p.3 #1 · Why I personally get so damned angry with Bob
ferrerfoto wrote:
Our bride from a few weeks back announced after the ceremony (small crowd of about 30 guests) that she didnt want anyone posting any images on FB. I was actually surprised to hear that. And I think everyone respected her wishes as far as I can tell.
That is rad. This is a bride who knows she wants to be blown away with the images you provide her, and wants it all to be a beautiful surprise.
p.3 #3 · Why I personally get so damned angry with Bob
Dave_EP wrote:
they're going to continue doing it and as mobile devices get smarter, it's going to happen even quicker. There could be a shot of the confetti or first kiss on facebook within seconds of it happening
You know what I had a few years back? I had an old Uncle Bob greet the couple's arrival at the reception with AN ALBUM of photos of the ceremony!
Sep 04, 2012 at 02:06 PM
marti.g3 Offline • • • • [X]
p.3 #4 · Why I personally get so damned angry with Bob
Is Facebook REALLY the deciding factor for our profession ? Let them post.....our clients will still love our work even they have seen crappy images on FB.
p.3 #5 · Why I personally get so damned angry with Bob
The impact of some of your photos are seriously damaged but since all this shit is part
of the game I dont think your business is in jeopardy if one does the job and satisfies the expectations.
Guests will see the album as a whole so if the photographer gives a nice one the impact thing wont matter
so much at this stage I think.
p.3 #6 · Why I personally get so damned angry with Bob
marti.g3 wrote:
Is Facebook REALLY the deciding factor for our profession ?
That's a rather facile summary of what I said, Facebook is the medium, my complaint is that we're merely providing a better version of something they already have.
p.3 #7 · Why I personally get so damned angry with Bob
I hear you but unless you have a plan to change it i guess it is just a matter of accepting what we cannot change. That or just keep getting knotted up about it.
Lets also remember that brides have seen less than adequate shots from their weddings before the professional ones
from guest (shot over our shoulders) years before digital and social media.
p.3 #8 · Why I personally get so damned angry with Bob
People take pictures of the Summer,
Just in case someone thought they had missed it,
Just to proved that it really existed.
People take pictures of each other,
And the moment to last them for ever,
Of the time when they mattered to someone.
Picture of me when I was just three,
Sat with my ma by the old oak tree.
Oh how I love things as they used to be,
Don't show me no more, please.
- "People Take Pictures of Each Other" -The Kinks
Sep 05, 2012 at 07:52 AM
marti.g3 Offline • • • • [X]
p.3 #9 · Why I personally get so damned angry with Bob
Chris Beaumont wrote:
That's a rather facile summary of what I said, Facebook is the medium, my complaint is that we're merely providing a better version of something they already have.
Depends on how one wants to look at it. I dont think the facebook guest photos really affect the excitement our brides have for our photos. They know the difference.
p.3 #10 · Why I personally get so damned angry with Bob
Chris Beaumont wrote:
That's a rather facile summary of what I said, Facebook is the medium, my complaint is that we're merely providing a better version of something they already have.
Social media has stolen the "surprise" factor of professional photography. Using an off-topic example, look at the car industry. A manufacturer announces they are updating a new car and puts out a calculated press release to build up anticipation for it.
Back before cameras in cell phone were prevalent, everyone had to wait until the car shows to see what was coming. The professional shots of said car that were released soon after were coveted for the folks that couldn't make the car shows.
Nowadays you have people hunting to capture testing shots of the car with camera phones and P&S. Then you have people taking those preliminary photos and Photoshopping rendering of what they think it will look like. Now, by the time it hits the car shows, people are just confirming what the production version of the car will look like. And those professional shots that are released after only have the benefit of possibly becoming better desktop background material (outside of advertising value...).
So if the "surprise" factor is something you truly value as a result of your work product, you're only resource is to draw on the scenes in which only you are shooting the bride/groom/associated parties (and subsequently creating such scenarios). As far as the ceremony and reception goes, you're gonna be up a creek with no paddle and a 3" hole in the bottom of your boat. The only other option is to get the Bride and Groom to disallow hobby photography during those times (and not too many are going to want the stress of enforcing such a hard rule added onto them during their wedding day).
p.3 #12 · Why I personally get so damned angry with Bob
eNoBlog wrote:
But, but, but... is "surprise" that big of a portion of what we're delivering to our clients?
It is if you are hoping for the oohs and ahhs when they first see your photos.
When it comes to seeing 'your' photos for the first time, instead of getting an ooh or an ahhh, or the tears you would normally expect, you hear... oh that's the one Uncle Bob posted, oh that's the one cousin Anne posted, oh that's the one ..... you get the idea then it's all a bit of a let down.
Yours may be technically & artistically better (even by a very long way), but if it's not the first time they've seen it as a concept, even if it is from 1 foot to the right and down a bit) then much of the magic has been lost.
It's partly that magic that keeps people referring over and over again. Yes there are many other factors (don't want to open a can of worms here!) but the feeling the B+G get the first time they see their photos can never be underestimated.
p.3 #13 · Why I personally get so damned angry with Bob
Dave_EP wrote:
It is if you are hoping for the oohs and ahhs when they first see your photos.
When it comes to seeing 'your' photos for the first time, instead of getting an ooh or an ahhh, or the tears you would normally expect, you hear... oh that's the one Uncle Bob posted, oh that's the one cousin Anne posted, oh that's the one ..... you get the idea then it's all a bit of a let down.
I understand, but if can't produce something different enough from what U.B. puts out, the problem is bigger than the missing oohs and ahhs. Personally, I don't think U.B. can really poach any more from you than the set/posed/static shots. If you have a PJ/documentary component to your work, you'll best U.B. every time. Lighting is another component: maybe using all ambient and not working to modify lighting isn't such a hot idea after all if you want to differentiate yourself from U.B., not to mention the rest of the industry.
p.3 #14 · Why I personally get so damned angry with Bob
eNoBlog wrote:
Lighting is another component: maybe using all ambient and not working to modify lighting isn't such a hot idea after all if you want to differentiate yourself from U.B., not to mention the rest of the industry.
Very true.... but then there are times when you can't use lighting, such as in the church. Last week I had several people stood at the back of the church shooting over my shoulder, with (these are the ones I recognised, there were others too):
Now, with that lot, I'm unlikely to get anything significantly better in the same church looking from the back of the same isle!
Then, two rows back from the B+G was another guy with a Nikon D5100 on the left and a a guy with a Canon G12 on the right. Both kept leaning out in to the isle to get shots.
Sure, I was the only one going forward to get the official register shot, but there's quite a few already on facebook of them signing taken from the back.
Now, fair enough, the reception can be a little different, although this one happened to be almost all outside in very limited space and not much in the way of creative opportunities. With limited time on the package booked by the B+G, I'm away home a long time before the other guys (after speeches) and they will get another few hours of shots that I won't have.
I'm not complaining, it's more an observation, but it goes to show that sometimes the opportunities to create 'different' shots is severely limited. I've already seen some perfectly respectable shots on Facebook and there's very little they can look forward to from me that isn't already there, including all my group shots and "couple" poses. Yes, we took some inside before the wedding breakfast, on the stairs etc with lights that UB didn't get, but it's maybe 10-15 shots total, plus the ones from (a very crowded room for) Bride Prep!
With that many friends turning up with that kind of gear with the sole intent of taking photos all day (instead of being a bored guest) I'm really not sure why the couple even booked a photographer. Exactly how am I supposed to Wow! them now?
The good news is we also covered it all on video, and for all the little hand held camcorders the friends had, I do know that we can (and will) deliver an exceptionally high quality product on Blu-ray that no one else could have captured, including multiple angles, well edited, and sound mixing that will surpass anything anyone else can deliver. But that doesn't come even close to negating the frustration on the photo side of things.
p.3 #16 · Why I personally get so damned angry with Bob
Dave_EP wrote:
Oh, I just found out they're all members of the local photo club and often have competitions.
None of them wanted to 'shoot the wedding'
Either contact the president or ask for an opportunity to present to the club. They'd love to have you. Talk about weddings, then slide in a discussion of etiquette of crashing weddings for a club competition.
p.3 #17 · Why I personally get so damned angry with Bob
Dave_EP wrote:
With that many friends turning up with that kind of gear with the sole intent of taking photos all day (instead of being a bored guest) I'm really not sure why the couple even booked a photographer. Exactly how am I supposed to Wow! them now?
No, I get you. I feel your pain. But I hope there's more to what you did than those shots they could grab from the back of the church, or from a reception table. I hope you used solid composition, shot after shot; I hope your DOF selection was spot-on to suit each subject; I hope you were framing your backgrounds with extreme care; I hope you captured detail shots that uniquely characterized the wedding day (most U.B.'s miss this completely -- even the ones in photo clubs!); I hope your consistent ability to capture precise moments was better than theirs; I hope you lit the reception hall with more than a straight-on camera flash; I hope your post-processing brings your images to their fullest potential, beyond what the SOOC JPG crowd gets; above all, I hope you saw shots they didn't even have the slightest clue were there.
Again, I understand what you're saying, but the things they posted on FB are the obvious ones. The reason the B&G hired you is because you can do more than that: you can transcend above what the every-other-month shooter will get even with the sweetest gear.
Oh, and how are you supposed to Wow them!? I hope not solely on the basis of the photos you took, but also on your superior service and interactions with them, and on your on-schedule/prompt and consistent delivery of products. I bring that up, because FB is one thing, but the B&G can dream on if they think they will get usable copies of every photo "the other" photographers took and the B&G happened to like.
p.3 #18 · Why I personally get so damned angry with Bob
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These people need to take a long hard look at themselves. Nothing to do with me being a photographer, I just find it really saddening how people love through a camera/photo these days, without experiencing it. If you combine that with a wedding, where someone is there specifically to do this, it can become frustrating. And, in your example, I can relate. I had a 5 hour wedding back in July, which between switching venues and getting the more standard/structural images & groups/portraits, there really was little time for anything else at all. At all. Luckily there were next to no uncle bobs or whatever you'd describe the group you recently had, armed with professional gear... I'm sure you can find a word or two... But IF 'they' were about, I think I'd feel pretty redundant in what I had to offer. Sure it would be good quality, but definitely diluted... Impact deflated... My images are pretty spontaneous/relaxed/reportage as well. I guess part of my solution is trying to sell the TIME on the day, which will result in a fuller story. The longer I'm there, the more opportunities for images where Bob's aren't about, and Bobs will never see. Of course, this is a very minor reason for me being there longer, but I do believe I can find different images more effectively when I have time to think during different parts of the day.
Oh, and the other thing is as soon as you see other people reaching for their camera, put yours down and walk away . That doesn't work too well in critical moments of course...
