p.2 #1 · Roger Cicala wants to buy a camera system and is blogging about it
Hi Roger,
Curious is I, why not a few fast primes and f4 zooms? Other than perhaps BOKEH, shallow DOF, most of the f2.8L II glass is two/three times the cost...
As a poor hobbyist with more L than non-L glass, on a fairly slim budget and no Professional/sales intentions, it's interesting why the f4's weren't considered, your list doesn't include filters, mono/tripods, ball/fluid heads, bags, batteries, grips, etc...storage/cards.
I like your write-ups so far, lots of good thoughts/thinkings...keep going, I'm looking forward to your final choosings.
p.2 #2 · Roger Cicala wants to buy a camera system and is blogging about it
Great articles. If it was me, I would either Pick Canon or Nikon just based on their huge selection of goodies (the system rich of lenses/flashes etc).
I just went though this recently and did a small comparison. After being a Canon Shooter for 7 years I have went to a D600. And the "main" reason was the excellent deals they had around Christmas. I felt like I got the best bang for the buck for what I do.
(I do miss mine old 5d mark III AF though lol every once in a while.)
Good luck on your journey and I hope you pick what is BEST for YOUR needs.
p.2 #3 · Roger Cicala wants to buy a camera system and is blogging about it
D800, tamron 24-70 vr, nikon 70-200 2.8 VR2, sigma 35 1.4, and 85 1.4, nikon 14-24 or 16-40 vr, or tokina 16-28 2.8. any macro lens (they are all pretty damn good, I am partial to sigma 150). your only deficiency is a good long lens in nikon. Nothing like the 100-400L or 400 5.6. you can drop the nikon 70-200 and go for the sigma 120-300 OS with a tc, but big and heavy and image quality not that great. I dont know how the simga 120-400 (not as good a lens) fares on the d800. the long end was the deficiency when I was looking to nikon for a possilbe switch.
Honestly, if you are truly brand agnostic, there are so many good third party lenses availabe these days, that the better resolution and sensor of d800 would trump things for me if I were to start over.
Reportedly Rokinon is releasing a tse-24 in a couple of months, and both canon and nikon have one anyway.
This all comes from a canon fan. the difference is not great enough for my style of shooting, and I have realized that the extra dynamic range is a lot of times not applicable, but I just thing Nikon is a wiser choice right now.
Canon does have the better sevice (as you pointed in one of your comparisons before) and you did say thats important to you.
p.2 #5 · Roger Cicala wants to buy a camera system and is blogging about it
He needs to buy a camera to keep at his house
I can grab whatever I need if it's in stock and we're not down to the last couple of copies - renters come first.
But it's not possible for me to keep lensrentals' stock at the house 24/7.
Everyone's comments about lenses reflects my own thoughts. Right now I'm comparing the 6 I've chosen on preliminary screen, definitely ruled out one, close to ruling out another 2. After that I'll start looking at lens selections and modify things. The list was strictly to give myself a reality check and general price comparison.
I don't think there's one of those systems, excepting perhaps the Pentax, where I'd actually go with the lens selection I used in the price comparison chart.
p.2 #7 · Roger Cicala wants to buy a camera system and is blogging about it
Nice writeup again by Roger, and while my needs are different than his, it's always interesting to read thoughts of another sprinkled with a few stats for us nerdy numbers guys
Nikon loses me when it comes to their overall lens lineup and, because I'm cheap, their used market. They also lose for me when it comes to overall body operation.
Once you start looking for affordable over 200mm, pickings get slim quickly. Their 300/4 is great IQ and AF but lacks VR. Their 80-400 is an embarrassment vs the Canon 1-400. Canon covers this range with a 300/4 IS, 1-400 and 400/5.6 and all of them are pretty darn good.
Because I'm moving (slowly) into TS-E stuff, Canon also wins this race for me. Nikon doesn't even have a 17mm PC-E and their 24 PC-E is inferior to Canon's mk II version.
(btw free plug for LR - I've got one of their Canon 17 TS-E rentals coming this Monday - whee! Gotta shoot my home interior for the realtor...plus I want to play with their 17. I could have probably pulled this off with shifted 24mm shots but I want the ultra-wide stuff for fun and will crop later if need be).
Combine the "lens issue" (for me) with the body ergonomics of which I just prefer how Canon does things and it's a pretty easy pick for me.
Granted, their sensors are the bomb and I really like the way they were going with some of their 1.8 primes (and I love CLS - their stuff just works), but in the end sticking with Canon was pretty easy.
If I didn't have these requirements (17 TSE and better affordable long glass) the Nikon path would have been VERY tempting to take - both the D600 and D800 are very compelling cameras and I would have just bit the bullet and went with a BigmOS or something for the long end.
p.2 #8 · Roger Cicala wants to buy a camera system and is blogging about it
Roger, given your choices Id choose the 5D3.
Really the ONLY thing the D800/e has over the Canon is the sensor performance (DR) when bringing up shadows and a bit more resolution.
As a complete package the 5D3 is awesome. Fast/responsive AF and very consistent in a wide range of situations. Very easy to use camera and feels good in hand. Battery performance is good and the charger and batteries are pretty compact.
I am sure you have much more data on this but the 5D3 is also a very reliable camera ive used it professionally in really harsh weather and conditions and it has never let me down although I have a 1DS3 as backup most of the time. Canon Service, like you have mentioned, is also very good.
If you were mostly a landscape shooter (on a tripod) then it would be a close call and the D800e might be the best choice.
But again, the 5D3 is awesome at low light / very long exposures. Something I dont think DXo tests for. And for all the reasons mentioned its an extremely versatile camera. Probably the best Canon has produced at any price when you consider all factors.
Regarding the lenses I think its a non-factor (although Canon might have a slight edge). Again, Im sure you have extensive info on this!
...and when Canon releases a new full frame DSLR with better sensor that matches the D800/e then youll have the lenses, its really a no brainer
p.2 #10 · Roger Cicala wants to buy a camera system and is blogging about it
Welcome to the proletariat, Roger! We have never known the luxury of some company buying cameras and lenses for us. Well, okay, I did get one as a gift. A Petri f1.9 Color Corrected Super. Nice little rangefinder that still worked.
p.2 #13 · Roger Cicala wants to buy a camera system and is blogging about it
Roger, I look at your second blog post...and I quote...
Nearly Absolute Requirements I have a few requirements for my new system. (Focal lengths I use below are full-frame equivalent.)
Lenses
A reasonably lightweight 400mm telephoto lens (zoom or prime)
A high-quality macro lens (I prefer 100mm but am flexible)
A high-quality 24-70 f/2.8 (I might consider f/4 with stabilization)
A standard to slightly wide focal length, wide-aperture prime lens
A wide-angle to ultra wide-angle lens (20mm acceptable, 14mm preferred)
Camera
At least 16 megapixels resolution
A viewfinder (optical preferred, good EVF acceptable)
Shoe-mount flash
Excellent ISO 800 performance
Accurate Live View or contrast-based focus assist
3 frames per second minimum in RAW
Microfocus adjustment
Things I Would Like Lenses
A tilt-shift
A true supertelephoto (300 f/2.8 minimum, 500 f/4)
A selection of reasonably-priced, high-quality prime lenses
Good 70-200 image stabilized zoom Camera
At least 20 megapixels
Excellent dynamic range
Excellent ISO 1600, adequate ISO 3200 performance
5 frames per second in RAW
Excellent single shot AF performance (realizing this is somewhat lens-dependent within each system)
In your "Nearly Absolute Requirements" your very first item is something (a lightweight 400mm lens) that ONLY Canon has a clear advantage. Everything else under "Lenses", and "Camera" could be any manufacturer.
In your "Things I Would Like Lenses" section the very first thing you list is "A tilt-shift" lens...that, again Canon clearly has the advantage. Everything else under this section could be any manufacturer.
I'm equipment agnostic, and I shoot with both Canon and Nikon, but - my very first thought was you want, require, would like to have the Canon 5D Mark III. You seemed to make a set of criteria that aims directly at that camera and model. Problem is, you have objective facts and data points slapping you in the face. My advice is to ignore the objective facts and get the camera - you already know you want....the 5D mark III. All your potential choices are great equipment, and all of them can meet your needs. However, you are in the unique position of applying a little balm should regret strike, and you can get a fix from your business of one of the other choices.
p.2 #15 · Roger Cicala wants to buy a camera system and is blogging about it
Really enjoyed your articles a s look forward to your decision!
For me it is the lenses that keep me with Canon..that and the video functions and compatibility of EF lenses with the c300.
If you did go with canon...
5DIII
Lexar 1000x cards
24-70 II
17 TS-E
85L II or 135L
200 F2L IS or 300 2.8L IS (we know you love the 200 from your reviews)
TC 1.4x III
400 5.6L or 100-400L (lightweight)
Your sigma 35 1.4
p.2 #16 · Roger Cicala wants to buy a camera system and is blogging about it
Thanks for the wright up Roger and congratulations on the nominee for CEO of year. It gives us all a reality check. Just be glad your needs don't include a super telephoto prime lens or two.
p.2 #17 · Roger Cicala wants to buy a camera system and is blogging about it
Have to admit I seriously looked at the d800 and at about the same time Fred reviewed it.
Looking at the lens lineup I wanted (17-40,17tse,24tse,24-105,70-200,400/5.6) I couldnt see a way to get what I wanted in nikon land irrespective of how good the bodies may be.
p.2 #20 · Roger Cicala wants to buy a camera system and is blogging about it
I have enjoyed reading the whole series. It's nice to have choices. My take from Roger's blog is, as a Canon user, just how close Canon is to having it all. We're just one high mp camera, some firmware and perhaps an excellent ultrawide zoom away. I'm sure that will come in time, but overall I'm pretty happy now. Having good competition in the market helps us all.
