I know that difference in EVF for these two are magnifications: x0.59 vs x0.78
What does this really mean - is it magnification ratio when you press mag in? That first step?
Cause second mag step in A7C is x11.7, so I don't understand what the problem is.
Is the overall size of EVF screen also bigger in A7III? like in mm?
Reason I'm asking is that after another family trip with A7C, I started wondering if there would be advantage to swap C with III and get bigger EVF, for my MF Voigtlander lens. My eyes are not getting younger and I can only use EVF now to frame - LCD screen is hard to use in bright day.
It's how big the image you see through the viewfinder appears to be to your eye, when you look into the viewfinder. It has nothing to do with the "zoom in on some small part of the picture" feature.
GHarris wrote:
It's how big the image you see through the viewfinder appears to be to your eye, when you look into the viewfinder. It has nothing to do with the "zoom in on some small part of the picture" feature.
psp2000 wrote:
In practicality the difference between 0.59 and 0.78 isn't really that huge, having looked through both viewfinders in the past.
Will the smaller EVF prevent you from getting the same shots that you would get from a camera with a larger EVF? No.
I think the difference is pretty large in terms of usage. And if you were shooting manual focus lenses wide-open, when you don’t want to use Magnified view. It will result in missing more shots. That has been my experience anyway.
nehemiahphoto wrote:
I think the difference is pretty large in terms of usage. And if you were shooting manual focus lenses wide-open, when you don’t want to use Magnified view. It will result in missing more shots. That has been my experience anyway.
Good point. I use autofous 95% of the time and so viewfinders/lcds to me are mostly just framing aids.
In any case, I'm still able to manually focus with my rx100 if I need to.
nehemiahphoto wrote:
I think the difference is pretty large in terms of usage. And if you were shooting manual focus lenses wide-open, when you don’t want to use Magnified view. It will result in missing more shots. That has been my experience anyway.
Yeah, this is exactly why I was asking - I use Voigtlander lens and thought that maybe swapping my a7c to a7iii would be beneficial for those MF lens - even when I use magnification when focusing, I thought bigger evf could be better for my eyes. I'm not that old, but my eyes are getting older faster than I want
Need to remember your ability to actually see. Some of us old guys are certainly challenged here including me. I wear eyeglasses full time and any and I mean any help is always good
I am not au fait with the fine details of EVFs, but the a7C got plenty of criticism with respect to its EVF. Here are some data, and I have to say, DPR are excellent for specs listings.
The a7c has 2.36m and 0.59.
The new a7CR has 2.36m dot 0.7 magnification EVF.
The a7rII was 2.36m and 0.78.
And my a7r from 2013, was 2.36m and 0.71 magnification.
These compare with the Nikon 7II (3.69m, 0.8), the Sony a7IV (3.69m, 0.78) and the a7rV (9.44m, 0.9).
GMPhotography wrote:
Need to remember your ability to actually see. Some of us old guys are certainly challenged here including me. I wear eyeglasses full time and any and I mean any help is always good
Me including! That's the thing, I bought a7c for its size and it is amazing but I keep feeling that bigger evf and a grip would help me a lot.
I wear glasses 24/7, plus my eyes are not that great anymore as I'm getting older.
I like my Voigtlander lens and like to do manual focusing - that is I decided to sell a7c and get a7III - bigger grip and texture, bigger evf. Plus, to be honest I thought that fully articulating screen will be great, but now when I have it on a7c - it pisses me off as 75% of the time I don't need vertical view, but actually from the hip and then I need to take it aaaaall out, to the left and then turn it. You must think now I'm really lazy
I have had both the A7III and the A7C at the same time. Sure the image on the A7C is smaller in size but for me it is easier to see if an image is in focus on the A7C since the A7III EVF and also LCD is never really sharp in magnify mode (though one learns eventually that slightly soft is actually sharp and one can bump up picture profile sharpness to +3 which also helps for RAW shooters but messes up the JPEG).
This was one of the reasons I sold the A7III. And no, my dioptre setting was not set wrong and my copy was not worse than my friends that I cross referenced it with. Also for me as a permanent glasses wearer the smaller A7C image lets me see the corners when composing which I never did on the A7III.
I tested the A7CII & A7CR the other day and that EVF is now bigger in projected size but still good in sharpness and works ok with glasses.
I have had both the A7III and the A7C at the same time. Sure the image on the A7C is smaller in size but for me it is easier to see if an image is in focus on the A7C since the A7III EVF and also LCD is never really sharp in magnify mode (though one learns eventually that slightly soft is actually sharp and one can bump up picture profile sharpness to +3 which also helps for RAW shooters but messes up the JPEG).
This was one of the reasons I sold the A7III. And no, my dioptre setting was not set wrong and my copy was not worse than my friends that I cross referenced it with. Also for me as a permanent glasses wearer the smaller A7C image lets me see the corners when composing which I never did on the A7III.
I tested the A7CII & A7CR the other day and that EVF is now bigger in projected size but still good in sharpness and works ok with glasses....Show more →
I can imagine that same resolution on two different size screens will make some difference in sharpness of the image, but was it really that obvious?
I'm planning to sell my a7c and get a7iii, but cannot afford to have them both to compare, need to sell it first.
What do you mean you could never see corners in a7iii?
phinix wrote:
I can imagine that same resolution on two different size screens will make some difference in sharpness of the image, but was it really that obvious?
I'm planning to sell my a7c and get a7iii, but cannot afford to have them both to compare, need to sell it first.
What do you mean you could never see corners in a7iii?
1. I could not see any less sharpness on the A7CII/A7CR EVF than on the A7C despite them having scaled the image up with new EVF optics.
2. When you wear glasses as I do, your eye comes longer out from the EVF and thus you don't see the corners unless you wiggle the EVF around. The best EVF I have used in this regard is the A7RV, especially with the zoom out option enabled which makes the EVF image a little smaller so easier to see the corners (I checked but the A7CII/A7CR seems not to have the zoom out option for the EVF but it still worked rather well for me.
3. The A7III EVF and LCD lower sharpness is by my guess due to them being in lower, cheaper quality to get the cost down.
lattesweden wrote:
2. When you wear glasses as I do, your eye comes longer out from the EVF and thus you don't see the corners unless you wiggle the EVF around. The best EVF I have used in this regard is the A7RV, especially with the zoom out option enabled which makes the EVF image a little smaller so easier to see the corners (I checked but the A7CII/A7CR seems not to have the zoom out option for the EVF but it still worked rather well for me.
.
The key for use with glasses is the eye relief distance. It is the distance between the eye and the optic that allows the entire image to be visible. The A7RV zoom in effectively increases the eye relief at the expense of resolution.
It is interesting to hear about the better eye relief of the a7cii and A7cR.
tschopp wrote:
The key for use with glasses is the eye relief distance. It is the distance between the eye and the optic that allows the entire image to be visible. The A7RV zoom in effectively increases the eye relief at the expense of resolution.
It is interesting to hear about the better eye relief of the a7cii and A7cR.
I wish they published this info in the EVF specs.
I think they do, it's called eye point, for example for A1:
Eye Point
Approx. 25 mm from the eyepiece lens, 21 mm from the eyepiece frame at –1 m-₁ (CIPA standard)
phinix wrote:
I can imagine that same resolution on two different size screens will make some difference in sharpness of the image, but was it really that obvious?
I'm planning to sell my a7c and get a7iii, but cannot afford to have them both to compare, need to sell it first.
........
I have the A7M3 and the 2,359,296 dot evf is one of the few things I really dislike about it.
Grainy with a bit of shimmer near the plane of focus.
One post here awhile ago suggested using the shimmer to help with manual focus.
That's a side benefit I could do without.
Have a look through one before you buy.
gbinoz wrote:
I have the A7M3 and the 2,359,296 dot evf is one of the few things I really dislike about it.
Grainy with a bit of shimmer near the plane of focus.
One post here awhile ago suggested using the shimmer to help with manual focus.
That's a side benefit I could do without.
Have a look through one before you buy.
Yes, trying one out would be best.
What is shimmer? What do you mean by using it would help MF. I'm intrigued!
What is shimmer? What do you mean by using it would help MF. I'm intrigued!
It's just a small bit of aliasing showing up in certain situations:
Small In-focus relative subject movements, straight lines, high contrast, specular highlights.
Again, it's a personal thing whether it is a problem.
Only seen in in-focus areas, so if you see it that area should be in focus.
It is pretty subtle, I wouldn't take it's use as a focusing aid too seriously.
phinix-mike