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Archive 2007 · I知 looking for a substantial improve in image quality
  
 
Laurita Karam
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · I知 looking for a substantial improve in image quality


Hi!

I am an amateur photographer that one year ago purchased a Canon Digital Rebel XT with a Canon EF-S 17-85mm f/4-5.6 IS USM Lens. This is my first SLR camera!

I知 not a professional photographer but I知 very demanding with picture quality. I have very perceptive eyes that can detect very subtle differences in image quality.

From a point and shoot camera to the Canon Rebel XT I could noticed tremendous improve in image quality even when shooting with automatic setting. Even though, I知 not totally happy. I want to take perfect pictures with even higher image quality! I want my pictures to be smooth and perfect.

Which would be the best option for an upgrade of my camera body and a general purpose lenses? I would use the camera mostly for portraits and travel pics. Weight it is also important for me, I don稚 want to have to carry a lot bigger and heavier camera around.

I知 looking for a substantial improve in image quality, which will make this upgrade worth it. The bottom line for me is: Is it worth it to invest in a new camera even though I知 not a professional? Would I be able to notice image quality improvement even using the automatic settings? How dramatic can be the changes? Can I step up in the SLR category? Money is not my main concern, picture quality and handiness/convenience are.

What about a Canon Rebel XTi with a EF-S 17-55mm f/2.8 IS lens? Is there another better option of a smaller lens for portraits and landscapes?

Thanks!!!!
Aug 17, 2007 at 05:00 PM
dcains
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · I知 looking for a substantial improve in image quality


Keep the XT and buy either the Tamron 17-50 or Canon 17-55 IS. That 17-85 is the worst lens I've ever had (the other kit lens - 18-55 included). You'll see a huge improvement.

Back to the body, I happen to prefer my XT, which I don't use often, to the XTi - less noise, and it thankfully lacks that BS sensor cleaning system. Perhaps the AF is better on the XTi, but I haven't had the issues with my XT that others seem to sometimes mention.
Aug 17, 2007 at 05:10 PM
dcains
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · I知 looking for a substantial improve in image quality


PS. - learn to use the M, Av and Tv settings, too.


Aug 17, 2007 at 05:12 PM
trenchmonkey
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · I知 looking for a substantial improve in image quality


The XT can produce excellent images. The 17-85 is slow and you've got to stop it down
for decent IQ. If you had a fast prime or L zoom I think you'd see a marked improvement
in IQ. Here's a 100% crop thru plexiglass with an XT and the 70-200 f2.8 IS,
oh yeah...handheld/available light/wide open!







Aug 17, 2007 at 05:17 PM
Rubber Soul
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · I知 looking for a substantial improve in image quality


Laurita Karam wrote:
I’m looking for a substantial improve in image quality, which will make this upgrade worth it. The bottom line for me is: Is it worth it to invest in a new camera even though I’m not a professional?

The image quality of the Rebel XT is superb. It's just as good as the EOS 20D, which is just as good as the 30D, which is just as good as the XTi. In other words, the image quality of the Rebel XT is just as good as any camera of any brand of any model in the market below $2000. The reason the Rebel XT is so cheap has nothing to do with image quality. It has everything to do with its poor build quality, clumsy user-interface, slow operation, and mediocre autofocus ability. If none of those things bother you, then there's little reason to buy another camera.



Laurita Karam wrote:
What about a Canon Rebel XTi with a EF-S 17-55mm f/2.8 IS lens? Is there another better option of a smaller lens for portraits and landscapes?


The EF-S 17-55 f/2.8 IS is easily the best lens for your camera right now. But keep in mind that lens is HUGE, LONG, and HEAVY, which seems to go against your stated desire for smaller lenses. There is nothing subtle about the lens at all. Excluding telephoto lenses, the EF-S 17-55 f2.8 IS is the second biggest lens in Canon's entire collection... right behind the 24-70L.



Laurita Karam wrote:
Would I be able to notice image quality improvement even using the automatic settings? How dramatic can be the changes? Can I step up in the SLR category? Money is not my main concern, picture quality and handiness/convenience are.

Mastering your camera will do more for your image quality than any lens possibly could. Learn proper exposure using M or Av mode. Learn when to use a flash, and when to use a polarizer. Learn the basics of post processing with Photoshop --- USM, Shadows/Highlights, Curves, etc. I can guarantee you that 95% of great photos on the web didn't come straight from the camera.

Your EF-S 17-85 lens is decent. Unless you're making very large prints or viewing photos at full 100% magnification, your lens is not bad compared to most other lenses out there. Instead of replacing it, I'd suggest your buy lenses to complement it. Using the right lens for the right job will definitely help.

Try a prime lens like the EF 50mm f/1.4 (or f/1.8) for portraits. Its large aperture will let your do creative things with portraiture that's simply not possible with the 17-85. And for landscapes, get the EF-S 10-22mm. The wide angle will allow you to increase your field of view by an additional 70% compared with the 17-85. Great for creativity and dramatic effects.


.
Aug 17, 2007 at 05:47 PM
mh2000
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · I知 looking for a substantial improve in image quality


5D + 50/1.8 & 100/2
Aug 17, 2007 at 06:06 PM
DonM2
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · I知 looking for a substantial improve in image quality


Laurita Karam --

I have to go with the theme of the previous posters.

The astute investment in camera glass will yield better and longer-term image results than swapping camera bodies from your starting position. The better lenses will still serve as well -- even better -- as you advance over time to more capable cameras in a system such as Canon.

Really good glass on your Rebel XT, along with your practice and acquired competence in that cams capability will be a far better clue to the moment for a camera upgrade!

I recently invested in an EF 70-200 f/4 IS lens, due in part to some rave reviews it (and its cousin f/2.8) keep getting. I have a couple 1-Series Canon cams. But this lens actually made different animals out of my 20D and 5D cams!

It is not mythology -- glass does make a difference in both film and pixels!

--- DonM2
Aug 17, 2007 at 06:06 PM
Paratima
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · I知 looking for a substantial improve in image quality


Despite Trenchmonkey's bragging about his handheld shots (nice gator, Will), one of the best things you can do for image quality is to invest in a good tripod, if you don't already have one. And a remote shutter release, come to think of it. Minute vibrations can spoil a good composition. In low light, it's essential. Also, taking the time to set up the tripod slows you down and gives you a chance to analyze your shot before you make it.

About the weight, a lot of the best equipment is more substantially built. The 24-70 that someone mentioned above is built for working pros and consequently is rugged, i.e., heavy. Choose carefully and you'll be OK.
Aug 17, 2007 at 06:06 PM
talexander
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · I知 looking for a substantial improve in image quality


I think it's more important to determine WHAT about the images is producing the quality your unhappy with then solving that.

Just saying "buy a better camera" or "buy better glass" isn't always or often the solution. I've found personally my photos have gotten MUCH better with skill then with glass. Glass often isn't the issue unless it's limiting your shutter speed or your photos are of such a high quality that the only thing left to limit them is the glass's effect on them which for I'd guess 95%+ of the camera world isn't the case. You might get BETTER photos with a 17-55 but you may also not.

Tim
Aug 17, 2007 at 06:17 PM
dnadal
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · I知 looking for a substantial improve in image quality


You didn't say what your preferred type of shooting is, but neither did you mention using a tripod which, IMHO, is one of the better ways to achieve higher IQ. You could buy a wider range of glass to suit your favorite kinds of shooting but, with the exception (maybe) of candid people shots, a good tripod and ballhead will improve your work in almost any genre with your current set-up.

Not only will the stability of the tripod improve sharpness and clarity, but the set-up forces you to move deliberately and to plan your framing and compositions, and it also allows smaller aperatures, lower ISOs, and therefore slower shutter speeds. I know that this advice doesn't quite fit with your stated goal of not having to lug gear about, but it works for a lot of people. Learn the limitations of your gear when shooting from a stable platform, then buy the high-end glass to expand your capabilities. Good luck! Dave
Aug 17, 2007 at 06:25 PM
rceres
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · I知 looking for a substantial improve in image quality


If you are new to SLR's the best investment in improving image quality will probably be understanding the photographer (vice equipment) drivers for image quality. Try a good photography cours, a good book, or, dare I say is, placing the camera (I don't even know if your camera will do this) manual, or aperature priority mode and taking a lot of experimental/artistic shots. If you want to explore equipment options start with a fast 50mm or 35 mm prime. This will force you to focus more on perspective and composition. If your heart is really set on a new camera body get a 5D, but my advice would be to explore the other options first. You'l be amazed what a little time investment looking through the viewfinder will do.
Aug 17, 2007 at 06:54 PM
John Power
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · I知 looking for a substantial improve in image quality


Amazing how those chameleons look like alligators when shot with a macro lens.

Trench wanted us t think he was out in the swamps risking life and limb to shoot a gator close up. Ya didn't fool me Trench...
Aug 17, 2007 at 07:50 PM
Gerry Szarek
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · I知 looking for a substantial improve in image quality


First for ultimate lens quality consider primes over zooms, the down fall is they are not convient to use, they also can be very expensive for the good ones. Second a tripod will improve your quality, get one of the electronic releases. Third shoot in the lowest ISO setting you can (this will minimize the noise). Shoot in manual mode and bracket in RAW. Lastly take some classes and read some good photography books, capturing the right moment alot of times will make a better picture than a perfect one.

AFTER you have done all this then consider getting a 5D or a 1ds.

Good luck
Aug 17, 2007 at 08:20 PM
timbop
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · I知 looking for a substantial improve in image quality


Keep the XT and add a 17-55IS or tamron 17-50, AND look at either the 85/1.8 or 50/1.4 for portraits. I love the look that the 50/1.4 gives for portraits; very flattering wide open for women while obliterating backgrounds. I agree that in addition to a better lens with wider max aperture you need to learn to use the other modes, and some time learning photoshop would be a great idea too. Digital photography still requires a little skill in the digital darkroom to coax the best out of an image.
Aug 17, 2007 at 09:02 PM
deadeyedick
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · I知 looking for a substantial improve in image quality


bout the weight, a lot of the best equipment is more substantially built. The 24-70 that someone mentioned above is built for working pros and consequently is rugged, i.e., heavy. Choose carefully and you'll be OK.[/

I was under the impression the 24-70 was heavy because of the extra, and larger glass within which provides the quality [ and weight ] . I'll be damned, you learn something every day.
Aug 17, 2007 at 09:21 PM
surly
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · I知 looking for a substantial improve in image quality


My feeling is you have fine equipment. Learn how to use it.

Try the other modes and learn to use photoshop
Aug 17, 2007 at 09:32 PM
EltonTeng
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · I知 looking for a substantial improve in image quality


Let's see some of your unsatisfactory files and the exposure information for each image. We can recommend a 5D + 35L/85L for that "substantial improvement" you're looking for but let's inspect the problem images first.

Also - do you convert your own images from RAW to JPEG, or do you use in-camera conversion? What color space do you use to maximize image quality? Do you use One-shot AF to track moving subjects? Do you shoot in green mode or Av/Tv priority or M mode? Just some quick questions for you to consider.
Aug 17, 2007 at 10:09 PM
CVickery
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · I知 looking for a substantial improve in image quality


There's a lot of good suggestions here.... and a lot of $$$ ones. I'd start with trying to use what you have differently before spending more money. My experience with the 17-85 hasn't been bad (there seem to be some bad copies though). Try shooting in A mode setting the aperture to ~F8. The IS can handle the slower shutter speeds in many situations. In addition try shooting in RAW and converting. DPP comes with the camera, but other software like BibblePro, Capture One, etc have free evaluation copies and are easier to use IMO. None of this will cost you anything and may give you the results you are looking for. If it doesn't, sure there are better bodies and lenses, but what you have is capable of fine images.
Aug 17, 2007 at 11:19 PM
NinaS
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · I知 looking for a substantial improve in image quality


what exactly is wrong with your image quality? can we see some examples?

I have taken some absolutely amazing images with my original 6.3MP rebel, and my cheap 28-200mm lens that have printed to poster size beautifully ... equal to my 20D & 30D and my L glass

it is all about light, do you meter? do you shoot RAW or JPG? do you shoot M, Av, Tv or Auto?

what do you shoot? your style, your aspirations?

it is hard to help you choose equipment without more answers
Aug 18, 2007 at 12:31 AM
Navyblue
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p.1 #20 · p.1 #20 · I知 looking for a substantial improve in image quality


1. Research about post processing, images churned out by DSLR often need some touch up to look like those breath taking poster shots.

2. Research more about photographic technique (both technical and artistic aspects), knowing what you are doing is the first step to know what you want.

3. Most of us here have gears that are way more competent than ourselves.

4. Start asking what to buy after you know what you need.


Aug 18, 2007 at 03:13 PM
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