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Archive 2011 · Canon 35 L 1.4 sharpness

  
 
M Vers
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p.3 #1 · Canon 35 L 1.4 sharpness


jcolwell wrote:
It certainly looks like the box is parallel* to the sensor, in the vertical plane. The observed OOF effect could easily be seen if the line of sight for the lens was slightly to the "left of centre", with respect to the box. It looks as if this could be the case in your example photo.

* The visible surface of the box is not perpendicular to the sensor plane, it's parallel to the sensor plane, more or less.


I was shooting damn near close to MFD at an extremely wide aperture--even the slightest angle will cause OOF areas (the gum package may not have been perfectly flat either). The point is if I wanted such narrow DOF I'd make sure the target area (in the case of the example the 'T') was in focus.



May 20, 2011 at 09:49 PM
M Vers
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p.3 #2 · Canon 35 L 1.4 sharpness


EyeBrock wrote:
Typical. I bought the 35L in April. MkII en route...


Maybe...maybe not--until it does use the hell out of the one you've got



May 20, 2011 at 09:57 PM
Lars Johnsson
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p.3 #3 · Canon 35 L 1.4 sharpness


michael49 wrote:
Honestly, besides astrophotography, how often do you really need sharp corners at f/1.4?


Why do you need sharper corners when you shoot at f/2,8-- f/4 or f/5,6 than you need at f/1,4

Every time I shoot in low light or indoor wide open I prefer the people in the edges/corners to be sharp also. Just as I do with the people in the corners at f/5,6



May 21, 2011 at 01:57 AM
PhilDrinkwater
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p.3 #4 · Canon 35 L 1.4 sharpness


ifxbonz wrote:
I hear people say this lens is sharp wide open, but is it as sharp at 1.4 as it is at 2.8 or are there differences. is 1.4 acceptable or is it actually sharp? Some samples at 1.4 and 100% crop would be nice as compared to 2.2 or 2.8.

Andy

My honest view is that, if you're asking this kind of question, you're missing the point of lenses like this: they are pretty sharp wide open - certainly sharp enough - but their beauty is in what they do to the WHOLE image, not pixels at 100% zoom..



May 21, 2011 at 05:22 PM
kevindar
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p.3 #5 · Canon 35 L 1.4 sharpness


I find the lens has excellent center sharpness at 1.4. Center sharpness does improve slightly upon stopping down to f2, and contrast slightly improves. I have never tested corner sharpness on this lens, as I dont shoot landscape with it, so dont know how it performs there. Some family shots on 5d2
1.4
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3587/5744020631_3529c211a1_b.jpg
100% crop
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2480/5744568548_b0eb614751_o.jpg
f 2
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3533/5744028135_0846261f13_b.jpg
100% crop.
http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5222/5744575896_59f2a0fe78_o.jpg



May 21, 2011 at 06:06 PM
EyeBrock
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p.3 #6 · Canon 35 L 1.4 sharpness


M Vers wrote:
Maybe...maybe not--until it does use the hell out of the one you've got


I do like this lens! Nothing lost on buying it. Much gained.



May 21, 2011 at 06:35 PM
M Vers
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p.3 #7 · Canon 35 L 1.4 sharpness


Peter Figen wrote:
I'll try and do the same in the next few days. I spend more than a fair amount of time testing lenses, so I know exatly what to expect when I use them on a job, and even then there are surprises.


Hey Peter, Did you get a chance to give the test shots a go yet? I'm curious as to your findings.



May 21, 2011 at 09:37 PM
M Vers
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p.3 #8 · Canon 35 L 1.4 sharpness


EyeBrock wrote:
I do like this lens! Nothing lost on buying it. Much gained.





May 21, 2011 at 09:38 PM
Gunzorro
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p.3 #9 · Canon 35 L 1.4 sharpness


First of all, I'd like to say that these are some lovely photos being posted above, showing the artistic use of selective focus. I think they are great shots, and I can see this lens is vital to producing this sort of effect.

Many people also love the effect of "natural" vignetting produced by a cheap lens with poor control of spherical aberrations. Canon for one has made a practice of lenses that actually accentuate this distortion in their soft focus lenses.

Here are some examples -- nothing cute or sentimental to compete against the lovely images above -- to show what I consider an acceptibly sharp lens.

I just received this lens last week, along with an adapter to mount on EOS bodies. The lens is Contax/Zeiss 80-200/4 T* Vario-Sonnar, a manual focus, and on Canon bodies, manual aperture. The lens was pretty sharp at all apertures, but really corner-to-corner sharp at f/11-16.

80mm, 1/50 @ f/16, ISO 200 (-2/3 EV in PP)
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c80/gunzorro/036N4980web.jpg

100% detail from center
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c80/gunzorro/036N4980cropweb.jpg

Here's a different angle and focal length, showing edge/corner close-up.

200mm, 1/160 @ f/16
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c80/gunzorro/036N4968web.jpg

100% detail, left edge
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c80/gunzorro/036N4968leftweb.jpg

100% detail, right corner
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c80/gunzorro/036N4968rightweb.jpg

I'm sure you'll all agree that I'm leaving a lot of leeway in my definition of what is sharp -- these aren't absolutely sharp. But they are pretty sharp, enough to get the tactile impression of what those raspy boards must feel like.

I suppose the opposite can be argued for the 35/1.4L -- it has enough sharpness, but also provides a comfy soft cocoon around the subjects. Fence = menacing and abrasive. Puppy = soft and snuggly. Toddler = adorable! (Playing the "Toddler Card" should be banned.)

I totally agree that puppies, toddlers, and Maria Bello (lovely family, Kevin!) all look cuter than a redwood fence.

My point in describing sharpness is that it should show fine detail throughout the image for a lens to be called "sharp". I know I'm going against the grain, fighting a losing battle of emotionally charged semantics, but just thought I'd show where I'm coming from. (Perhaps twilight and architectural photography saps one's soul?)

Edited on May 22, 2011 at 03:24 PM · View previous versions



May 22, 2011 at 03:13 PM
gdanmitchell
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p.3 #10 · Canon 35 L 1.4 sharpness


Gunzorro wrote:
My point in describing sharpness is that it should show fine detail throughout the image for a lens to be called "sharp". I know I'm going against the grain, fighting a losing battle of emotionally charged semantics, but just thought I'd show where I'm coming from. (Perhaps twilight and architectural photography saps one's soul?)


When it comes to my prints, I think I'm pretty much as careful about "sharpness" as anyone else, and perhaps more careful and critical than some.

I have nothing against a sharp lens. I have some that are exceptionally sharp, particularly when used in the ways I typically use them. That said, a few observations about sharpness:

- Quite a wide range of lenses can produce really, really excellent sharpness in large prints. While you might be able to detect some small differences among them if you switched back and forth between 100% magnification crops on your monitor and looked very carefully, it is very rare for such differences to be detectible in, say, a 20" x 30" print.

- With this in mind, in most cases making "sharpness" the most important (or the only!) parameter when selecting a lens is not only relatively pointless, but it can lead to giving up useful things (like flexibility, or size/weight, or your money!) that could end up not being unimportant. Up to a point, sharpness is very important - no one wants a fuzzy lens - but once you get to the realm of "they are all sharp" it is time to look past the search for the Holy Sharpest Lens and instead look for the lens that works best for you.

- If you don't regularly make very large prints and if you don't regularly work carefully from the tripod with remote release and all the rest, this small increment visible-at-100% differences end up being swamped by other factors that affect sharpness. Camera stability, accuracy of AF or MF, choice of aperture, air movement, waiting for camera/lens to settle before shooting, and other factors end up having a more significant effect, especially if you are pushing the upper boundaries of print size.

- Eventually, if you are regularly pushing those upper print size boundaries with full frame DSLR gear, if you really want more system resolution it will make more sense to move to a larger format than to keep trying to squeeze incremental gains out of the smaller format. And, yes, this comes along with its own set of tradeoffs - cost, flexibility, and more.

Dan

BTW: We see a whole range of strange "which is sharpest" threads in forums. One that always gets my attention is the "help me pick the sharpest 70-200mm zoom" threads. The fact of the matter is that all of them are very, very sharp and that this is a great example of a situation in which sharpness is probably just about the least important decision point.

BTW: Yes, your Contax/Zeiss lens really does produce a very sharp image.



May 22, 2011 at 03:23 PM
stanj
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p.3 #11 · Canon 35 L 1.4 sharpness


gdanmitchell wrote:
BTW: Yes, your Contax/Zeiss lens really does produce a very sharp image.

.... yet it's still crooked



May 22, 2011 at 03:28 PM
wickerprints
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p.3 #12 · Canon 35 L 1.4 sharpness


I don't know how many times this needs to be said, but if you are buying a 35/1.4 lens to be used at f/1.4, and wanting it to be sharp corner-to-corner, you are seriously deluded and missing the point.


May 22, 2011 at 03:29 PM
Gunzorro
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p.3 #13 · Canon 35 L 1.4 sharpness


Dan -- Thanks. I think you have some very good observations there. I'm really commenting about the point where you've got a lens that has acceptible areas on everything (contrast, flare, color, CA, and other aberrations), the icing for me is "sharpness" to complete the package for a fine lens.

Yes, this is keeper! Its purchase was due to Carsten featuring it in the Alt section. One of those all-too-rare low-cost wonders.

Interesting that you mention the 70-200L models. I had one of the first series, and it was a nice lens, but I sold it because I didn't feel it was sharp enough, and I saw it was so similar to other models results that I simply ignored that focal length range (I'm more wide angle oriented). Obviously, there must be great samples out there, because I respect most of the photographer's images I've seen made with those lenses. I suppose I'm unfairly comparing image quality to want I've seen produced with macro and TS lenses, coming from a 4x5 background (not going back!). So I cashed in that 70-200 bank account and bought some other gear.

Stan -- Ha-ha! The perils of rushing around doing image testing with a tripod and release! A quick glance to secure focus, and then -- click, click, click! Tunnel vision? Me?

wicker -- I totally agree. But it still comes up occasionally that someone thinks the 35/1.4L is going to be an awesome landscape lens because they've read so many remarks about its "sharpness" (I've even been affected by its glamour). No, it's not a copy lens, or a landscape lens. It excels as we are seeing here, with some great shots of people (and animals). I'm not trying to completely pigeon-hole it either -- there are tons of uses for this type of lens.



May 22, 2011 at 03:43 PM
wickerprints
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p.3 #14 · Canon 35 L 1.4 sharpness


There aren't ANY lenses that are sharp corner-to-corner at f/1.4.


May 22, 2011 at 03:48 PM
yauyi
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p.3 #15 · Canon 35 L 1.4 sharpness


M Vers wrote:
Alright, I was only able to grab a few quick tests before the rain rolled in but this should give people a pretty good idea.
5D+35L (sharpness set to 3)
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2711/5740612901_c728b9ef60_b.jpg
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2289/5740613559_9d914cb2f8_b.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3406/5741170742_3fc1c3e29a_b.jpg
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2218/5740617467_d406518f04_b.jpg
http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5188/5741174656_ac72092a5e_b.jpg
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2225/5741175324_347f4e0221_b.jpg
Corner @ f/1.4 (focus on the 'T')
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2525/5741157840_96abd531ee_b.jpg
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2765/5740609231_21e6f9c7bd_b.jpg
With lens correction and a tiny bit of USM
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2188/5741163392_eba631a3e3_b.jpg
Center
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2332/5740625393_6a392edd8b_b.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3445/5740626003_6eb1128151_b.jpg




holycow....your 35L is so sharp it cut my eyes. I'm waiting for my replacement and hope my 35L would be close to yours.



Dec 11, 2011 at 03:34 PM
outlawyer
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p.3 #16 · Canon 35 L 1.4 sharpness


One more who had to send it in. "Interior element adjustment" IIRC. Came back razor sharp.
That's how it is with Canon. QC irregularities aren't limited to the consumer lenses.
I sold it, but now wonder if it was as sharp as M Vers's even after adjustment. Whoa!
For my needs the 35/2 performs adequately, sometimes brilliantly in fact.



Dec 11, 2011 at 04:22 PM
SKumar25
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p.3 #17 · Canon 35 L 1.4 sharpness


MVers is not showing 100% crops. We discussed it in another thread. I think Flickr or whatever he's using resized the crop.

Main photo of 1.4 crop: 1024 * 683

Crop is x2 scale of main photo, and is 1024 * 683. Hence the entire picture scaled from crop:

(1024 * 2) * (683 * 2) is approx 2.8 MP. 5D is > 12 MP.



Dec 11, 2011 at 04:35 PM
erikburd
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p.3 #18 · Canon 35 L 1.4 sharpness


Interesting reading here - my 35L is razor sharp at f/1.4. By f/2.8 it's sharp from corner to corner. However, I'm using a 450D, not a FF.


Dec 11, 2011 at 04:39 PM
Intotheblue
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p.3 #19 · Canon 35 L 1.4 sharpness


I'm gonna have to take some samples myself tonight to see how my sharpness levels compare.


Dec 11, 2011 at 04:48 PM
Pixel Perfect
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p.3 #20 · Canon 35 L 1.4 sharpness


Lars Johnsson wrote:
Yes I have been reading it. And the result is not that good at f/1,4 he say that the center is excellent but the corners and borders are soft. He also say it has problem with bad vignetting. And the bokeh does not not convince him. It also produces quite some purple to green out-of-focus halos wide open.
The verdict is 3 stars for the Optical Quality in a scale of 1 to 5.
He also give the 35/2 lens 3 stars


Really, soft corners and vignetting at f/1.4. Colour me surprised.

Seriously what else did photocrap expect? Tell me any WA f/1.4 lens that is sharp corner to corner and has no vignetting wide open and I'll bet it cost $20K if it exists. Sigma's 50 f/1.4 has little vignetting wide open, but it's also about the biggest f/1.4 50mm lens around and it was designed to minimise vignetting, but it gets harder to control as you go wider and is part of lens design compromise.



Dec 11, 2011 at 05:10 PM
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