Truth to the cheapness of 1300px screens on 15" PC laptops. More res used to come standard when the 4:3 aspect ratio was king, but makers decided to cheap out their resolutions to save costs and boost short term profits (this is happening in just about every industry), and lowered resolution collectively when we went to 16:10. I've bought multiple 17" laptops just to avoid the 1300px range, and it would be nice to get 1600x900 or better without having to buy another 17", especially since I'm planning on buying a 15" for my next laptop since it'll be far cheaper to set one up with 16 gb of memory.
With Thunderbolt and USB3.0, I would hardly say it's not upgrade-able. Yes, get the 16gb of RAM from the factory, but how many of us have actually upgraded anything in a laptop besides RAM or switching to an SSD? I've built my own desktop, but that's all I've done to my laptop.
And as for resolution, I do really like my 1920x1080 15" (HP Envy), but the Retina display is appealing to me because at 5mp I would feel comfortable culling photos without ever zooming in.
brett maxwell wrote:
With Thunderbolt and USB3.0, I would hardly say it's not upgrade-able. Yes, get the 16gb of RAM from the factory, but how many of us have actually upgraded anything in a laptop besides RAM or switching to an SSD? I've built my own desktop, but that's all I've done to my laptop.
And as for resolution, I do really like my 1920x1080 15" (HP Envy), but the Retina display is appealing to me because at 5mp I would feel comfortable culling photos without ever zooming in.
Not sure if you know this, but the SSD is a proprietary form factor that cannot currently be upgraded. They could have chosen universal standards and could have chosen not to solder the ram to the motherboard, but they didn't.
They have the best product and they intend to wring every penny they can out of their customer base because of it. Buying these products only supports these underhanded practices.
Only thing I'm excited about for the new MacBook Pro is that pc laptops are now going to come out with larger laptops without an optical drive. I've been waiting.
Perhaps there's BIOS verification that keeps you from installing OS X onto 3rd party SSDs...
The issue with the SSD is that it currently has a different pin design than a standard SSD. This means that currently NO aftermarket SSDs will work in it's place. It's not a drastic difference either (enough to warrant a design change either way). It's just different enough so that if you need anything SSD related, you are forced to come back to Apple instead of going to a third party for parts or repair.
deepbluejh wrote:
Not sure if you know this, but the SSD is a proprietary form factor that cannot currently be upgraded. They could have chosen universal standards and could have chosen not to solder the ram to the motherboard, but they didn't.
They have the best product and they intend to wring every penny they can out of their customer base because of it. Buying these products only supports these underhanded practices.
Apple's upgrade to 16 GB of RAM is $200. Replacing the previous MBP's with 16 GB by swapping out the current chips cost almost as much, so that's not that much of an impact to the end user. We make a lot of assumptions as consumers, but the soldered RAM is limited to the Retina models AFAIK. The Retina models are significantly thinner than the non-Retina models, so that could be a design decision. The fact that the older models still have replaceable RAM chips means that Apple isn't really looking for soldered RAM chips as a viable revenue stream by any means.
Your'e right, the SSD currently can't be upgraded, but just like the MB Air, I'm sure 3rd party vendors like OWC will find a solution too in a matter of time. With Thunderbolt and USB3 ports, storage shouldn't be a problem anyway. The bandwidth of these I/O's more than accommodate even the fastest SSD's to date.
danvprod wrote:
Ram is soldered on motherboard. Make sure you pay the extra $200 to go up to 16gb. Screen is really nice. I wonder how accurate it is/how easy it is to calibrate.
Buy everything you need (not want) upfront as you will not be able to upgrade anything later on this machine. RAM is soldered & SSD is proprietery connection. Those are two things people normally upgrade on Macs and Apple is planning on milking with both hands so make sure you reach Apple store with fat open wallet .
deepbluejh wrote:
Not sure if you know this, but the SSD is a proprietary form factor that cannot currently be upgraded. They could have chosen universal standards and could have chosen not to solder the ram to the motherboard, but they didn't.
They have the best product and they intend to wring every penny they can out of their customer base because of it. Buying these products only supports these underhanded practices.
and that's their prerogative. the price for a 512gb SSD is pretty reasonable and I'd argue it's all anyone needs when you have really fast connections for external storage. yeah, the ram is expensive, but not insane, and as much as I like saving a buck and upgrading myself, I'd opt for theirs anyway for the sake of warranty on a $3k+ machine.
brett maxwell wrote:
and that's their prerogative. the price for a 512gb SSD is pretty reasonable and I'd argue it's all anyone needs when you have really fast connections for external storage. yeah, the ram is expensive, but not insane, and as much as I like saving a buck and upgrading myself, I'd opt for theirs anyway for the sake of warranty on a $3k+ machine.
I guess my point is that this fits into the Apple narrative perfectly. They are all about reducing consumer choice to the benefit of their corporate profit. Sure, the "warrantied" RAM may be better, but shouldn't YOU have the choice on which ram to use on the $2500 laptop YOU just payed your hard earned money for? I would think so. Apple does not. Ditto with the SSD and a myriad of other things Apple sells.
This is one of the primary reasons why they are unlikely to get my money in the future.
brett maxwell wrote:
and that's their prerogative. the price for a 512gb SSD is pretty reasonable and I'd argue it's all anyone needs when you have really fast connections for external storage. yeah, the ram is expensive, but not insane, and as much as I like saving a buck and upgrading myself, I'd opt for theirs anyway for the sake of warranty on a $3k+ machine.
Not exactly - you cannot get 512SSD + 16GB RAM on base model i.e. $2199. For that you've to bump upto next level i.e. $2799 +$200 for ram upgrade and no difference in (256 to 512) 256GB of SSD is not $600 in after market. Replacing HDD and RAM in existing Macbook Pro doesnot void your warranty (atleast not on non-Retina models till last year). I think for that kind of money I'd go for iMac + Macbook Air combo rather than Macbook Pro.
deepbluejh wrote:
I guess my point is that this fits into the Apple narrative perfectly. They are all about reducing consumer choice to the benefit of their corporate profit. Sure, the "warrantied" RAM may be better, but shouldn't YOU have the choice on which ram to use on the $2500 laptop YOU just payed your hard earned money for? I would think so. Apple does not. Ditto with the SSD and a myriad of other things Apple sells.
This is one of the primary reasons why they are unlikely to get my money in the future.
Very well put - It really begins to raise questions: Is this planned obsolescence at work, or is the freedom promised in 1984 being revoked ?
The MacBook Pro with Retina display is currently non-serviceable. That's the biggest issue with the thing. You HAVE to purchase AppleCare with it now unless you want your laptop uncovered after a single year. While the RMBP has its advantages in speed, it's still limited by a slightly faster version of SATA which could have been eliminated with an integration of the SSD directly into the logic board. They went so far only to botch up the SSD speed at that last turn. I'm definitely waiting until next year to purchase since this years model is essentially a beta. Integrated fast Ivy Bridge RAM? No problem. Integrated high end graphics? No problem. The entire board is designed well until they get to the SSD which you can't replace anyways even with another similar unit that is larger. Even the battery is glued into the chassis. For a consumer, this machine is a good thing because it's built to be consumed and then recycled. Any problems with a unit, they just give you a new one. The life of the MBPR is 3-4 years tops. I definitely wouldn't purchase one without AppleCare.
whtrbt7 wrote:
The MacBook Pro with Retina display is currently non-serviceable. That's the biggest issue with the thing. You HAVE to purchase AppleCare with it now unless you want your laptop uncovered after a single year. While the RMBP has its advantages in speed, it's still limited by a slightly faster version of SATA which could have been eliminated with an integration of the SSD directly into the logic board. They went so far only to botch up the SSD speed at that last turn. I'm definitely waiting until next year to purchase since this years model is essentially a beta. Integrated fast Ivy Bridge RAM? No problem. Integrated high end graphics? No problem. The entire board is designed well until they get to the SSD which you can't replace anyways even with another similar unit that is larger. Even the battery is glued into the chassis. For a consumer, this machine is a good thing because it's built to be consumed and then recycled. Any problems with a unit, they just give you a new one. The life of the MBPR is 3-4 years tops. I definitely wouldn't purchase one without AppleCare....Show more →
Agreed.
I checked it out at the Apple Store the other day, yes it's very nice, but they sure are making them disposable, not serviceable. Not a big enough upgrade to lure me away from my matte screen high-res 2011 (with 16 GB of user installed RAM).
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