Conclusion comment does not sound great: The continuous autofocus gave me a positive impression as well but I need more time with the camera to understand how good it is. I think it is on the same level as other mirrorless such as the Fuji X-T2 and a6300/a6500 except for video where the focus is slower.
Sounded all right Imagemaster, the X-T2 has gotten lots of positive reviews regarding the C-AF. Then again, the test is performed in a short time and by someone not used to it.
Wilbus wrote:
Sounded all right Imagemaster, the X-T2 has gotten lots of positive reviews regarding the C-AF. Then again, the test is performed in a short time and by someone not used to it.
Well I guess I would have to see some images from it also demonstrating that.
True Imagemaster, not 100% confirmed but at least it is confirmed to be a good step up from previous generations (both Fuji and Oly).
I am trying to find a video of some Fuji testing where they tracked bicycles (or skateboarders?) in video mode and the tracking kept up completely, it was very impressive, I saw it a month ago or so but I just can't find it again.
It's funny, it's the same deal with the X-T2 and the E-M1 Mk II, it's almost as if people don't want to show how they perform in C-AF which of course opens up for a lot of conspiracy theories
I am hoping it will be good, or at least good enough to do some tracking of birds for example. Tell you the truth, if it doesn't show a marked improvement in C-AF there is really no reason for me to upgrade from the E-M1. The image quality won't be a big difference, the shooting speed will be but then again I don't need 60fps and I don't need 18fps if it can't track good anyway.
This would of course also make any future investment in the 300mm F4 mute for me... I feel the Mk II can very well be a "make it or break it" for Olympus.
PS. The Swedish camera store "Cyberphoto" talks briefly about the X-T2 and C-AF and says it's almost on par with high end DSLR's in their test. Right or wrong, I don't know.
Wilbus wrote:
Tell you the truth, if it doesn't show a marked improvement in C-AF there is really no reason for me to upgrade from the E-M1. The image quality won't be a big difference, the shooting speed will be but then again I don't need 60fps and I don't need 18fps if it can't track good anyway.
This would of course also make any future investment in the 300mm F4 mute for me... I feel the Mk II can very well be a "make it or break it" for Olympus.
Comparisons of the Fuji XT2 C-AF capabilities to DSLR C-AF are already available. Here are two of them.
DPReview: "With fast-to-focus lenses, this is a tracking performance that puts it broadly on par with the likes of the Sony a6300 and Canon's 80D (with the upper-hand changing, situation to situation). This is a huge leap forward for Fujifilm but it's still short of the uncannily fast and persistent tracking performance of cutting-edge cameras such as the Nikon D500."
www.dpreview.com/reviews/fujifilm-x-t2/8
Cameralabs: "I should also note while the autofocus is a World-apart from previous models and capable of capturing a variety of wildlife and sporting action, it's still beaten in confidence and consistency by the best models out there. Even with a suitably quick lens (you'll really need to be using the XF 50-140mm or XF 100-400mm as most of the other lenses focus too slowly), I found the hit rate wasn't as consistently high as rivals like the Sony A6300 / A6500 and Nikon D500, particularly with erratic subjects. If I was a professional sports or wildlife photographer who absolutely needed to nail a difficult action shot I would feel more confident relying on the A6300 / A6500 and especially the D500. If the event was less critical though, or you had multiple chances to reshoot if necessary, then I'd be satisfied with the XT2's autofocus performance, and I should add I also prefer the output out-of-camera from the Fujifilm too."
I'm hoping the E-M1 Mk II will fair a bit better. If nothing else thanks to the fact that most m43 lenses really focus fast as it is, something Fuji isn't all that consistent with.
We'll see, but like I said, if it can't track well it won't be worth 2000 USD. Simple as that. If it does indeed track well then yes it will be worth 2000 USD, at least for me.
If not... well, might have to look in to DSLR (D500) and a long lens again such as the 200-500.
Helping to muddy the choice, supposedly Nikon will have a Black Friday deal for the D500 with free grip for $1799. I have a D4s as a backup body that I may end up selling to cover most of the cost of the D500 and E-M1 II. That way I'd be covered for any possible situation I can conceive of.
Thankfully I don't have the cash for even that now ELinder but it sounds like a pretty good plan if you need a crop camera, one with superb AF and sensor tech at that.
What is your primary may I ask? Since you have a backup D4s? a D5?
Yes, when I bought the D5 I sold my D810 and kept the D4s as my backup. It was a noticeable step up in very low light low contrast AF performance as well as high ISO noise and DR.
I shoot with the D500, D810, and D750 cameras and my wife uses the E-M1 and E-M5 Mk II cameras and Olympus f/2.8 zoom lenses and 300mm f/4 telephoto and the image quality from the Olympus is remarkable. Autofocus is also more accurate with the mirrorless cameras and no need to do an autofocus fine tune as with DSLR cameras.
I have pre-ordered the E-M1 Mk II for her to get the great increase in cross type autofocus sensors and to get 4K video. I hope that the E-M1 Mk II does not suffer from cold weather freezing of the shutter as with the E-M1 camera, though she will still have the E-M5 II which has a different shutter that does not have the cold weather shooting problem.
What is very different with MFT is the size, weight, and cost of quality lenses. The 5-axis image stabilization and the f/2.8 pro lenses is why I bought her the E-M1 camera as it was the first one that was on par with a DSLR for autofocus and hand held shooting at moderate shutter speeds.
I'm expecting it to be top notch in terms of mirrorless, whether or not it reaches D500 level I think it'll be a while before we know. Even if intially it's not, that's not to say that it never will be, since Olympus has a history of noticeable improvements over the years. The E-M1 now at FW 4.0 is very different than it was at FW 1.0.
S-AF is already very fast. It might not AF down to -3, -4 EV like the Panasonic, but at that low light level ISO will probably become an issue sooner than the ability to AF. Also all of the Pro lenses are very quick to AF with no real dogs amongst the Olympus Pro/Premium line, unlike the inconsistencies between the Fuji lineup. C-AF will need to be tested though because as much as having dual cross point points are a positive, it doesn't seem to have the AF case settings like the X-T2 does. But it does appear to have some amount of customizable settings in terms of tracking response.
elkhornsun wrote:
The 5-axis image stabilization and the f/2.8 pro lenses is why I bought her the E-M1 camera...
This reminded me that we often discuss cameras in the abstract, but personal priorities can vary widely from buyer to buyer. For example, I'm eager for improved tracking because it will make my 300 more useful, might mean the patented 500 will come to market, and could ultimately keep Olympus viable going forward. But it's not my top priority, not even close. Here's what brought me to Olympus, and what I want from the evolving product:
1) A sturdy, compact system for international travel;
2) Effective stabilization (I have a tremor);
3) Quality glass sized to match the bodies;
4) Ergonomics (prioritizing comfort in my hands);
5) Programability.
AF speed and tracking would probably come next. Would I love a great hit rate? Absolutely. Would I be less than thrilled (with just the hit rate) if -- for what little action I shoot -- it's not around 80 percent? Yes. But less than thrilled doesn't mean it's a deal breaker. For many here, tracking is paramount. I get that. For me, other features are way more important. So I'm begging you: If tracking falls short of your expectations, please buy it anyway to support my long-term reliance on Oly.
elkhornsun wrote:
I shoot with the D500, D810, and D750 cameras and my wife uses the E-M1 and E-M5 Mk II cameras and Olympus f/2.8 zoom lenses and 300mm f/4 telephoto and the image quality from the Olympus is remarkable. Autofocus is also more accurate with the mirrorless cameras and no need to do an autofocus fine tune as with DSLR cameras.
I have pre-ordered the E-M1 Mk II for her to get the great increase in cross type autofocus sensors and to get 4K video. I hope that the E-M1 Mk II does not suffer from cold weather freezing of the shutter as with the E-M1 camera, though she will still have the E-M5 II which has a different shutter that does not have the cold weather shooting problem.
What is very different with MFT is the size, weight, and cost of quality lenses. The 5-axis image stabilization and the f/2.8 pro lenses is why I bought her the E-M1 camera as it was the first one that was on par with a DSLR for autofocus and hand held shooting at moderate shutter speeds. ...Show more →
I have never heard of the shutter freezing up. That is good to know. Thankfully, my copy is working flawlessly in that department.
TMaG82 wrote:
I'm expecting it to be top notch in terms of mirrorless, whether or not it reaches D500 level I think it'll be a while before we know. Even if intially it's not, that's not to say that it never will be, since Olympus has a history of noticeable improvements over the years. The E-M1 now at FW 4.0 is very different than it was at FW 1.0.
S-AF is already very fast. It might not AF down to -3, -4 EV like the Panasonic, but at that low light level ISO will probably become an issue sooner than the ability to AF. Also all of the Pro lenses are very quick to AF with no real dogs amongst the Olympus Pro/Premium line, unlike the inconsistencies between the Fuji lineup. C-AF will need to be tested though because as much as having dual cross point points are a positive, it doesn't seem to have the AF case settings like the X-T2 does. But it does appear to have some amount of customizable settings in terms of tracking response. ...Show more →
While it would be great if true, there is no way it will perform at the level of a D500. We would have already seen spectacular sports and action images if that was the case. There's a reason IMO why they have not actively cultivated reviews from action shooters, and that's because it's not in the same league as the typical action shooters DSLR. So, the real question should be about just how useful it will be. Personally I expect an improvement over the M1(which really isn't saying a whole lot), but not a DSLR killer. I'd love to be proved wrong , but I doubt it.
However, It does bring a lot of other features to the table that makes it a worthy upgrade.
In his E-M1 II review, Ming Thein states regarding its C-AF system, "It still doesn’t give me quite the same level of confidence as Nikon’s latest AF system in the D5/D500, but it’s at least comparable with the midlevel 39-point systems."
That would be Nikon D7000 or D610 level. "At least". In any case, we should not forget that Oly has made it clear that they are willing to improve the camera's capabilities with firmware updates. They did so with the Mark I and that did improve the C-AF system considerably. And with the much improved hardware now (121 AF points, all cross type, all phase detect and contrast detect, one quad core processor exclusively for the AF system), I can imagine the E-M1 II AF capabilities will improve within the next few years.
I spent an hour today with the camera and came away very impressed overall. Its extremely quick, focusing with both the 300f4 and 50-200 with EC14 was much quicker and more secure than with my EM1 Mark 1. Bursts with the 50-200 were much faster than with my Mark 1.
I went outside and couldn't find any fast moving subjects, but the limited test I did appeared quite good with CAF, although I didn't try CAF + TR. Per the Oly rep they've fixed the evf burn issue and the lugs coming loose. He confirmed December deliveries as well.
