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Archive 2022 · R5 & R6 Vs R3, R3, R7 & R6II menu differences

  
 
Zenon Char
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · R5 & R6 Vs R3, R3, R7 & R6II menu differences


I'm looking at the R6II manual and it appears Canon has made the similar change to the R6II as it did to the R3 and R7.

Can someone explain this. On the R5, 6 there is a menu called Initial AI Servo pt for. With my R5 I'm on Auto. When the camera wakes up I don't need to press any buttons and the white pre-focus square is looking for an eye. I press the shutter half way the blue AF square takes over. I don't use a BBF for this. With ML I work with the shutter button for both Metering and AF Start. I have other uses for the BBF.

1st image shows the R5 & 6 manuals that have Initial AI Servo pt for.

R3, R7 and R6II do not have the Initial AI Servo pt menu. The 2nd image shows this new menu for the R3 & R7. Subject Tracking.

The 3rd shows the R6II menu. More text, same location, same Icon.

















Nov 17, 2022 at 10:49 AM
rscheffler
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · R5 & R6 Vs R3, R3, R7 & R6II menu differences


I think it means you can use one of the wide zone AF settings and it will only follow the subject within that area, rather than the full frame.

On the R6 I have initial servo af point for face/eye tracking set to pick up from my manually set focus point. I BBF with a manually set AF point without tracking and have the * button set up for tracking. I'll switch from BBF to * and tracking will pick up from my manually set AF point. For me this is better in environments with more than one person/face so that I can be more sure the camera will focus on the intended subject (though sometimes it still jumps to someone else). In a way it's kind of like focus and recompose. I'll move the AF point over the subject, switch to * and recompose.



Nov 18, 2022 at 01:50 AM
garyvot
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · R5 & R6 Vs R3, R3, R7 & R6II menu differences


As I understand it, the basic difference is that on the R5 and R6, subject tracking is a separate AF mode which always uses the entire screen, and you can choose the starting AF point where it will look first. On the newer cameras, it is a behavior that can be toggled on or off for any of the regular AF modes (spot AF, wide area AF, etc.).

So, by default on the newer models, tracking is constrained to operate within the portion of the screen dictated by your selected AF mode. I believe the "Whole Area Tracking" menu gives you the option of having the camera switch automatically to the entire screen when a subject is detected (for tracking).



Nov 18, 2022 at 07:11 AM
Zenon Char
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · R5 & R6 Vs R3, R3, R7 & R6II menu differences


Yes for R5 and 6 the Initial Servo AF pt for can be set to use a specific AF starting point or let the system do that automatically which is when it Auto.

Got some feedback from a R3 user which would apply to the R7. That enabling that menu basically activities the white pre-focus square which will start to look for an eye without any user user intervention. The icon in the description shows the whit pre-focus square. So the same as "Initial Servo AF pt for"

The instructions for the R6II says Whole area tracking Servo AF says while shutter is "half pressed". I hope that is just a typical translation thingy and it works the same as the R3/7. That is a nice feature to have.





Nov 18, 2022 at 10:38 AM
ChrisHA
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · R5 & R6 Vs R3, R3, R7 & R6II menu differences


Coming from a long line of 1D bodies, I like the separate tracking on/off capability (tied to the user defined focus area) on the R3 so much that I’m having a harder time adjusting to the recently acquired R5. Could Canon easily update the R5/R6 with firmware? Wishful thinking, I know. I guess I’m doing the same workaround as Scheffler (one BBF button programmed for One Shot and the other for Servo)? It feels like a step backwards in my situation and a pain for those who shoot with multiple bodies/menus.


Nov 19, 2022 at 03:43 AM
Zenon Char
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · R5 & R6 Vs R3, R3, R7 & R6II menu differences


When I had a 7D I used the shutter for AF and metering. I never had problem keeping the shutter half pressed. I started to use the BBF with my 7D2.

I've completely changed my shooting style with my R5. I am always in Face and Eye detect unless I'm shooting vehicles, etc. I have Initial AF servo pt on Auto. When I wake the camera up it looks for an eye and usually finds it. I will half press the shutter as well. If does not find my desired subject I will use one of the 3 BBF buttons to get my subject in focus. I'll put the AF point/s anywhere on the body as that just needs to be in focus. I don't worry about the eye. As soon as the body gets in focus I release the BBF and the eye snaps in. Also great when you have 2 or 3 other subjects and you are focusing on one and then you want to focus on another.

AF-On = Single Point.

* = Zone for BIF.

AF point selector = Spot AF which is my least used option.

An example. I was using single point to what I call force focus on the bird I wanted. Force focus is a nickname I came up with because I'm forcing the system to do what I want it to do, not what it wants to do. I could flip back and forth as much as I liked. I could focus on post the bird was sitting on and the eye would snap in. The bird I'm focusing on barely has visible but it found the head. I don't care and why it won't focus and I don't waste time on it.

This video changed everything for me. Between about 2:30 and 6 minutes. The Fro is using Expansion AF for this method. Good examples at minute 3:10.










Nov 19, 2022 at 12:56 PM
rscheffler
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · R5 & R6 Vs R3, R3, R7 & R6II menu differences


That's funny because other than sports, I use spot AF point nearly all the time because I find all the other points huge in comparison. For sports I use the 5-point option (central point surrounded by four expansion points). Most of my non-sports work is either people related events where I use spot AF to basically land on the person and then switch to face detection (if there is more than one person in the scene), or it's static natural/urban landscapes where I have ample time to move the AF point around (and often use magnification to confirm it's actually focused where I want it).

Yesterday at a football game on a second R6 with a 70-200, I used the wide horizontal zone AF box for close action grab shots. It will generally focus on the closest object but if it sees a face or detects that it's a person, seems to prioritize that. It worked pretty well for WRs jumping for passes in the corner of the end zone, etc. But sometimes it would pick up the defender behind them instead, perhaps because their face was recognizable whereas the receiver's face was turned partially away to look back at the incoming pass...

ChrisHA wrote:
Coming from a long line of 1D bodies, I like the separate tracking on/off capability (tied to the user defined focus area) on the R3 so much that I’m having a harder time adjusting to the recently acquired R5. Could Canon easily update the R5/R6 with firmware? Wishful thinking, I know. I guess I’m doing the same workaround as Scheffler (one BBF button programmed for One Shot and the other for Servo)? It feels like a step backwards in my situation and a pain for those who shoot with multiple bodies/menus.


Based on the R6 that firmware update is called the R6II. Not a big surprise, IMO.

I hear what you're saying but I'm happy with how I set up the R6. It doesn't really bother me that subject/face/eye detection is full area because I have it set up to pick up from my manually set AF point tied to the AF-ON button when I press the * button. That said, it could be a different matter if I had an R3, 7 as well. It's a reason I always liked getting two of the same cameras for seamless switching between the two during events, games, etc.

I started my mirrorless tests with the R3 and R7 and maybe didn't have enough time with them to really get a proper feel for how this difference in subject detection is implemented. I kind of didn't mesh with it on those cameras. I've found the simpler implementation on the R5/6 is OK. What I don't like about it on the R5/6 is the inability to switch eyes (or faces) after the camera locks on a face and finds an eye to focus on, because often enough it's the wrong, far eye, for some reason. I'm hoping the AF algorithm in the R6II is improved.



Nov 21, 2022 at 01:03 PM





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