Archive 2013 · Sony A7 - first impressions and some tests
p.7 #1Sony A7 - first impressions and some tests
philber wrote:
If the FE 35, the 35 Sonnar for the RX1 and the Touit for NEX are anything to go by, Zeiss will do a first-rate job of it.
this and the quality of Distagon 21mm. They don't need to reinvent the wheel, they will just simply
adopt their existing design.
coffeeshakes wrote
Maybe if not Sony, then someone else (other than Leica) will take up that flag and wave it. One can hope.this and the quality of Distagon 21mm. They don't need to reinvent the wheel, they will just simply
adopt their existing design.
Nov 20, 2013 at 01:48 PM
p.7 #2Sony A7 - first impressions and some tests
Received the A7r today.
Found the following present M lenses useless due to color shading and smearing towards the edges:
Leica 18 Super Elmar, Leica 24 Elmar, Leica 28 Elmarit.
The 50 Summilux is nice except for some magenta hue/colorshift over the entire image wide open like it was on the Nex 7.
The 75 Summarit and 90 Apo Summicron are doing fine.
Tried the Zeiss ZF.2 15 and 28 mm and they too look also fine without any color shading or smearing.
My conclusion is that the A7r basically behaves the same as the Nex 7. Actually the effected image area is larger so in that way I think it is doing even worse.
So again unfortunately no match for a Leica M with my rangefinder wide angles.
The small body still needs the larger ZF.2 lenses to show what it is capable of.
The camera is nice but it feels a little bit cheap even compared to the RX1.
But it's file quality for such a compact body is unique and fantastic to work with.
Found the following present M lenses useless due to color shading and smearing towards the edges:
Leica 18 Super Elmar, Leica 24 Elmar, Leica 28 Elmarit.
The 50 Summilux is nice except for some magenta hue/colorshift over the entire image wide open like it was on the Nex 7.
The 75 Summarit and 90 Apo Summicron are doing fine.
Tried the Zeiss ZF.2 15 and 28 mm and they too look also fine without any color shading or smearing.
My conclusion is that the A7r basically behaves the same as the Nex 7. Actually the effected image area is larger so in that way I think it is doing even worse.
So again unfortunately no match for a Leica M with my rangefinder wide angles.
The small body still needs the larger ZF.2 lenses to show what it is capable of.
The camera is nice but it feels a little bit cheap even compared to the RX1.
But it's file quality for such a compact body is unique and fantastic to work with.
Nov 20, 2013 at 01:56 PM
p.7 #3Sony A7 - first impressions and some tests
...in the center, no it's not.The fact that some lenses did great on the NEX-7 sensor was the real testament to resolution. Where these cameras push lenses is outside the center, and this just by virtue of them being FF. Not surprisingly the problems we're seeing with legacy glass so far are in the corners. Center performance by and large is quite nice (which is why I think many of the sample shots look great).
rafa1981 wrote:
My fault, but even more relevant to the fact that a 24Mpx FF sensor is not that demanding, maybe the opposite.
rafa1981 wrote:
morpheus2891 wrote
isn't APS-C 16mpx equivalent to ~37mpx on FF? I think the A7 is equivalent to a ~10.5mpx APS-C cam. Even the A7R is slightly lower pixel density than the NEX-6Nov 20, 2013 at 01:59 PM
p.7 #4Sony A7 - first impressions and some tests
I also have a feeling that once we see more lenses from Sony and once Zeiss releases it's promised MF lenses for the FE mount, the less-than-stellar performance with RF lenses will not matter as much 
Nov 20, 2013 at 02:01 PM
p.7 #5Sony A7 - first impressions and some tests
That's probably correct but, after initial enthusiasm, I've cooled off significantly in the light of these reports and will probably now delay or defer on these until there is a decent native lens inventory, particularly as I find the Nex7 such a good camera to work with. May have to buy a Sigma 19/2.8E for it though unless I go for a RX1 as a companion to the Nex - woukd have to have a vf though...
morpheus2891 wrote:
I also have a feeling that once we see more lenses from Sony and once Zeiss releases it's promised MF lenses for the FE mount, the less-than-stellar performance with RF lenses will not matter as much
morpheus2891 wrote:
I also have a feeling that once we see more lenses from Sony and once Zeiss releases it's promised MF lenses for the FE mount, the less-than-stellar performance with RF lenses will not matter as much
Nov 20, 2013 at 02:09 PM
p.7 #6Sony A7 - first impressions and some tests
Herb1911 wrote:
Received the A7r today.
The 50 Summilux is nice except for some magenta hue/colorshift over the entire image wide open like it was on the Nex 7.
I'm super-interested in 50 Summilux ASPH and A7r -- can you possibly post any examples? I'm especially interested in seeing how the sides hold up for near and distant subjects.
Also, can you describe (or show) this magenta hue? Over the entire image? I haven't heard that previously.
What adapter are you using? Are you hitting infinity focus at the hard stop?
I would be purchasing the A7r and Lux 50 together, I've been hoping it would be a killer combo.
Received the A7r today.
The 50 Summilux is nice except for some magenta hue/colorshift over the entire image wide open like it was on the Nex 7.
I'm super-interested in 50 Summilux ASPH and A7r -- can you possibly post any examples? I'm especially interested in seeing how the sides hold up for near and distant subjects.
Also, can you describe (or show) this magenta hue? Over the entire image? I haven't heard that previously.
What adapter are you using? Are you hitting infinity focus at the hard stop?
I would be purchasing the A7r and Lux 50 together, I've been hoping it would be a killer combo.
Nov 20, 2013 at 02:12 PM
p.7 #7Sony A7 - first impressions and some tests
Herb1911 wrote:
The 50 Summilux is nice except for some magenta hue/colorshift over the entire image wide open like it was on the Nex 7.
That doesn't sound good...
The 50 Summilux is nice except for some magenta hue/colorshift over the entire image wide open like it was on the Nex 7.
That doesn't sound good...
Nov 20, 2013 at 02:19 PM
p.7 #8Sony A7 - first impressions and some tests
Herb1911 wrote:
Received the A7r today.
Found the following present M lenses useless due to color shading and smearing towards the edges:
Leica 18 Super Elmar, Leica 24 Elmar, Leica 28 Elmarit.
The 50 Summilux is nice except for some magenta hue/colorshift over the entire image wide open like it was on the Nex 7.
The 75 Summarit and 90 Apo Summicron are doing fine.
Tried the Zeiss ZF.2 15 and 28 mm and they too look also fine without any color shading or smearing.
My conclusion is that the A7r basically behaves the same as the Nex 7. Actually the effected image area is larger so in...Show more →
Thanks for that Herb. Good to hear that the 15mm ZF.2 is OK, at least this means that it's not a problem with UWA in general (just short exit pupil)
Received the A7r today.
Found the following present M lenses useless due to color shading and smearing towards the edges:
Leica 18 Super Elmar, Leica 24 Elmar, Leica 28 Elmarit.
The 50 Summilux is nice except for some magenta hue/colorshift over the entire image wide open like it was on the Nex 7.
The 75 Summarit and 90 Apo Summicron are doing fine.
Tried the Zeiss ZF.2 15 and 28 mm and they too look also fine without any color shading or smearing.
My conclusion is that the A7r basically behaves the same as the Nex 7. Actually the effected image area is larger so in...Show more →
Thanks for that Herb. Good to hear that the 15mm ZF.2 is OK, at least this means that it's not a problem with UWA in general (just short exit pupil)
Nov 20, 2013 at 02:52 PM
p.7 #9Sony A7 - first impressions and some tests
snowboarder wrote:
That doesn't sound good...
it's common in fast lenses for the color balance to be different wide open versus stopped down, didn't realize the lux asph did this as well.
Herb1911 wrote
The 50 Summilux is nice except for some magenta hue/colorshift over the entire image wide open like it was on the Nex 7.it's common in fast lenses for the color balance to be different wide open versus stopped down, didn't realize the lux asph did this as well.
Nov 20, 2013 at 02:58 PM
p.7 #10Sony A7 - first impressions and some tests
coffeeshakes wrote:
The whole a7 push seems to be about compactness, no?
Not for me. I see it as a digital back/viewfinder for numerous lens mounts. The compactness is a bonus. Since all of my lenses are SLR mount I don't expect to have the problems some RF wide-angle lenses have with this camera.
The whole a7 push seems to be about compactness, no?
Not for me. I see it as a digital back/viewfinder for numerous lens mounts. The compactness is a bonus. Since all of my lenses are SLR mount I don't expect to have the problems some RF wide-angle lenses have with this camera.
Nov 20, 2013 at 03:01 PM
p.7 #11Sony A7 - first impressions and some tests
Can you not argue the same for the Nex7?
telyt wrote:
Not for me. I see it as a digital back/viewfinder for numerous lens mounts. The compactness is a bonus. Since all of my lenses are SLR mount I don't expect to have the problems some RF wide-angle lenses have with this camera.
telyt wrote:
Not for me. I see it as a digital back/viewfinder for numerous lens mounts. The compactness is a bonus. Since all of my lenses are SLR mount I don't expect to have the problems some RF wide-angle lenses have with this camera.
Nov 20, 2013 at 03:05 PM
p.7 #12Sony A7 - first impressions and some tests
sebboh wrote:
That doesn't sound good...it's common in fast lenses for the color balance to be different wide open versus stopped down, didn't realize the lux asph did this as well.
Never noticed that on NEX-6/5N. Don't remember how it was on NEX-7...
Color balance is one thing, magenta cast is another...
snowboarder wrote
Herb1911 wrote
The 50 Summilux is nice except for some magenta hue/colorshift over the entire image wide open like it was on the Nex 7.Never noticed that on NEX-6/5N. Don't remember how it was on NEX-7...
Color balance is one thing, magenta cast is another...
Nov 20, 2013 at 03:06 PM
p.7 #13Sony A7 - first impressions and some tests
sebboh wrote:
That doesn't sound good...it's common in fast lenses for the color balance to be different wide open versus stopped down, didn't realize the lux asph did this as well.
Ah, that!
I had actually asked about exactly that a few weeks ago over on DPReview -- I posted this screencap from Lightroom:
http://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/3568658?post=52435034&image=0
I was shooting some test at different apertures, with Auto WB -- and for some reason, the f/1.4 shots wound up with very different colors (the yellow and pink shots).
That I can live with, as I can fix it -- I'd love to hear more about how the Lux 50 performs on the A7r apart from that...
snowboarder wrote
Herb1911 wrote
The 50 Summilux is nice except for some magenta hue/colorshift over the entire image wide open like it was on the Nex 7.Ah, that!
I had actually asked about exactly that a few weeks ago over on DPReview -- I posted this screencap from Lightroom:
http://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/3568658?post=52435034&image=0
I was shooting some test at different apertures, with Auto WB -- and for some reason, the f/1.4 shots wound up with very different colors (the yellow and pink shots).
That I can live with, as I can fix it -- I'd love to hear more about how the Lux 50 performs on the A7r apart from that...
Nov 20, 2013 at 03:07 PM
p.7 #14Sony A7 - first impressions and some tests
Peire wrote:
Real life pictures look pretty good.
Agreed, more real pictures, less test charts please.
It also helps that Phillip is a talented photographer.
Real life pictures look pretty good.
Agreed, more real pictures, less test charts please.
It also helps that Phillip is a talented photographer.
Nov 20, 2013 at 03:37 PM
p.7 #15Sony A7 - first impressions and some tests
waterden wrote:
Can you not argue the same for the Nex7?
Sure - but the a7r is full-frame, higher resolution, has no AA filter, and the Nex 7's EVF according to those who have the camera and know my working style isn't adequtely responsive so the a7r is much more interesting to me. I'll need to try the a7r myself to evaluate the responsiveness.
Can you not argue the same for the Nex7?
telyt wrote
Not for me. I see it as a digital back/viewfinder for numerous lens mounts. The compactness is a bonus. Since all of my lenses are SLR mount I don't expect to have the problems some RF wide-angle lenses have with this camera.Sure - but the a7r is full-frame, higher resolution, has no AA filter, and the Nex 7's EVF according to those who have the camera and know my working style isn't adequtely responsive so the a7r is much more interesting to me. I'll need to try the a7r myself to evaluate the responsiveness.
Nov 20, 2013 at 03:39 PM
p.7 #16Sony A7 - first impressions and some tests
A magenta hue with 'Lux50 on NEX7
Not that I am aware of. So, if my A7R is the same, it will be just fine...
Not that I am aware of. So, if my A7R is the same, it will be just fine...Nov 20, 2013 at 03:45 PM
p.7 #17Sony A7 - first impressions and some tests
Does the a7r have higher resolution over its (larger) frame? The pixel density is only 2/3 that of the NEX7. Obviously the lack of AA filter will be a (partial?) mitigating factor.
telyt wrote:
Sure - but the a7r is full-frame, higher resolution, has no AA filter, and the Nex 7's EVF according to those who have the camera and know my working style isn't adequtely responsive so the a7r is much more interesting to me. I'll need to try the a7r myself to evaluate the responsiveness.
telyt wrote:
waterden wrote
Can you not argue the same for the Nex7?telyt wrote
Not for me. I see it as a digital back/viewfinder for numerous lens mounts. The compactness is a bonus. Since all of my lenses are SLR mount I don't expect to have the problems some RF wide-angle lenses have with this camera.Nov 20, 2013 at 03:46 PM
p.7 #18Sony A7 - first impressions and some tests
waterden wrote:
Does the a7r have higher resolution over its (larger) frame? The pixel density is only 2/3 that of the NEX7. Obviously the lack of AA filter will be a (partial?) mitigating factor.
Sure - but the a7r is full-frame, higher resolution, has no AA filter, and the Nex 7's EVF according to those who have the camera and know my working style isn't adequtely responsive so the a7r is much more interesting to me. I'll need to try the a7r myself to evaluate the responsiveness.
I'm more concerned with the net resolution than with the pixel density.
Does the a7r have higher resolution over its (larger) frame? The pixel density is only 2/3 that of the NEX7. Obviously the lack of AA filter will be a (partial?) mitigating factor.
telyt wrote
waterden wrote
Can you not argue the same for the Nex7?telyt wrote
Not for me. I see it as a digital back/viewfinder for numerous lens mounts. The compactness is a bonus. Since all of my lenses are SLR mount I don't expect to have the problems some RF wide-angle lenses have with this camera.I'm more concerned with the net resolution than with the pixel density.
Nov 20, 2013 at 03:54 PM
p.7 #19Sony A7 - first impressions and some tests
next topic: Dynamic Range
I shot a test series with fixed iso and aperture and varying exposure time and equalized brightness in my Raw converter.
dynamci-range by Phillip Reeve, on Flickr
the Raw Files (converted to dng) can be found here
I shot a test series with fixed iso and aperture and varying exposure time and equalized brightness in my Raw converter.
dynamci-range by Phillip Reeve, on Flickr
the Raw Files (converted to dng) can be found here
Nov 20, 2013 at 03:54 PM
p.7 #20Sony A7 - first impressions and some tests
Phillip Reeve wrote:
To complete the testing, you really should include a cat shot though.+1 for the cat shot I'll take a cat shot over a photo of someone's kid any day. More fine detail to measure acuity, plus a much higher probability of the subject being attractive a lynx is a cat, isn't it?
all shot at f/4 despite the labeling
http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5506/10964555064_e8eba20c91_b.jpg
Canon_FD_80200f28L_at200mmf8 by reevedata, on Flickr
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7328/10964462536_184384129e_b.jpg
Canon_FD_80200f28L_at200mmf8-2 by reevedata, on Flickr
http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5535/10964381855_306ff9a68b_b.jpg
Canon_FD_80200f28L_at200mmf8-3 by reevedata, on Flickr
F4L, correct? Or are you such a lens guru, you've managed to get your hands on some experimental property?
snapsy wrote
edwardkaraa wrote
Gary Clennan wrote
Thanks for the samples Phillip! Great to see the duck shot - who needs test charts anyway... To complete the testing, you really should include a cat shot though.all shot at f/4 despite the labeling
http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5506/10964555064_e8eba20c91_b.jpg
Canon_FD_80200f28L_at200mmf8 by reevedata, on Flickr
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7328/10964462536_184384129e_b.jpg
Canon_FD_80200f28L_at200mmf8-2 by reevedata, on Flickr
http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5535/10964381855_306ff9a68b_b.jpg
Canon_FD_80200f28L_at200mmf8-3 by reevedata, on Flickr
F4L, correct?
Or are you such a lens guru, you've managed to get your hands on some experimental property?Nov 20, 2013 at 04:05 PM