Yes technically it is a new sensor, but it not a "new" sensor. The same underlying image pipeline is in place. No changes to be expected on DR unless they have improved low ISO read noise, which is their curse. I'm sure it's better than the 7D (god how could it not) but how much better is to be seen. Otherwise the rest of the specs are terrific and some surprised me as most un-canon like such as intervalometer and finally USB3.
Based on camera price and sensor characteristics, I don't think it's a new sensor technology. I believe it's based on the 70D sensor with many improvements.
seems to be a lot of bitching going on across the net on various sites about this camera, wouldn't it be better to wait until its been thoroughly tested?
In the semi-conductor world ... you keep tweaking and working on improvements.
From the time the 70D sensor was shipped to the 7DmkIII, there could have been upgrades to the chip itself (electrically) and or better secondary chips/software than before.
The entire suite should perform better than the 70D setup.
What the actual changes are ... Canon proprietary information.
Ziffl3 wrote:
In the semi-conductor world ... you keep tweaking and working on improvements.
From the time the 70D sensor was shipped to the 7DmkIII, there could have been upgrades to the chip itself (electrically) and or better secondary chips/software than before.
The entire suite should perform better than the 70D setup.
What the actual changes are ... Canon proprietary information.
The major question is if Canon has moved to the new fabrication technology or not. The general understanding is that the reason Canon has fallen behind in sensor performance is that it is still using its old 0.5micron fabrication technology whereas Sony has moved on to the much smaller 180nm (0.18 micron) technology. Canon could always tweak more and more to get a little bit more out of the sensor as it did on 70D and the recent FF sensors, but the big jump in performance people have been waiting for would not come until Canon moves to the newer tech. Based on the similarity with 70D sensor, so far it seems that it is not the new technology.
curious80 wrote:
The major question is if Canon has moved to the new fabrication technology or not. The general understanding is that the reason Canon has fallen behind in sensor performance is that it is still using its old 0.5micron fabrication technology whereas Sony has moved on to the much smaller 180nm (0.18 micron) technology. Canon could always tweak more and more to get a little bit more out of the sensor as it did on 70D and the recent FF sensors, but the big jump in performance people have been waiting for would not come until Canon moves to the newer tech. Based on the similarity with 70D sensor, so far it seems that it is not the new technology. ...Show more →
If they moved to a smaller process technology, we don't see it yet in the recent announcements from Canon. Canon was caught in a bad surprise when the D800(E) was released about the same time as the 5D MkIII. At the time, Canon mgmt must have decided to stick to the 24 MP FF sensor for a while not expecting others like Sony and Nikon would catch up as quickly and release new sensor-based products. One year later Canon's CEO was replaced without given reason to the media - I am sure it was at least partially related to the misjudgment of the demand in high MP/high DR sensors. If we assume that Canon since started at some point 2013/2014 to build new fabrication lines and investigate new sensor technology, they are likely not there yet. It is a tough catch-up game now for Canon.
aladyforty wrote:
seems to be a lot of bitching going on across the net on various sites about this camera, wouldn't it be better to wait until its been thoroughly tested?
I think we know what to expect AF wise, as it's using a 1D X class AF, but IQ was the most important improvement required IMO and there is nothing to suggest it will be much better than 70D at this stage. There is yet again now new sensor tech, just minor evolution. But we should wait for the tests to start. I'll most likely get one and what other options do we have anyway as Nikon looks to have given up on a D300s successor despite rumours of a D400. Other than sensor, specs are terrific
I would love to see IQ comparison among these cams (7Dm2,7D,60D,50D,40D,30D, 20D,XTin....etc) . I bet you, my 40D is still the best contender in IQ compared to latest canon crops
kezeka wrote:
For me PERSONALLY (hint hint subjective comments to follow - stop reading if easily offended), I will never buy nor do I have any need for a cropped sensor that takes away from the edge characteristics of my lenses, gives me less depth of field at a given realized focal length, and all with sh**ty little pixels that don't soak up light as quickly making it hard to handhold ANY shots at 1/focal length or even longer exposures than that that are easily attainable with a nice 20-ish megapixel camera. So this photokina was a complete bomb for me and an incredibly disappointing show. FOR ME - Remember this is subjective and my opinion. I know some of y'all are happy using these stupid APS-C sensors for birding. I just wish Canon would follow Nikon's lead and stop developing the things and focus only on FF sensors and whatever garbage they throw into rebels. #opinion ...Show more →
So why don't y'all start a FF-only forum and stop reading and whining about threads on APS-C cameras
curious80 wrote:
[Canon has fallen behind in sensor performance is that it is still using its old 0.5micron fabrication technology whereas Sony has moved on to the much smaller 180nm (0.18 micron) technology.
I have been told that there is no way that Canon could do the 40+ MP Dual Pixel Auto Focus with the 0.5 micron fab, that they have to be using the new fab already.
I don't know if that is true or not - I don;t have enough knowledge to say (although I could pretend, this being the internet ...)
...precise choice of words, as in the "newly designed" sensor...
Yes, and they also use the word "refined" when describing the sensor. Just marketing BS to cover up the fact that the sensor is the same one in the 70D, with a few tweaks.
Other than sensor, specs are terrific
Agreed, except for the video quality, which appears to be the same mushy crap we've seen in all of Canon's DSLRs (except for, perhaps, the 1DC).
I guess we shouldn't have expected any significant improvement in IQ for this camera. If it was that much better, then, considering the dramatically upgraded AF system, why would anyone spend the outrageous sum of US$6,800 on the 1DX?
mmurph wrote:
I have been told that there is no way that Canon could do the 40+ MP Dual Pixel Auto Focus with the 0.5 micron fab, that they have to be using the new fab already.
I don't know if that is true or not - I don;t have enough knowledge to say (although I could pretend, this being the internet ...)
I just can't believe they are still on the antiquated 0.5micron fab. Why they hell they just don't buy steppers from someone else rather than keep soldiering on with trailing edge tech. Sony for example uses 0.18micron and others use 0.25micron.
Why they hell they just don't buy steppers from someone else rather than keep soldiering on with trailing edge tech.
It's got to be a cost issue. They must have decided that the cost savings gained by staying with the old process is so significant that they are willing to risk being years behind the technology everyone else is using.
mttran wrote:
I would love to see IQ comparison among these cams (7Dm2,7D,60D,50D,40D,30D, 20D,XTin....etc) . I bet you, my 40D is still the best contender in IQ compared to latest canon crops
The digital picture has a comparison of (almost) all of your cameras prior to the 7D2. I am sure he'll update it once the 7D2 is actually out.
Pixel Perfect wrote:
just can't believe they are still on the antiquated 0.5micron fab. Why they hell they just don't buy steppers from someone else rather than keep soldiering on with trailing edge tech. Sony for example uses 0.18micron and others use 0.25micron.
As per chip works, Canon used the 0.5 micron as recently as the 5DIII and 1DX:
I don't know if there is similar data available for say 70D. However one would think if Canon had moved to a newer tech for 70D, we would have seen a bigger difference in performance compared to its older APS-C sensors.
aladyforty wrote:
seems to be a lot of bitching going on across the net on various sites about this camera, wouldn't it be better to wait until its been thoroughly tested?
Why would someone want to put off an excellent opportunity to bitch about something? ;-)
aladyforty wrote:
seems to be a lot of bitching going on across the net on various sites about this camera, wouldn't it be better to wait until its been thoroughly tested?
Because there are those that can't wait, and those that can't wait to bitch about anything.
