p.4 #1 · Sony A7 24mm F2.8 Lens Comparison/shootout
timballic wrote:
Hmm, sounds like my expectations of the MC/MD 24/2.8 may have been too high?
I hope Peire chips in, as he seems to have experience with so many.
Looking at the presented pictures I would say that this is a typical corner performance of 24mm Minolta MC/MD Rokkors.In regular landscaping though,those flaws are barely visible ,especially after some usual sharpening and defringing.With sharp/crisp rest of picture plus Minolta colours already there,overall pleasant image perception is granted,so I don't bother.
As for the plain MD 24/2.8 my first copy was flare prone and soft in the edges,but the second one that I get now is much better and has IQ comparable with previous models.
p.4 #2 · Sony A7 24mm F2.8 Lens Comparison/shootout
timballic: Thank you for all the test images. I know it is a lot of work taking images like these, and a lot more work making the possible to show for the crowd!
The Leica Elmarit-R 24/2.8 is a so-so lens for a Leica (according to all the Leica users around) but absolutely not a lens to be avoided. It is what it is...
According to Putz Leica made small changes to the formula but nothing major; they needed to change a few things when Minolta stopped delivering the glass elements and so the glass quality was changed, that's all as I understand it. I looked for the source and found this piece, from 2006, at photo.net: Click here.
p.4 #3 · Sony A7 24mm F2.8 Lens Comparison/shootout
Jonas B wrote:
The Leica Elmarit-R 24/2.8 is a so-so lens for a Leica (according to all the Leica users around) but absolutely not a lens to be avoided. It is what it is...
According to Putz Leica made small changes to the formula but nothing major; they needed to change a few things when Minolta stopped delivering the glass elements and so the glass quality was changed, that's all as I understand it. I looked for the source and found this piece, from 2006, at photo.net: Click here.
I always understood that reputation and snobbish reception among Leica folks was simply due to the fact it was a Minolta designed lens so was not seen as a "pure" or "real" Leica lens.
p.4 #4 · Sony A7 24mm F2.8 Lens Comparison/shootout
Tariq Gibran wrote:
I always understood that reputation and snobbish reception among Leica folks was simply due to the fact it was a Minolta designed lens so was not seen as a "pure" or "real" Leica lens.
So did I but I also haven't seen the Elmarit lens perform as well as the 28mm, for example. I don't know exactly what to think until we have seen straight, direct comparisons. Another opinion about the 24mm Elmarit-R says it is about as good as the Nikkor equivalent and then I guess it should be pretty good after all. So not _all_ Leica users agree but turn out to be individuals, just like the rest of the us. I'm not counting the Zeiss snobs now.
p.4 #5 · Sony A7 24mm F2.8 Lens Comparison/shootout
Screenshot of 100% left and right edge on fine twigs. I see some double imaging on left, not right.
Still doesn't tell me if it's adapter or lens though!
p.4 #6 · Sony A7 24mm F2.8 Lens Comparison/shootout
Jonas B wrote:
So did I but I also haven't seen the Elmarit lens perform as well as the 28mm, for example. I don't know exactly what to think until we have seen straight, direct comparisons. Another opinion about the 24mm Elmarit-R says it is about as good as the Nikkor equivalent and then I guess it should be pretty good after all. So not _all_ Leica users agree but turn out to be individuals, just like the rest of the us. I'm not counting the Zeiss snobs now.
I have both the Leica R 24mm f2.8 Elmarit and the Leica R 28mm f2.8 Elmarit V2. I have had the 24mm lens (60mm thread size) for about 28 or so years and purchased it new (in about 1986). It is a nice lens, but is an older design and not as sharp as the 28mm f2.8 V2, I have not used the 24mm lens on my A7r since I have the 28mm f2.8 Elmarit V2. I am still awaiting the return of my 28mm lens from Sherry Krauter (it is in for a tune up and she has had the lens for over 3 weeks). If I don't hear from her shortly I will have to give her a call. But, once I have it in hand I could make some general tests comparing the two. But, I do not intend to do an in depth test. Also, once I have the 28mm lens back, I may get together with Tim to add to his comparison of the 28mm lenses.
p.4 #7 · Sony A7 24mm F2.8 Lens Comparison/shootout
Yeah, the V2 of the 28 did not come out until 1993, about 20 years after the 24. At it's time (mid 70's), I'm not sure which, if any, Leica R wides were better. So, I suppose the only "fair" comparison would be against other lenses of it's time as we know the V2 28 is somewhat legendary in it's performance.
p.4 #8 · Sony A7 24mm F2.8 Lens Comparison/shootout
naturephoto1 wrote:
I have both the Leica R 24mm f2.8 Elmarit and the Leica R 28mm f2.8 Elmarit V2. I have had the 24mm lens (60mm thread size) for about 28 or so years and purchased it new (in about 1986). It is a nice lens, but is an older design and not as sharp as the 28mm f2.8 V2, I have not used the 24mm lens on my A7r since I have the 28mm f2.8 Elmarit V2. I am still awaiting the return of my 28mm lens from Sherry Krauter (it is in for a tune up and she has had the lens for over 3 weeks). If I don't hear from her shortly I will have to give her a call. But, once I have it in hand I could make some general tests comparing the two. But, I don not intend to do an in depth test. Also, once I have the 28mm lens back, I may get together with Tim to add to his comparison of the 28mm lenses.
You guys should fly down to FL for some R&R and sunshine so we can compare those against my Pentax 31Ltd. I seem to have lucked out with a really good copy (finally a lens that exceeds what my RX1 was capable of for landscape).
p.4 #9 · Sony A7 24mm F2.8 Lens Comparison/shootout
Here are 2 film shots that have been printed as large as 20" X 30" with the 24mm Leica R lens. The metal prints are particularly stunning and both have sold very well. They were taken tripod mounted in 1996 and were stopped down to f22 (I needed the DOF and in this case Diffraction be Damned). They were both shot on Fujichrome Velvia 50 and shot with I believe one of my Leica R4SP cameras.
p.4 #10 · Sony A7 24mm F2.8 Lens Comparison/shootout
Tariq Gibran wrote:
You guys should fly down to FL for some R&R and sunshine so we can compare those against my Pentax 31Ltd. I seem to have lucked out with a really good copy (finally a lens that exceeds what my RX1 was capable of for landscape).
Yup. The FA31 Ltd is special. Mechanically bad, simply put. Optically really great.
p.4 #12 · Sony A7 24mm F2.8 Lens Comparison/shootout
Tariq Gibran wrote:
"Mechanically bad"? Sample variation from lens to lens or...?
No, It's the construction I don't like. The lens is nose heavy. The focus throw is 90 degrees only from infinity down to MFD at 0.3 meters. The screw drive AF construction is clumsy (no direct MF) and when focusing manualyy there is no dampening at all of focusing ring. The inbuilt hood is inefficient and can't be removed. On top of all that both the aperture ring and the focusing ring work in the wrong direction...
If there was a way to convert/rebuild the lens/move the element package into a standard lens barrel I would be very interested in doing so. The bokeh is not as good (to my taste) as the RX1 Sonnar lens but the FA31 is still a great construction. Optically.
p.4 #13 · Sony A7 24mm F2.8 Lens Comparison/shootout
Jonas B wrote:
No, It's the construction I don't like. The lens is nose heavy. The focus throw is 90 degrees only from infinity down to MFD at 0.3 meters. The screw drive AF construction is clumsy (no direct MF) and when focusing manualyy there is no dampening at all of focusing ring. The inbuilt hood is inefficient and can't be removed. On top of all that both the aperture ring and the focusing ring work in the wrong direction...
If there was a way to convert/rebuild the lens/move the element package into a standard lens barrel I would be very interested in doing so. The bokeh is not as good (to my taste) as the RX1 Sonnar lens but the FA31 is still a great construction. Optically.
It's certainly not as nice to use for manual focus as a MF only lens (probably better than something like an adapted Contax G lens though). I never really used the MF that much on the RX1 when I owned it so I can't compare. The only nice think about it is that the Aperture and focusing ring do in fact turn in the correct Pentax direction. Just kidding! It's odd as when I use various Alt lenses, I seem to quickly adjust to whichever direction things turn.
p.4 #14 · Sony A7 24mm F2.8 Lens Comparison/shootout
timballic wrote:
Hmm, sounds like my expectations of the MC/MD 24/2.8 may have been too high?
I hope Peire chips in, as he seems to have experience with so many.
i can't look at the images now (flaky internet). does your new copy look any worse than my ø49mm in the test i posted?
i have never really seen any evidence that the ø55mm versions are any better than the later ø49mm versions except for vignetting.
p.4 #15 · Sony A7 24mm F2.8 Lens Comparison/shootout
sebboh. Yes, I think the left edge is worse than your examples.
One difference is obvious, your version has pronounced curved field, mine hasn't.
I really don't think it's worth the expense of trying another adapter, when the adapter used here works so well with the MD 30-70 with no hint of any problem.
I think I'll have to drop MD from my comparison now, as after getting three with problems, my expectations are not high of getting a perfect one.
p.4 #16 · Sony A7 24mm F2.8 Lens Comparison/shootout
I think Peire was right: " In regular landscaping though,those flaws are barely visible ,especially after some usual sharpening and defringing.With sharp/crisp rest of picture plus Minolta colours already there,overall pleasant image perception is granted, so I don't bother."
I've been out doing more comparisons, this time with just my OM and the new MD, and if I hadn't done the brick wall torture test I wouldn't have seen a fault, just differences.
I can see why I like both Olympus and Minolta! However the MD does have that flare problem, seen here with the clear sun full in frame, as below, both F11, OM first. (I've uploaded full size to Flickr this time)
Here, at F11, I prefer the OM, however between F2.8-5.6 I prefer the MD for clarity, though always with poorer corners, from F8 the OM takes over for clarity, however, both are useable at F16 which surprises me.
Let me know if you'd like to see any other apertures, as I shot full series.
I have a couple more to load full size.
It isn't any surprise to me that the OM has the better corners, but I am surprised how similar they are in drawing style/character. The MD has slightly better dof.
p.4 #18 · Sony A7 24mm F2.8 Lens Comparison/shootout
I think the MD is giving better separation/depth/3D to those gravestones in the above shot, and showing a colour I prefer, but probably in most other shots, (including ones not posted here), I'd put the OM first. It's close!
At a pixel level the OM is sharper everywhere within its zone of sharpness, but has less dof. (I hope that makes sense?)
p.4 #19 · Sony A7 24mm F2.8 Lens Comparison/shootout
Seller of the MD very good about it, I explained what I was seeing, and as he sold as "Perfect", he's accepting return, no quibble, with all postage paid.
I may spend more time looking around for another copy at lower cost now I have at least a good indication of how it should be.
It also releases a few funds to try another design.
p.4 #20 · Sony A7 24mm F2.8 Lens Comparison/shootout
Pt. 2.
More results on the way.
I've had two clear days, coinciding with clear skies, so I made good use of them.
They will include Nikkor Ai 24/2.8, and an MD comparison between ø49mm and the ø55mm, (before the ø55mm goes back after the w/e.)
Sorry to disappoint any who may have been waiting for more results from the ZS 25/2.8, but I've dropped it from this stage.
One of my purposes in doing the comparison, was to find out if any other MF 24/2.8 came close enough to it's performance, for me not to carry that weight (over 2x the weight of the next heaviest).
Round one satisfied me that several did. ..Also, shooting full sequences, comparing 7x lenses repeatedly, is just too much for me...6x is really too many too.....but then no one asked me to do this, it is self inflicted
EDIT: I think I will do a Pt 3, reintroducing the ZS 25/2.8, and comparing it with my two favourites from Pt 2, which are already looking like the OM and the MD ø49mm.
Just kidding! It's odd as when I use various Alt lenses, I seem to quickly adjust to whichever direction things turn. 
