The old dynamic AF didn't need explaining how it worked, you could see how it worked.
Interesting how now everyones trying to explain how the new system works, I've got a headache!
For me in practice the old Dynamic works better than the new, I've not read anything on here to convince me differently yet, or give me confidence on the new dynamic, but he ho I'll keep reading.
If anyone from Nikon NPS is reading this thread, surely you must admit that your documentation of AF area modes (and especially Dynamic Area modes) is not clear enough for photographers to get the most out of these systems. Most photographers on this thread have read all the available Nikon documentation, but this material is not enough. And if the new version of dynamic area modes on the D5/D500 is a bug of some sort, please let us know. There is nothing wrong in admitting a mistake. Surely it is far worse to say nothing and give the appearance of not caring about your customers.
Sincerely, Keith Williamson
kwilliam8 wrote:
If anyone from Nikon NPS is reading this thread, surely you must admit that your documentation of AF area modes (and especially Dynamic Area modes) is not clear enough for photographers to get the most out of these systems. Most photographers on this thread have read all the available Nikon documentation, but this material is not enough. And if the new version of dynamic area modes on the D5/D500 is a bug of some sort, please let us know. There is nothing wrong in admitting a mistake. Surely it is far worse to say nothing and give the appearance of not caring about your customers.
Sincerely, Keith Williamson...Show more →
Steve Perry wrote:
I agree with Snapsy on this. While I understand and can even appreciate where the new system can be useful, I still think from on overall sense the old system was superior.
If you needed faster target switching, just turn the delay under A3 off and use an area small enough that you can get it completely off the subject as needed.
In fact, if you look at the number of photographers who have started using Group or 3D instead of Dynamic with the D5/D500, it seems as if most people find the new Dynamic modes leave them wanting. Also, look at the sheer number of posters (some very accomplished photographers) who have had difficulty with Dynamic. The sad truth is, I'm not entirely confident just knowing how it works is enough to overcome the change in behavior.
I realize that 3D now does a better job and may be a better choice for the times we used to rely on Dynamic, but 3D comes with its own set of problems. First, you'll drive it insane if the subject and surrounding area are of similar colors. Second, you can't isolate it the way you can Dynamic.
sk66 - even you mention that, while it's not worse, it's not any better either. Why change it if it's not an improvement?
I'll double down on what I said before - if this was a deliberate change, why not leave a legacy mode in place as well? ...Show more →
I have maintained for awhile that fellows were getting all excited over group AF, as dynamic wasn't working properly. Properly as in how it used to work. Group is a niche AF mode for a specific set of circumstances, and I believe fellows are using it as a work around, knowingly or unknowingly.
But your work and the other fellows who helped at least gave me the understanding of what's going on; how it does work. So it can be lived with or worked around. I appreciate that that you've taken a very straight forward position on it, rather than the wishy washy position some reviewers take.
I've shot with the D4 for 3 years plus, just recently upgrading that to a D4s. There's wasn't much I couldn't shoot BIF wise with that, and the 4s should be a step up. The D500 is mainly a "reach" body for me and the workaround for the reach might me selling the D500 and 500VR and getting a 600E, although a more costly option and not a road I particularly want to go down.
Again, thanks for the time in figuring out what's going on with the Dynamic AF. I knew it didn't work right, but have neither the time nor inclination to have figured it out. And probably not the knowledge of where to have started.
Since having the D500 I've had little opportunity to use the camera for BIF, the last two days or so I did, without much success, although in AF-C single point stuff is spot on. I tried dynamic 153, I just didn't understand what was going on, northing seemed to follow the bird, OOF shots. I had decent results with group mode, I haven't had a chance to check auto mode.
Then I come across this thread, I check out the D modes as suggested by Steve Perry and "BINGO" effectively the D range be it 25 75 153 points just does nothing different from the center point.....totlly useless.
Now checking out the auto mode it functions fine, and follows the subject, ie. that which is nearest to the camera......
3D mode follows as it should locking nicely on to the subject albeit with a slight delay it does however hang in!
I will try the Dynamic mode against a blanc sky and see what gives in that situation.
So all the dynamic modes hang on to nothing more than the center point..........well now at least I know what's going down.......a real dynamic spherical mess up Nikon!!.....
BTW. Does anyone actually use auto mode with AF-C and if so how do you find it?
I think the only subject I would consider Auto mode for would be swallows against blue sky. In that situation you want the AF system to grab the swallow as you try to frame it with whatever point it falls under. I have yet to try this with Nikon but this is how I had some success with Canon gear shooting them.
daves cliches wrote:
Since having the D500 I've had little opportunity to use the camera for BIF, the last two days or so I did, without much success, although in AF-C single point stuff is spot on. I tried dynamic 153, I just didn't understand what was going on, northing seemed to follow the bird, OOF shots. I had decent results with group mode, I haven't had a chance to check auto mode.
Then I come across this thread, I check out the D modes as suggested by Steve Perry and "BINGO" effectively the D range be it 25 75 153 points just does nothing different from the center point.....totlly useless.
Now checking out the auto mode it functions fine, and follows the subject, ie. that which is nearest to the camera......
3D mode follows as it should locking nicely on to the subject albeit with a slight delay it does however hang in!
I will try the Dynamic mode against a blanc sky and see what gives in that situation.
So all the dynamic modes hang on to nothing more than the center point..........well now at least I know what's going down.......a real dynamic spherical mess up Nikon!!.....
BTW. Does anyone actually use auto mode with AF-C and if so how do you find it?...Show more →
Make sure you check out the findings I posted at the top of page 9. Dynamic mode does keep on the subject, just for a short time and is adjustable via A3 - however, it's still not the same as the old system.
Oh, and I agree with the above - I would only consider Auto mode if the birds were on a blue / cloudy sky.
So all the dynamic modes hang on to nothing more than the center point.
Not quite... focus does shift/move but the initial point has priority.
BTW. Does anyone actually use auto mode with AF-C and if so how do you find it?
I have also used auto in the "clear sky" scenario w/ chimney swifts... my keeper rate went from a previous of <1% to a rate of about ~15-20%.
It is also surprisingly good if the subject is large w/in the FOV and has decent BG separation. From what I understand, Auto "averages" multiple points of good contrast/focus simultaneously (i.e. eye and nose).
Personally, I think we are simply experiencing a bit of a "technology bump." There is something "new" and it is initially frustrating... some will give up quickly and stick with "what they know"/"what works." How many times have you heard "full manual is the only way?"
I, on the other hand, intend to leverage the technology/capabilities to the maximum potential... for instance, I shoot almost everything in A priority with auto ISO. And I intend to fully explore the new AF behaviors to learn what works best in what situations.
Yesterday I took a bunch of shots of gulls in flight... D153, 5, erratic, and I had 99% in focus on the eye. Granted, gulls are relatively easy... but there was certainly no decrease in keepers. That included a burst of 3 shots with the bird closing in head-on, 100% hit rate.
I also took several pictures of a perched Red Tailed Hawk with 99% in focus where they should be. And all were taken *handheld w/ the 400/2.8 + 2x; 800mm, shallow DOF, and HEAVY (i.e. very demanding)....Show more →
I have maintained for awhile that fellows were getting all excited over group AF, as dynamic wasn't working properly. Properly as in how it used to work. Group is a niche AF mode for a specific set of circumstances, and I believe fellows are using it as a work around, knowingly or unknowingly. you'd be wrong. Been using Group AF for a couple of years with the D810 and
now with my 2 D500's. Anytime you'd like to compare keepers/sales...you're on.
p.14 #10 · UPDATE - Nikon D5/D500 Dynamic AF Issue
T-O Shooter wrote:
Group is a niche AF mode for a specific set of circumstances. . .
I've never found group to be particularly useful. It certainly works as advertised, grabbing the nearest target covered by a group point, and locking on consistently. But the nearest target is almost never what I'm after. There are a lot of people who find it useful, and more power to `em.
Mar 21, 2017 at 10:28 AM
T-O Shooter Offline • • [X]
p.14 #11 · UPDATE - Nikon D5/D500 Dynamic AF Issue
trenchmonkey wrote: you'd be wrong. Been using Group AF for a couple of years with the D810 and
now with my 2 D500's. Anytime you'd like to compare keepers/sales...you're on.
Oh, I wouldn't be wrong. I use 9 pt on my 810 and it just works. Group requires a specific set of circumstances, and for anyone shooting BIF, birds flying parallel to you are not one of those circumstances.
And I would image you are using group on your 500s - you have three choices - automatic modes, group, and 4 single point modes
p.14 #12 · UPDATE - Nikon D5/D500 Dynamic AF Issue
Really?! I shoot BIF/rodeo with Group AF 90% of the time,
single point in traffic. These mergansers are faster than hell,
and I seldom miss. Just sayin'...gots ta have the skillset.
Handheld SOOC
p.14 #13 · UPDATE - Nikon D5/D500 Dynamic AF Issue
trenchmonkey wrote:
Really?! I shoot BIF/rodeo with Group AF 90% of the time,
single point in traffic. These mergansers are faster than hell,
and I seldom miss. Just sayin'...gots ta have the skillset.
Handheld SOOC
Sorry, but the image is obviously soft at the head/eye where the focus should be... that would not be a keeper for me.
p.14 #14 · UPDATE - Nikon D5/D500 Dynamic AF Issue
from yesterdays tests. *Handheld, D5, d153, 5, erratic, center point selected, 400/2.8 + 2x @ f/8. Raw, no edits other than LR defaults. (the slight softness at 100% is most likely due to the 2x TC)
p.14 #15 · UPDATE - Nikon D5/D500 Dynamic AF Issue
trenchmonkey wrote:
Really?! I shoot BIF/rodeo with Group AF 90% of the time,
single point in traffic. These mergansers are faster than hell,
and I seldom miss. Just sayin'...gots ta have the skillset.
Handheld SOOC
Trechmonkey: When shooting with group, on birds in flight travelling as this one is, wouldn't it want to lock focus on the wingtip closest to you? That's my only concern group. For birds coming straight for me, I would think it would be ideal.
p.14 #16 · UPDATE - Nikon D5/D500 Dynamic AF Issue
sk66 wrote:
Sorry, but the image is obviously soft at the head/eye where the focus should be... that would not be a keeper for me.
Agreed, you can tell by the catchlight being elongated, also the bird is flying away so I agree instant delete from me also. But we all have different standards and that is why I never believe anyone claiming "seldom miss" because this would be a 100% "miss" for me.
p.14 #17 · UPDATE - Nikon D5/D500 Dynamic AF Issue
In the case of the Merganser, Group AF did what it always does which is to grab focus on the part of the object that is closest to the camera (in this case it grabbed the wing and not the head).
p.14 #18 · UPDATE - Nikon D5/D500 Dynamic AF Issue
trenchmonkey wrote:
Really?! I shoot BIF/rodeo with Group AF 90% of the time,
single point in traffic. These mergansers are faster than hell,
and I seldom miss. Just sayin'...gots ta have the skillset.
Handheld SOOC
Well, you missed the hell out of that particular merganser.
you'd be wrong. Been using Group AF for a couple of years with the D810 and
