p.57 #1 · Official: Sony A7 and A7R Fullframe Mirrorless
^ Yeah I'm thinking what sounded like a rushed first impression of the EVF might be a bit premature -- some tweaks might get it to a more usable state for MF -- who knows what wacky settings the camera could have been using, being a demo unit.
FWIW, Steve Huff said he had no real issues with MF, and that was with a Voigt 35/1.2 I can't remember if he was using peaking or just EVF "naked", though.
p.57 #2 · Official: Sony A7 and A7R Fullframe Mirrorless
I played with the A7R today in my local Park Cameras store. To be honest I was blown away. When these cameras were announced I contemplated trading the D800 in for this much much smaller but capable camera, but the lens situation was an issue. I have lots of expensive Nikon glass!
When the df was announced I thought I had found my utopia in this retro styled animal. However, I have a D4 so in reality I came to realise that the df brings me nothing at all, other than a retro styled body.
At this point I was re-considering the A7R so when I heard the Sony crew were at my camera store today I had to pop in to check the camera out. I'm glad I did. Personally I found the camera to be sensational. Fits in the hand ever so well, feels great and very very light indeed, yet super solid and robust. I found the menu system to be great, and the AF performance was excellent. I love how you have literally the entire frame covered by an AF point. Far superior to the DF's puny focus area in the centre of the frame only. I found AF to be extremely quick, certainly fast enough for anything I'd throw at it. So far so good.
The icing on the cake came when I saw the IQ from that 36mp sensor. Epic! Absolutely sublime. Colour rendition, detail, sharpness, all sensational. Being a trade for my D800 I really wanted something that would deliver detail and crispness for portraits and maybe landscape work, and based on what I saw today I would have no problem taking this camera as the main camera on a portrait shoot. No problem at all. I will get the 55mm f1.8 and that combo will product superb portraits, at least until I get an adaptor for my longer Nikon lenses or pickup a tele Sony FE lens in future.
I am so pleasantly surprised. I knew it would be good but didn't think it would be quite good enough to be a proper option. But after playing with it today I know it is, and it have no doubt it will enable me to take more photos due to its very small form and lightweight.
p.57 #3 · Official: Sony A7 and A7R Fullframe Mirrorless
cputeq wrote:
^ Yeah I'm thinking what sounded like a rushed first impression of the EVF might be a bit premature -- some tweaks might get it to a more usable state for MF -- who knows what wacky settings the camera could have been using, being a demo unit.
FWIW, Steve Huff said he had no real issues with MF, and that was with a Voigt 35/1.2 I can't remember if he was using peaking or just EVF "naked", though.
You could definitely be right there, and I didn't have as much time as I'd like. However, the resolution is the same as the Nex EVF's and whatever improved optics are present didn't transform the experience for me. If you like Sony EVF's and can setup a Nex to your liking then this will work great for you. I bet Sebboh can manually focus on an EVF better than I ever could on an OVF. For me and my preferences there is still some uncertainty. I'm sure Sony will continue to improve EVF technology very quickly.
p.57 #4 · Official: Sony A7 and A7R Fullframe Mirrorless
ct8282 wrote:
I love how you have literally the entire frame covered by an AF point. Far superior to the DF's puny focus area in the centre of the frame only.
Yeah in switching between my D700 and my Nex 5n that's something I really like about the Nex 5n compared to the D700.
On the other hand, I would like an easy setting for the nex to limit the number of points.
p.57 #5 · Official: Sony A7 and A7R Fullframe Mirrorless
desvenne wrote:
Yeah in switching between my D700 and my Nex 5n that's something I really like about the Nex 5n compared to the D700.
On the other hand, I would like an easy setting for the nex to limit the number of points.
That is a good point and something I was wondering about. So I guess that there's no option to reduce the available AF points then? With the Nikons I can limit the number easily which is very useful at times.
Perhaps Sony will introduce this in a firmware update, but we'll need to let them know its a needed/wanted feature.
p.57 #6 · Official: Sony A7 and A7R Fullframe Mirrorless
It has Sony's best EVF - with results not to be compared with NEX. It is a development of the unit fitted to the other FFs - a99 and RX1 but with more contrast.
Focus peaking is a fiddly technology which has its place and is better than say an a900, using a short telephoto when set up correctly. The drawback is each lens reacts differently, hence Sony providing many settings for colour and intensity.
I am surprised no one is using focus magnification, the solution to all focus problems...maybe those reviewers are unfamiliar with it, Huff did not even mention it from memory, and maybe casual in-store usage with cameras not set up for it on a back button. It never misses, it is akin to using 100% zoom in you editor.
But what would I know, I have only used it in both the above-mentioned cameras for over a year now. I am 100% manual focus on the a99 and expect better results on the a7r.
p.57 #7 · Official: Sony A7 and A7R Fullframe Mirrorless
philip_pj wrote:
It has Sony's best EVF - with results not to be compared with NEX. It is a development of the unit fitted to the other FFs - a99 and RX1 but with more contrast.
Focus peaking is a fiddly technology which has its place and is better than say an a900, using a short telephoto when set up correctly. The drawback is each lens reacts differently, hence Sony providing many settings for colour and intensity.
I am surprised no one is using focus magnification, the solution to all focus problems...maybe those reviewers are unfamiliar with it, Huff did not even mention it from memory, and maybe casual in-store usage with cameras not set up for it on a back button. It never misses, it is akin to using 100% zoom in you editor.
But what would I know, I have only used it in both the above-mentioned cameras for over a year now. I am 100% manual focus on the a99 and expect better results on the a7r. ...Show more →
All that may be true and I'm sure many folks can achieve brilliant manual focus results with it. But the resolution of all the Sony EVF's is the same, and if you rely on quickly resolving fine details to focus they are functionally similar. I was hoping the supposedly better EVF optics would make a big difference but you can't resolve detail that isn't there. Mostly it just seemed the individual pixels were more distinct. Focus magnification is not the solution to all focus problems and never will be. Sometimes you need the whole viewfinder to focus and compose at the same time.
p.57 #8 · Official: Sony A7 and A7R Fullframe Mirrorless
philip_pj wrote:
It has Sony's best EVF - with results not to be compared with NEX. It is a development of the unit fitted to the other FFs - a99 and RX1 but with more contrast.
Focus peaking is a fiddly technology which has its place and is better than say an a900, using a short telephoto when set up correctly. The drawback is each lens reacts differently, hence Sony providing many settings for colour and intensity.
I am surprised no one is using focus magnification, the solution to all focus problems...maybe those reviewers are unfamiliar with it, Huff did not even mention it from memory, and maybe casual in-store usage with cameras not set up for it on a back button. It never misses, it is akin to using 100% zoom in you editor.
But what would I know, I have only used it in both the above-mentioned cameras for over a year now. I am 100% manual focus on the a99 and expect better results on the a7r. ...Show more →
But how does the A7 handle focus magnification? If it's a huge, magnified view of the image, that's something I can't use. I prefer the Picture-in-picture ala Panasonic.
I wonder this, though - huge (full-screen) magnification, even if toggled, tends to throw my composition off.
p.57 #10 · Official: Sony A7 and A7R Fullframe Mirrorless
cputeq wrote:
But how does the A7 handle focus magnification? If it's a huge, magnified view of the image, that's something I can't use. I prefer the Picture-in-picture ala Panasonic.
I wonder this, though - huge (full-screen) magnification, even if toggled, tends to throw my composition off.
If it's the same as the NEX-6 there is no Picture-in-Picture. It's the biggest issue IMO with all of Sony's mirrorless. It's want I wanted most in the FFs, especially for macro comp.
p.57 #11 · Official: Sony A7 and A7R Fullframe Mirrorless
lumis beans wrote:
If it's the same as the NEX-6 there is no Picture-in-Picture. It's the biggest issue IMO with all of Sony's mirrorless. It's want I wanted most in the FFs, especially for macro comp.
+1
the magnification mode would be so much more useful if they added this.
p.57 #12 · Official: Sony A7 and A7R Fullframe Mirrorless
lumis beans wrote:
If it's the same as the NEX-6 there is no Picture-in-Picture. It's the biggest issue IMO with all of Sony's mirrorless. It's want I wanted most in the FFs, especially for macro comp.
Man that sucks
Hopefully I can just use the EVF and maybe peaking then.
p.57 #13 · Official: Sony A7 and A7R Fullframe Mirrorless
In all of the excitement surrounding an announcement such as this, I guess it is only human nature to have questions. One of the things I wonder most about is image quality off the tripod. SO MUCH has been made about the technique needed to get the most out of the D800 variants and how demanding they are. And while not mandatory, I certainly feel that to get the most a tripod is often required. Though I obviously have not read the volumes being posted about the 36mp Sony, can we anticipate that it too will not be a casual point and shoot if we want to reach the potential it has to offer? I am actually wondering if the small footprint of these bodies will make good hand held results easier or harder to obtain than with a full size DSLR?
Any thoughts would be interesting!
Greg
p.57 #14 · Official: Sony A7 and A7R Fullframe Mirrorless
rxgolf wrote:
In all of the excitement surrounding an announcement such as this, I guess it is only human nature to have questions. One of the things I wonder most about is image quality off the tripod. SO MUCH has been made about the technique needed to get the most out of the D800 variants and how demanding they are. And while not mandatory, I certainly feel that to get the most a tripod is often required. Though I obviously have not read the volumes being posted about the 36mp Sony, can we anticipate that it too will not be a casual point and shoot if we want to reach the potential it has to offer? I am actually wondering if the small footprint of these bodies will make good hand held results easier or harder to obtain than with a full size DSLR?
Any thoughts would be interesting!
Greg...Show more →
just double or triple your shutter speed from what you would need for a given focal length on film and you'll be fine (just like with the d800). with regard small size, i find it slightly more difficult with small bodies.
p.57 #15 · Official: Sony A7 and A7R Fullframe Mirrorless
sebboh wrote:
just double or triple your shutter speed from what you would need for a given focal length on film and you'll be fine (just like with the d800). with regard small size, i find it slightly more difficult with small bodies.
Also, to use good technique in supporting the camera as much and as often as possible. Try to take shots between pulse beats and not when you exhale or inhale.
p.57 #16 · Official: Sony A7 and A7R Fullframe Mirrorless
You might prefer something else then, there is plenty of space left on the anti-EVF bandwagon and in fact I am counting on it, having an OVF camera to sell.
I do suspect however that the EVF bandwagon will be lurching heavily to one side in a month or so as people like to pile onto a good idea all at once. All of photography is a compromise it should be clear...but EVF implementation in Sony FF cameras literally transformed my work. My indoor stuff is an average of ISO 5000, these are objects no one else can shoot - no flash allowed...
The details are there alright, but out there is where they stay with a poor old OVF operating in dim light...but 5.x or 11.7x means you see them that much closer! Ever used binoculars? It's my last word on it, so like it, or maybe not. Plenty of OVF cameras around...
p.57 #17 · Official: Sony A7 and A7R Fullframe Mirrorless
Rich, snipers get very good at this aspect and so can you, it's a matter of knowing the physiology and a little technique. If you can get hold of it, get this magazine:
p.57 #18 · Official: Sony A7 and A7R Fullframe Mirrorless
philip_pj wrote:
Rich, snipers get very good at this aspect and so can you, it's a matter of knowing the physiology and a little technique. If you can get hold of it, get this magazine:
It's all in the hold and release when SS and ISO fails...
Philip,
Thank you. I used to have steadier hands than I do now, but they are not that bad. Considering I broke both wrists in a bicycle accident with a car (the car won) in 1993 and having had Quadruple Bypass Heart Surgery on May 22 of this year.
p.57 #19 · Official: Sony A7 and A7R Fullframe Mirrorless
Is this CV 180/4 the ultimate easy use alt telephoto for the 'FF NEX'?...It swims on the D200 in the image..weighs a few grams more than the 24-70 Zeiss zoom, adapter needs to be added of course.
p.57 #20 · Official: Sony A7 and A7R Fullframe Mirrorless
just double or triple your shutter speed from what you would need for a given focal length on film and you'll be fine (just like with the d800). with regard small size, i find it slightly more difficult with small bodies.
Also, to use good technique in supporting the camera as much and as often as possible. Try to take shots between pulse beats and not when you exhale or inhale.
Rich
Both are very valid points but still I wonder if in questionable light if good hand held results are going to be tough when we can't or don't want to increase shutter speed because of the ISO we are already at? Always we make compromises of course. But will this amazing resolution make the 36mp version a more "specialized" camera verse the lower resolution sibling? I know with compromised light and ISO equal I would often prefer the results from the 16mp D4 vs the hand held results I would obtain with the 36mp D800. I am asking myself which new Sony would make the best "do it all" body? I think if standing in front of the Golden Gate Bridge with a tripod, my choice would be easy. However, if on the run touring the Bay Area on a dark day I am not convinced which camera would be best when focusing at infinity and wanting the lowest ISO possible while hand holding.
The fun things to ponder :-))
Regards to all,
Greg
