Petegh wrote:
Hi all, I just had confirmation today from the Australian distributor, that Zeiss are discontinuing all of their still lenses and filters: no more Loxia, Batis etc.
End of an era
Are you discussing this above message on all these pages ?
What proofs where provided on credibility of the source. Who is that mysterious "distributor", etc
How do you know that this message was not intended for an April 1st post (and not just missed the date by a couple of months)?
What? I have now ordered the Batis 135. Just in case! :-)
No, I really want to buy the 135 Batis, fantastic lens with very delicate colors. I may then sell my 85GM even though it has a unique bokeh. In LR I often spend hours trying to do a GM with Batis colors and contrasts... I always hate to part with a lens, but I use the 85 GM far too seldom. I would then have Batis 25, 40, 85 and 135.
molson wrote:
Zeiss lenses are optically superior, but unfortunately for them, their superior characteristics are too subtle for clueless YouTube shills to articulate or to measure with "test charts" taped to their basement walls.
Zeiss hasn’t produced camera lenses since the 1980s. All of the “Zeiss” lenses on the market are made and designed by other companies who are simply licensing the Zeiss brand/logo.
Batis and Otus lenses are actually Cosina lenses. Loxia are Tamron. ZA are Sony. Etc.
jaygould wrote:
Zeiss hasn’t produced camera lenses since the 1980s. All of the “Zeiss” lenses on the market are made and designed by other companies who are simply licensing the Zeiss brand/logo.
Batis and Otus lenses are actually Cosina lenses. Loxia are Tamron. ZA are Sony. Etc.
Does Zeiss do marketing and distribution themselves?
jaygould wrote:
Zeiss hasn’t produced camera lenses since the 1980s. All of the “Zeiss” lenses on the market are made and designed by other companies who are simply licensing the Zeiss brand/logo.
Batis and Otus lenses are actually Cosina lenses. Loxia are Tamron. ZA are Sony. Etc.
Cosina only advertises the ZM, ZF/ZE Classic, Milvus, and Otis as being manufactured by them. Batis patents indicate Tamron designed and produced them, Touit patents belong to Fuji, and Tokina is supporting the Loxias (no indication if they actually manufactured them, but it would make sense since their MF 20 for the e-mount doesn't include focus-distance indication, like the Loxias, where all of Cosina's e-mount lenses do).
freaklikeme wrote:
Cosina only advertises the ZM, ZF/ZE Classic, Milvus, and Otis as being manufactured by them. Batis patents indicate Tamron designed and produced them, Touit patents belong to Fuji, and Tokina is supporting the Loxias (no indication if they actually manufactured them, but it would make sense since their MF 20 for the e-mount doesn't include focus-distance indication, like the Loxias, where all of Cosina's e-mount lenses do).
You’re right, Batis are Tamron lenses as well (not Cosina).
jaygould wrote:
Zeiss hasn’t produced camera lenses since the 1980s. All of the “Zeiss” lenses on the market are made and designed by other companies who are simply licensing the Zeiss brand/logo.
Batis and Otus lenses are actually Cosina lenses. Loxia are Tamron. ZA are Sony. Etc.
Completely untrue. Batis are Tamron designs, yes, hence not rendering like true Zeiss lenses, but Classic, Otus, Milvus and Loxia are all authentic Zeiss designs that are simply manufactured by Cosina. The ZA lenses have never been considered true Zeiss lenses and are not even listed on Zeiss's website.
MKRhodes wrote:
Completely untrue. Batis are Tamron designs, yes, hence not rendering like true Zeiss lenses, but Classic, Otus, Milvus and Loxia are all authentic Zeiss designs that are simply manufactured by Cosina. The ZA lenses have never been considered true Zeiss lenses and are not even listed on Zeiss's website.
The source of your information, please?
The usual account is that Zeiss designs the lenses; Cosina makes Loxia to Zeiss's specs; and Tamron makes Batiis to Zeiss's specs. It seems very unlikely to me that Zeiss just sells its brand name to label a lens designed and made by someone else.
If you can cite a source, other than some rep told some dealer who told a friend of yours, I'd be interested to hear more.
There are Tamron patents that look like dead ringers for some of the Batis lenses. Now whether Zeiss gave the patents to Tamron as part of some deal, who knows.
Or I guess it's possible Zeiss didn't patent their designs and Tamron took advantage of them.
Many people assume that Cosina makes Loxia lenses but Cosina has never stated anything about making Loxia whereas they openly state that they make ZM, Otus, Milvus & Classic lines, and they also handle distribution of those lines in Japan.
As mentioned by freaklikeme, Zeiss offloaded Loxia lens distribution and after-market support in Japan to Kenko Tokina along with Batis and Touit and not to Cosina.
I think Loxia is probably manufactured by some other company than Cosina as the housings are quite different from what Cosina usually makes and even the electronic communication support on the lenses is different from CV E-mount lenses, but whoever makes them has never been public information so it's up to guesswork.
Our Aust distributor is emphatic that CZ is exiting the stills lens market, as petegh said at the top. CZ's loss of interest has been evident for several years now - so many missed opportunities, such as an Otus-Light range for mirrorless size/weight cameras.
Sony people took another L with Cosina's erratic lens release program. They are pointing the fire hose in all directions trying to cater to almost all modern mounts - even defunct F cameras and APS-C. They even turned away from making a 50/1 for Sony users, but gave it to Nikon Z users in Feb 2023.
They abandoned Sony MF photographers back in April 2021, which is ironic when you consider Sony's pivotal role in reviving manual focus lenses with the release of the a7 series. C'est la vie.
All Batis and Loxia lenses are 100% developed by Zeiss. Even if Zeiss has the lenses manufactured on the Tamron production line, they comply with Zeiss quality control. Batis and Loxia are sold by Zeiss, for example on the Zeiss website. ZA lenses are Sony lenses with a Zeiss label. They are distributed by Sony, for example on the Sony website. I don't know to what extent Zeiss was involved in the development of ZA lenses. But the 50/1.4 ZA, for example, differs significantly from Sony lenses in terms of colors and image plasticity. It has a bit of Zeiss DNA.
ZEISS lenses are developed exclusively by ZEISS. ZEISS also determines the features of the lenses, such as their focal length and internal construction, in line with the company’s product strategy. Sony/ZEISS lenses are jointly developed by ZEISS and Sony. ZEISS supports Sony throughout the optical design and development process and then tests and approves the prototypes. Finally, ZEISS determines the test specifications for serial production."
"In all its brand partnerships, ZEISS sets the technical and quality standards to which partners, such as Sony, must adhere. ZEISS regularly audits the production process of Sony/ZEISS lenses in Sony’s factories. ZEISS experts examine the production processes, management systems and measuring installations. ZEISS certifies the suppliers and provides all the equipment that is needed to ensure product quality, including the equipment of third-party suppliers."
ZEISS lenses are developed exclusively by ZEISS. ZEISS also determines the features of the lenses, such as their focal length and internal construction, in line with the company’s product strategy. Sony/ZEISS lenses are jointly developed by ZEISS and Sony. ZEISS supports Sony throughout the optical design and development process and then tests and approves the prototypes. Finally, ZEISS determines the test specifications for serial production."
"In all its brand partnerships, ZEISS sets the technical and quality standards to which partners, such as Sony, must adhere. ZEISS regularly audits the production process of Sony/ZEISS lenses in Sony’s factories. ZEISS experts examine the production processes, management systems and measuring installations. ZEISS certifies the suppliers and provides all the equipment that is needed to ensure product quality, including the equipment of third-party suppliers."
philip_pj wrote:
Our Aust distributor is emphatic that CZ is exiting the stills lens market, as petegh said at the top. CZ's loss of interest has been evident for several years now - so many missed opportunities, such as an Otus-Light range for mirrorless size/weight cameras.
Sony people took another L with Cosina's erratic lens release program. They are pointing the fire hose in all directions trying to cater to almost all modern mounts - even defunct F cameras and APS-C. They even turned away from making a 50/1 for Sony users, but gave it to Nikon Z users in Feb 2023.
They abandoned Sony MF photographers back in April 2021, which is ironic when you consider Sony's pivotal role in reviving manual focus lenses with the release of the a7 series. C'est la vie. ...Show more →
Sigma has enjoyed success with their I-series lenses, like e.g. their 45/2.8. They are among the few AF lenses that have this solid classical feel to them. Maybe Cosina is feeling the heat, and have moved to Z-mount where Sigma I-series aren’t available.
Am I the only one who is reminded about Sony's strategy re a-mount? "We'll continue supporting the mount, until we don't".
It's funny that the PR statement and the comments from the "ambassador" cited above, talk about a lot of things except new lenses. It's kinda hard to talk away the reality of no new lens being released in five years. The writing is on the wall. Of course, it's everybody's choice to do with that whatever they please.
As for lenses being made by Zeiss itself, apart from expensive cine lenses, I seem to recall that some fancy m-mount lenses (the ZM 85 2 and ZM 15 2.8) were made in Germany.
