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Sigma I-Series Lenses on 61 Mpixel A7RC?

  
 
Knut.
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p.2 #1 · p.2 #1 · Sigma I-Series Lenses on 61 Mpixel A7RC?


aCuria wrote:
You should examine each lens separately and assess if it complements your shooting preferences.

Take the 35/2 lens, for instance; it performs well at infinity but the closer it gets to its 0.18x maximum magnification, the softer it is. Hence, if you frequently shoot subjects within 1 meter of the camera, it might not be the best choice for you.

I also don't consider the 17/4 lens a top choice. For just around ~100g extra weight, the 16-35/4G lens is significantly more versatile and not far behind in optical performance compared to the prime lens.

On the other hand, the 65/2
...Show more


Very helpful information.
Thank you for pointing out that most f2.0 i-Series lenses are designed for excellent sharpness at infinity but emphasize smooth rendering at closer distances (actually an ideal situation for general photography).

I haven‘t seen the excellent gapping of the 65mm between 35 and 135mm pointed out before, but it is true. Adding the 17mm leads to a very even increase in horizontal field of view from 135 - 65 - 35 to 17mm.



Sep 18, 2023 at 01:56 AM
aCuria
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p.2 #2 · p.2 #2 · Sigma I-Series Lenses on 61 Mpixel A7RC?


Knut. wrote:
Very helpful information.
Thank you for pointing out that most f2.0 i-Series lenses are designed for excellent sharpness at infinity but emphasize smooth rendering at closer distances (actually an ideal situation for general photography).

I haven‘t seen the excellent gapping of the 65mm between 35 and 135mm pointed out before, but it is true. Adding the 17mm leads to a very even increase in horizontal field of view from 135 - 65 - 35 to 17mm.


I wouldn't describe the close focus softness of the 35i as having "smooth rendering."

“Smooth Rendering” is different from “soft”, ”soft” is a nicer way to describe a “not sharp”, “blur” or “muddy” image

It's important to note that Sigma achieves "smooth rendering" when the contemporary lenses is focused at infinity as well, and “smooth” is more about how the bokeh is rendered

In my view, the soft image produced at maximum magnification is a flaw specific to the 35i, unlike the 65i which doesn't exhibit this issue.



Sep 18, 2023 at 03:53 AM
chiron
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p.2 #3 · p.2 #3 · Sigma I-Series Lenses on 61 Mpixel A7RC?


aCuria wrote:
I wouldn't describe the close focus softness of the 35i as having "smooth rendering."

“Smooth Rendering” is different from “soft”, ”soft” is a nicer way to describe a “not sharp”, “blur” or “muddy” image

It's important to note that Sigma achieves "smooth rendering" when the contemporary lenses is focused at infinity as well, and “smooth” is more about how the bokeh is rendered

In my view, the soft image produced at maximum magnification is a flaw specific to the 35i, unlike the 65i which doesn't exhibit this issue.


Both the smoothness and some slight softness at MFD with a wide aperture come from less-corrected spherical aberrations, deliberately designed into the lens for the sake of rendering. It is less a flaw than a design trade-off that is one of the key selling points of the i series lenses. It is present to a greater or lesser degree in each of the lenses, at a maximum in the 45/2.8 and at a minimum in the 65/2.0. See this interview with the designers of the Sigma 45/2.8:

https://www.sigma-sein.com/en/ohsone/45mm-f2-8-dg-dn-contemporary/



Sep 18, 2023 at 06:27 AM
MAubrey
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p.2 #4 · p.2 #4 · Sigma I-Series Lenses on 61 Mpixel A7RC?


If you like the 65i, you'll probably also like the 50i. They share nearly identical optical designs.


Sep 18, 2023 at 08:27 AM
Robin Smith
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p.2 #5 · p.2 #5 · Sigma I-Series Lenses on 61 Mpixel A7RC?


Hopefully a pretty straight forward question but maybe not. Can the smaller full frame Sigma I-Series lenses support the resolution of Sony’s 61 Mpixel sensor in the new Sony A7CR?

Yes. These are all modern lenses designed precisely for just such a purpose. Just like Canon's, Tamron's, and Nikon's lenses are.



Sep 18, 2023 at 09:34 AM
InFocus2014
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p.2 #6 · p.2 #6 · Sigma I-Series Lenses on 61 Mpixel A7RC?


When my A7CR arrives, my lightweight kit for street photography will likely be the optically outstanding GM 24mm f1.4 @445grams (which crops to 36mm) and PZ 16-35mm f4 (353 grams) I can also see the Sigma 90mm f2.8 (292 grams) in my future, for use with this camera.

I have been wanting an updated RXRII for some time and this might be it.



Sep 18, 2023 at 09:40 AM
lattesweden
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p.2 #7 · p.2 #7 · Sigma I-Series Lenses on 61 Mpixel A7RC?


InFocus2014 wrote:
When my A7CR arrives, my lightweight kit for street photography will likely be the optically outstanding GM 24mm f1.4 @445grams (which crops to 36mm) and PZ 16-35mm f4 (353 grams) I can also see the Sigma 90mm f2.8 (292 grams) in my future, for use with this camera.

I have been wanting an updated RXRII for some time and this might be it.


My small kit on my A7CmkI is Samyang 24/1.8, Sony 28-60, Samyang 75/1.8. With body one lands at 1136 grams.



Sep 18, 2023 at 09:57 AM
swldstn
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p.2 #8 · p.2 #8 · Sigma I-Series Lenses on 61 Mpixel A7RC?


InFocus2014 wrote:
When my A7CR arrives, my lightweight kit for street photography will likely be the optically outstanding GM 24mm f1.4 @445grams (which crops to 36mm) and PZ 16-35mm f4 (353 grams) I can also see the Sigma 90mm f2.8 (292 grams) in my future, for use with this camera.

I have been wanting an updated RXRII for some time and this might be it.


Got me thinking. I’ve got a lot of flexibility but might choose to go out with the
- Sony FE PZ 16-35/4 G ( if I keep it )
- Sigma 35/2 DG DN Contemporary
- Sigma 65/2 DG DN Contemporary

Could add the small Sigma 90/2.8 DG DN Contemporary as well.
May substitute the FE 20/1.8 G for the 16-35/4. Found the Sigma 20/2 had too much distortion when compared to the Sony and the Sony’s weight is only 3 grams more.

These are all lenses I have now. I have been trying to sell the PZ (see FM Buy & Sell) because I have the FE 16-35/2.8 GM II on order. The new GM II is replacing my V1 which my son borrowed for his A7SIII because I may never see it again.

Edited on Sep 18, 2023 at 11:06 AM · View previous versions



Sep 18, 2023 at 10:13 AM
Jonas B
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p.2 #9 · p.2 #9 · Sigma I-Series Lenses on 61 Mpixel A7RC?


swldstn wrote:
[...]
These are all lenses I have now. I have been trying to sell the PZ (see FM Buy & Sell) because I have the FE 16-35/2.8 GM II on order. The new GM II is replacing my V1 which my son borrowed for his A7SIII because I may never see again.


Hmm....If you don't mind: what is the rational for replacing the PZ 16-35 with the FE 16-35/2.8 GM II?



Sep 18, 2023 at 10:43 AM
swldstn
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p.2 #10 · p.2 #10 · Sigma I-Series Lenses on 61 Mpixel A7RC?


Jonas B wrote:
Hmm....If you don't mind: what is the rational for replacing the PZ 16-35 with the FE 16-35/2.8 GM II?


Well for events where I use my 16-35 along side my 24-70 I want the brighter f/2.8 aperture to match it. The use it indoors for group work. Indoor architecture is another application for me so f/4 is slower than I like. I’ve been using an f/2.8 16-35 since my Canon EF 16-35/2,8 II L. The f/4 are good outdoors for landscape work. I do also have the 14mm and 20mm GM/G primes when I might need more light. Hope that helps.



Sep 18, 2023 at 11:14 AM
 


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Jonas B
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p.2 #11 · p.2 #11 · Sigma I-Series Lenses on 61 Mpixel A7RC?


swldstn wrote:
Well for events where I use my 16-35 along side my 24-70 I want the brighter f/2.8 aperture to match it. The use it indoors for group work. Indoor architecture is another application for me so f/4 is slower than I like. I’ve been using an f/2.8 16-35 since my Canon EF 16-35/2,8 II L. The f/4 are good outdoors for landscape work. I do also have the 14mm and 20mm GM/G primes when I might need more light. Hope that helps.


OK, I see. Thank you.
Well, speed is the obvious reason. Perhaps for indoor use... but I don't know. For me that stop of ligth isn't worth another 200 grams and another USD 1.100.
Please note I'm not saying it's wrong buying the GM ii zoom. I have wondered for a while who would buy the GM ii and why, hence my question.



Sep 18, 2023 at 11:24 AM
swldstn
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p.2 #12 · p.2 #12 · Sigma I-Series Lenses on 61 Mpixel A7RC?


Jonas B wrote:
OK, I see. Thank you.
Well, speed is the obvious reason. Perhaps for indoor use... but I don't know. For me that stop of ligth isn't worth another 200 grams and another USD 1.100.
Please note I'm not saying it's wrong buying the GM ii zoom. I have wondered for a while who would buy the GM ii and why, hence my question.


The f/4 vs f/2.8 trade off for the holy trinity of lenses for Sony, Canon, Nikon, and for Fuji on APS-C is a big question for sure. Each of the suppliers now have both families rounded out I believe. All the other suppliers, except Sony, appear to have equal quality L, for Canon, and S for Nikon, at both f-stops. Sony has decided that it’s G for f/4 and GM for f/2.8 but it’s not clear to me if there is really much difference lately. Some I know will buy the slower f/4 and then supplement each with an f/1.8 or f/1.4 prime in the range for indoor use. Great but then the weight in the camera bag can actually be heavier. There are times for me I will only travel with the GM II f/2.8 trinity and that’s it. Or just with primes to go lighter. Lots of flexibility these days.
As I get older I may transition to f/4s.



Sep 18, 2023 at 12:37 PM
Jonas B
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p.2 #13 · p.2 #13 · Sigma I-Series Lenses on 61 Mpixel A7RC?


swldstn wrote:
The f/4 vs f/2.8 trade off for the holy trinity of lenses for Sony, Canon, Nikon, and for Fuji on APS-C is a big question for sure. Each of the suppliers now have both families rounded out I believe. All the other suppliers, except Sony, appear to have equal quality L, for Canon, and S for Nikon, at both f-stops. Sony has decided that it’s G for f/4 and GM for f/2.8 but it’s not clear to me if there is really much difference lately. Some I know will buy the slower f/4 and then supplement each with an f/1.8
...Show more

I get it.
Supplementing the G f/4 lens with an f/1.4 prime as you mention above makes sense. To me replacing the f74 lens with another more expensive and heavier f72.8 isn't worth it, also as mentioned. I have thought a lot about this since buying the 40/2.5 G when it was released. The fact we arent shooting Tri-X anymore but instead using cameras good at up to ISO 3200 or 6400 or where your limitis more than makes up for that stop of light. And yes, I'm already older.



Sep 18, 2023 at 12:57 PM
swldstn
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p.2 #14 · p.2 #14 · Sigma I-Series Lenses on 61 Mpixel A7RC?


Jonas B wrote:
I get it.
Supplementing the G f/4 lens with an f/1.4 prime as you mention above makes sense. To me replacing the f74 lens with another more expensive and heavier f72.8 isn't worth it, also as mentioned. I have thought a lot about this since buying the 40/2.5 G when it was released. The fact we arent shooting Tri-X anymore but instead using cameras good at up to ISO 3200 or 6400 or where your limitis more than makes up for that stop of light. And yes, I'm already older.


Age is a state of mind. I remember shooting Tri-X. I had my own darkroom and used it a lot. I have the 40/2.5 G as well bur where was the 28/2 or other ones to fill out the family. That is what got me into the Sigma I-Series specifically for lighter travel than my GMs which I’m very happy with.



Sep 18, 2023 at 01:56 PM
Knut.
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p.2 #15 · p.2 #15 · Sigma I-Series Lenses on 61 Mpixel A7RC?


Your discussion (swldstn/Jonas B) gives a lot of food for thought. Basically it is

1) A set of 2.8 zooms and that be it, or
2) Set of f 4 zooms for daytime shooting and f1.4/1.8 primes as a supplement for indoor / night shooting without a tripod.

Set 2 is more weight, but might be feasable for travel if you can always leave some lenses in a safe place (hotel room) otherwise lugging around the weight might be cumbersome.

Im considering a third route: Only one (rather slow) zoom in the middle field and 2 fast primes to fill out the extremes + low light chalenges. Examples:

20-70 f4 + 50/f1.4 + 85/1.4
16-35 f4 pz + 35/f1.4 + 85/1.4
12-24 f4 + 35/f1.4 + 85/f1.4
12-24 f4 + 24/f1.4 + 85/f1.4

Any additional considerations to this approach?



Sep 18, 2023 at 02:59 PM
swldstn
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p.2 #16 · p.2 #16 · Sigma I-Series Lenses on 61 Mpixel A7RC?


Knut. wrote:
Your discussion (swldstn/Jonas B) gives a lot of food for thought. Basically it is

1) A set of 2.8 zooms and that be it, or
2) Set of f 4 zooms for daytime shooting and f1.4/1.8 primes as a supplement for indoor / night shooting without a tripod.

Set 2 is more weight, but might be feasable for travel if you can always leave some lenses in a safe place (hotel room) otherwise lugging around the weight might be cumbersome.

Im considering a third route: Only one (rather slow) zoom in the middle field and 2 fast primes to fill out the extremes +
...Show more

There are several strategies that can work.It can depend a lot on what you like to shoot or maybe where you’re traveling to. Your selection all have an 85/1.4 probably for portraits, which is fine. Some may like another alternative, and there are many like a 24/1.4 + 50/1.4 + 70-200/4 if you need reach for example or replace the 70-200/4 with a 70-300/4-5.6. So owning more lenses and shuffling your kit around can be a common practice. That is me.
I own fast or faster primes from 24 up to 135mm and fast zooms from 15/16 to 200mm but also a family of small compact primes. Of course I love gear and variety and never met a piece of fine glass that I didn’t want to own. Various camera bodies contribute to that obsession.



Sep 18, 2023 at 05:06 PM
lattesweden
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p.2 #17 · p.2 #17 · Sigma I-Series Lenses on 61 Mpixel A7RC?


Knut. wrote:
Your discussion (swldstn/Jonas B) gives a lot of food for thought. Basically it is

1) A set of 2.8 zooms and that be it, or
2) Set of f 4 zooms for daytime shooting and f1.4/1.8 primes as a supplement for indoor / night shooting without a tripod.

Set 2 is more weight, but might be feasable for travel if you can always leave some lenses in a safe place (hotel room) otherwise lugging around the weight might be cumbersome.

Im considering a third route: Only one (rather slow) zoom in the middle field and 2 fast primes to fill out the extremes +
...Show more

The lenses you list I would put on a larger body than an A7C.

Let me explain: While you off course can mount and use larger lenses on the A7C, I don't, since they don't balance well on my A7CmkI and also the distance between the lens and the grip is smaller than on other A7-series bodys so my knuckles hit lenses that protrudes out in diameter (the grip on the A7CII and A7CR is a little larger so might be different).

I think the A7CmkI at least should be shot with lenses that have the same diameter as the mount and not much heavier than 1/3 of a kilo (333 grams). Otherwise one looses the idea with that body.

Also the shutter maxes out at 1/4000 so using f1.4 lenses wide open might be hard in strong sunlight without ND filter. Also the mech shutter shutter in the A7C is EFCS only, so no mechanical first curtain which means risk for HSS banding with flash at shorter shutter speeds and also bokeh distortion with fast lenses as well as highlight bokeh circles chopping risk. One can mitigate slow moving subjects a little by instead using the e-shutter (which goes to 1/8000). The e-shutter reads out at 1/30 I believe, but it don't do flash.

So for me, the A7C is a body for small primes at f1.8 - f2 etc and small zooms like the Sony 28-60.

As I wrote above already, Samyang 24/1.8, Sony 28-60, Samyang 75 mm makes a really nice setup that handles most tasks and still give the advantage of an FF sensor its use with possibility for low light shots and shallow depth of field.
The Samy 24 is good indoors in low light at cafés and restaurants to shot the travel company and landscapes etc. It also stand quite well against flare.
The 28-60 is a good daylight zoom. Again stand well against flare.
The Samy 75 is a nice portrait lens.

We will probably get a Samyang 20/1.8 in Q4 this year in the Tiny series (since they have announced such in the V-AF series which is based on the Tiny series). If it seems good enough, I might get it, but for travel it will be good for landscapes etc but a little to wide for cafes and restaurants etc.

The only thing with the Samyang lenses are their copy to copy variation so one needs to buy from a source where one can return them and test after delivery. But good copys are sharp.

Other lenses I would consider depending on usecase:
Voigtländer 15/4.5 and other small Voigtländer lenses.
Zeiss Loxia 21/2.8 and other small Loxia lenses, the 21 is a little on the heavy side though.
Sony 28/2 and Sony 35/1.8
Samyang 35/1.8 and 45/1.8
Sony 55/1.8

And to get the A7C as small as it can get, the Samyang 35/2.8 (which might recently have been discontinued)

Why no Sigma lenses? I do have the 85/1.4 DG DN and it is a Marvelous lens but I think the I-series is too heavy and the lenses that are light enough are too slow aperture wise.

My two cents at least and no write up due to inflation here :-)



Sep 18, 2023 at 05:58 PM
aCuria
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p.2 #18 · p.2 #18 · Sigma I-Series Lenses on 61 Mpixel A7RC?


swldstn wrote:
Well for events where I use my 16-35 along side my 24-70 I want the brighter f/2.8 aperture to match it. The use it indoors for group work. Indoor architecture is another application for me so f/4 is slower than I like. I’ve been using an f/2.8 16-35 since my Canon EF 16-35/2,8 II L. The f/4 are good outdoors for landscape work. I do also have the 14mm and 20mm GM/G primes when I might need more light. Hope that helps.


I've utilized the 16-35L for event photography before. However, for indoor group photography, it had to be stopped down to f/4 or f/5.6 due to depth of field considerations.

The same applies to architecture—16mm might not be wide enough, and shooting stopped down on a tripod is often preferable.

While I understand the desire for f/2.8, the reasons mentioned aren't compelling.

If I were still engaged in professional event photography, I'd opt for the 16-35GMii. The PZ's inability to zoom during a burst can lead to missed shots, as I've experienced recently when covering two events (as a volunteer)

However, the choice would also depend on whether the lens can maintain autofocus zooming. Some lenses, like the 100-400GM, struggle to focus quickly enough to keep a subject sharp when zooming in.

In addition if your primary camera has a 24-70 attached, then isn’t it better to have a 12-24GM on the second body? I often used a 70-200L, so the 16-35L made more sense on the second body when the 70-200 is in use

That said, as I primarily shoot for myself now, the 16-35’s low weight when used on a stick has been an advantage.

I really like the high magnification in the 16-35GMii though, it’s a tough decision

Edited on Sep 19, 2023 at 04:26 AM · View previous versions



Sep 18, 2023 at 08:07 PM
Gerald Brooks
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p.2 #19 · p.2 #19 · Sigma I-Series Lenses on 61 Mpixel A7RC?


Reading all this with a7CR and the Sigma i series in mind, I'm looking into the 50mm f2. That said, in appreciation of the f2.8 look of the best zoom lenses, and wanting the best lens to be on the camera most of the time, would the 16-35 GM II really be too big? I know from APS-C that the Sony 85mm f1.8 carries by the lens and the handling at that size is no problem, other than what other people or I may think. Plus, that range would optimize the coverage of having 26 MP in crop mode.


Sep 18, 2023 at 09:03 PM
RomanMF
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p.2 #20 · p.2 #20 · Sigma I-Series Lenses on 61 Mpixel A7RC?


The 65mm is nuts. It’s so damn sharp. I love mine.


Sep 19, 2023 at 12:38 AM
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