Andre Labonte wrote:
I agree. More color would be interesting.
This sort of comment never makes any sense to me. I suppose it comes from the digital "always shoot color and selectively convert" mentality. To me, B&W is really it's own medium, and some photographers just choose to work in that medium. Especially for this photographer, who is known almost exclusively to post B&W, it's like telling an oil painter his work would be better in watercolor.
I would go so far to say that suggesting that these would work better in color demonstrates a thorough misapprehensionsion of the OP's artistic goals.
Jan 02, 2016 at 10:32 PM
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Evan Baines wrote:
This sort of comment never makes any sense to me. I suppose it comes from the digital "always shoot color and selectively convert" mentality. To me, B&W is really it's own medium, and some photographers just choose to work in that medium. Especially for this photographer, who is known almost exclusively to post B&W, it's like telling an oil painter his work would be better in watercolor.
I would go so far to say that suggesting that these would work better in color demonstrates a thorough misapprehensionsion of the OP's artistic goals.
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Oh please, I'm entitled to my opinion as much as the OP is entitled to his particular style.
I'm fully aware the OP chooses to work in B&W and it is its own form ... I just think it would be interesting to see the same body of work in color as well as black and white.
Andre then I suggested grabbing your camera and hitting the streets. Sounds like a project for you. I actually don't see much of your work any where and I can't remember ever seeing any street work from you.
Opinions are easy. They're like elbows, everyone has them. Creating bodies of work, not so easy.
Andre Labonte wrote:
Oh please, I'm entitled to my opinion as much as the OP is entitled to his particular style.
I'm fully aware the OP chooses to work in B&W and it is its own form ... I just think it would be interesting to see the same body of work in color as well as black and white.
Objections of your kind never make sense to me.
Andre, come on man, you're a serious talent, a very bright guy and are definitely one of my personal favorites here. But Evan is totally on point.
I watched Matt Damon's The Martian last night (for the fourth time - very strong movie, btw) and to take Evan's point a bit further - the film's subject matter sure would have made a nice musical.
Yes, of course, you're entitled to your opinion and actually, I can appreciate it. But when you, as a critic, completely miss the artist's intent, the critique does seem a bit watered down and superfluous.
I'm a jeweler. One could easily say Chuck, I'd be interested in seeing what you could do with auto paint and body work. I'd likely reply, well, thanks, I guess, and I'd be good at it. But it's not what I do.
Finally, it's not that you offered your colorful thoughts, it's that you got defensive when counterpointed.
Chuck thanks for the eloquent response and think you have hit the nail right on the head. To many times other try to project the way they see or would do something instead of excepting the work as is.
My question to Andre would be don't be so vague and please explain how he Andre thinks the work would be a more cohesive body of work if color were introduced into it. And even more important how color would better reflect the way I see the world and how it would better work for me and the way I see?
Jan 03, 2016 at 11:50 AM
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OK guys, you are all way off base and making far too much of this. And Chuck, your auto paint analogy is totally off base and completely misrepresents what I was saying.
Simply put, I have found that many B&W works are very interesting to see in color. Yes, it gives the work a totally different feel and I appreciate both views.
I simply said more color would be interesting ... not better, but interesting ... and yes, different.
I find it interesting that you guys are so vehement that I accept the view of the original artist as being "perfect" or "correct" and that to be curious or to have a differing view is somehow wrong. That's total BS in my book, and if that's the view you guys are going to take, I have no respect for it.
Here's where your wrong. If it meets the artist vision and is an honest view of the way the artists sees the world then it is correct for that artist. If you don't agree or think it's wrong for you then go create what is right for you. If you don't like the work that's perfectly OK. The problem comes in where others think that they should push their vision on others buy telling them how they think they should see or how the work should look. I say maybe you should just except the work for what it is and if don't like it move on or create something yourself that is the way you should do it.
Jan 03, 2016 at 01:23 PM
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airfrogusmc wrote:
Here's where your wrong. If it meets the artist vision and is an honest view of the way the artists sees the world then it is correct for that artist. If you don't agree or think it's wrong for you then go create what is right for you. If you don't like the work that's perfectly OK. The problem comes in where others think that they should push their vision on others buy telling them how they think they should see or how the work should look. I say maybe you should just except the work for what it is and if don't like it move on or create something yourself that is the way you should do it. ...Show more →
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And there is where you are mistaken ... I didn't say that you should present your work in color, but just offered the idea that it would be interesting to see the same work both ways. I never indicated that you were wrong in any way to use B&W, but simply offered a suggestion (more just agreeing with CW100) that an alternative view would be interesting. You are 100% free to act on that simple suggestion or not. My view was never meant to be offensive, but you are taking offense to it; it's that last bit I just don't understand or respect.
I don't imagine we are going to agree on this ... but while I appreciate your choice of using B&W, I still think seeing the same presentation in color would be interesting ... call it curiosity. That's all. Do what you want.
But there isn't an alternative and there are plenty of photographers shooting street in color. I wouldn't be arrogant enough to suggest I would like t see it in B&W. I just except the work for what it is, like or dislike it and create the way I see the world.
Jan 03, 2016 at 01:47 PM
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Ok then, but you and I are different people ... apparently I have no issue being curious about things and mentioning my curiosity to the artist.
I've had people make similar suggestions about color and/or B&W to me and found the conversation stimulating as opposed to offensive. But there again, we are different people.
I wonder what Monet's work would look like as photo realism. Or maybe Picasso shouldn't have painted as a cubist or maybe Duchamps nude defending staircase would be better not so abstract. We'll never know just like you'll never know what this work will look like as color. It is my creative decision to create in this way so you are going to just have to wonder but this work is not about color and color would have only been a distraction.
Several reasonable comments made from all points of view and Andre's right, too much being made of this. My post was a part of that and I didn't intend it to be. I was just trying to emphasize the validity of Evan's comments - not that he needs any help from me. Maybe time to get back on track.
I really enjoyed the set, airfrogusmc. Well done.
Enjoy your week guys.
Chuck
Jan 03, 2016 at 02:11 PM
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airfrogusmc wrote:
I wonder what Monet's work would look like as photo realism. Or maybe Picasso shouldn't have painted as a cubist or maybe Duchamps nude defending staircase would be better not so abstract. We'll never know just like you'll never know what this work will look like as color. It is my creative decision to create in this way so you are going to just have to wonder but this work is not about color and color would have only been a distraction.
you are no Monet or Picasso ... and photography is a different medium ... poor analogy.
But, I do respect your creative decision and choice not to show it in color ... as I said, it was merely a suggestion out of curiosity.
Nice work! I can see everyone's point about the "color" suggestion. It may seem a little odd to suggest that someone's B&W work might be more interesting in color, but then again we tell others that we think their backlit work should be front lit, or that their washed out photo should have more contrast or that their blown out highlights ruin the photo, or that they should move the subject a few centimeters to the left or right or remove the tree growing out of the subject's head. What's the difference?? It is a critique forum. Andy can say whatever he wants. It's no big deal. We are all friends, right?
Better is a very subjective term and better to who, right? And it's much different from a technical issue like light or dark or remove a tree etc and even that can be subjective. Many of those things can be changed. These are the same as if I would have shot it with B&W film. So any discussion about whether it would be better as color is a waist of time, right? Color doesn't exist. Many of these images are about timing so it even makes it more irrelevant. It was a one time only experience and it was just in B&W. End of story.
I think what is the most important thing we could talk about is do these images look like my images. Which ones are working with each other in terms of theme, do they look like they belong together visually and do they look like my photographs.
you are no Monet or Picasso ... and photography is a different medium ... poor analogy.