC but most likely will keep 400/2.8TC, may be.
p.1 #15 · Nikkor Z 400mm f/2.8 TC VR S vs Nikkor Z 600mm f/4 TC VR S
Right if I already had the 400 f/2.8TC I would keep it. Just in the middle of making the switch. I’ll have to look at parting with my D6 and 300mm and 600mm. Thanks for commenting!!
Mike
suteetat wrote:
If I could only buy one, I definitely go with 600/4TC. For me, 600 and 800 ish is probably my most use focal length. However, 400/2.8 focal length can also be very useful in certain situation but for for safari and larer animal rather than for birds except for some bigger bird inflight that depends on your location,
600mm might be a little tight or give you less room to maneuver to track and follow birds easily. In those
situation I prefer looser framing and crop afterward. Of course you can always get 100-400 to supplement 600/4. I use 400/2.8TC and 800PF at the moment and find the combination works well in majority of situation that I have but I am contemplating replacing 800PF with 600/4TC but most likely will keep 400/2.8TC, may be. ...Show more →
p.1 #18 · Nikkor Z 400mm f/2.8 TC VR S vs Nikkor Z 600mm f/4 TC VR S
Having owned both I prefer the 400TC due to it being less bulky and slightly shorter. But overall the 600mm is hard to beat - even with my 400 I found myself engaging the TC nearly 70% of the time which is why I switched over to the 600TC.
p.1 #20 · Nikkor Z 400mm f/2.8 TC VR S vs Nikkor Z 600mm f/4 TC VR S
Although I don’t currently own one, for many years I greatly preferred 500mm/4 lenses. I deem a 500/4 the best overall general wildlife and BIF lens for shooting both subject categories.
When I shot 500mm I had a 1.4TC on it half the time, using it for BIF or small mammals and reptiles as a 700/5.6. When I was shooting larger approachable wading birds and larger mammals I shot it straight as 500/4.
I think I’d have the internal TC on as a default using the 400. And I’d add an external TC about half the time. I’d use the 600 without the TC by default and switch on the internal TC maybe half the time and almost never feel the need to add an external TC to it. So, I just talked myself into buying a 600/4 TC. Thank you.
