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It is worth paying extra to get a camera that you enjoy using more.

  
 
madNbad
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p.2 #1 · p.2 #1 · It is worth paying extra to get a camera that you enjoy using more.




ottokbre wrote:
Wow. I had no idea Cosina Bessa bodies were that failure prone.



Huss had a post on a different forum a few years ago. Either Adorama or B&H were selling off their stock of the ones without a rangefinder for around ninety dollars. He bought one and it broke, sent it back, got an exchange and it broke. I don’t think there’s a third one.



Aug 27, 2024 at 04:48 PM
ottokbre
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p.2 #2 · p.2 #2 · It is worth paying extra to get a camera that you enjoy using more.


madNbad wrote:
Huss had a post on a different forum a few years ago. Either Adorama or B&H were selling off their stock of the ones without a rangefinder for around ninety dollars. He bought one and it broke, sent it back, got an exchange and it broke. I don’t think there’s a third one.


Holy smokes! Why even shoot a mechanical camera if it craps out faster than an electric one? Wild that a 50 year old Nikon FE or Olympus OM2 are still outlasting newer mechanical cameras.

I do love a mechanical camera with really excellent haptics and Leica is just about the smallest one that gets out of your way the most. Lately I have been trying to play with every mechanical camera I see just to revisit what kind of handling and cool zip click snap sounds it makes. There is something to be said about a camera as an experience.




Aug 27, 2024 at 05:40 PM
ISO1600
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p.2 #3 · p.2 #3 · It is worth paying extra to get a camera that you enjoy using more.


in other news, water is wet.

My favorite cameras to use and shoot with-
Leica M2
Canon P
Nikon FE2
Nikon F2
Canon New F1n
Canon 1V
Fuji X-E1
Fuji X-E4

I'm trying real hard, but I cannot for the life of me remember a Canon DSLR or mirrorless that just "got out of the way" and let me enjoy photography haha. I've always considered myself a "Canon guy", but this realization has me questioning some things lol. I'm REALLY enjoying my current Canon RF setup, but it's way overcomplicated at times and doesn't generally simplify the act of taking photos.



Aug 27, 2024 at 05:57 PM
ottokbre
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p.2 #4 · p.2 #4 · It is worth paying extra to get a camera that you enjoy using more.


I think a lot of it is when all the bits and pieces fall together. The Leica M RF VF just gives such a wonderful view between 35mm-75mm and the fact that the entire camera feels like it's military spec rugged while still being smooth with great feedback (except those early shutter dials, lets be real).

It's just nice when things come together because then you want to engage with it without it feeling like a chore. I was really hopeful that the new Rollei 35AF would meet some of those objectives plus AF/1-handed operation (at least when taking the shot) and a nice melding of modern and classic. But it's a maiden voyage for Mint and who knows how it will all gel. I'll probably just want an M3/M4 for my M glass again (I only have a digital body now).

Anyways, some categories since I have been looking at a lot of bodies lately.

Best film advance lever/action:
Best shutter sound:
Best shutter dial:
Best SLR viewfinder layout:
Best blind/by feel control layout:

Worst of -
Ugg, why does it do that:



Aug 27, 2024 at 06:17 PM
Desmolicious
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p.2 #5 · p.2 #5 · It is worth paying extra to get a camera that you enjoy using more.


ottokbre wrote:
Wow. I had no idea Cosina Bessa bodies were that failure prone.


My Bessa L and Zeiss Ikon ZM both failed in the same way - but not the shutters like they did in the video! Even though I do know of someone else who had that same shutter failure on their ZM.

No, mine just had the film transport fail, where it would take more than one lever wind to complete the action. Soft plastic gears on the inside - no matter if it was the $200 Bessa L or the $2000 Zeiss.




Aug 27, 2024 at 06:19 PM
Desmolicious
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p.2 #6 · p.2 #6 · It is worth paying extra to get a camera that you enjoy using more.


ottokbre wrote:
I think a lot of it is when all the bits and pieces fall together. The Leica M RF VF just gives such a wonderful view between 35mm-75mm and the fact that the entire camera feels like it's military spec rugged while still being smooth with great feedback (except those early shutter dials, lets be real).

It's just nice when things come together because then you want to engage with it without it feeling like a chore. I was really hopeful that the new Rollei 35AF would meet some of those objectives plus AF/1-handed operation (at least when taking the
...Show more

What have you looked at and what do you still want to look at?

I really liked my Nikon S2 - 50mm only VF but for 50mm much better than the S3 or SP. And such a smooooth film advance action.



Aug 27, 2024 at 06:22 PM
Desmolicious
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p.2 #7 · p.2 #7 · It is worth paying extra to get a camera that you enjoy using more.


madNbad wrote:
Huss had a post on a different forum a few years ago. Either Adorama or B&H were selling off their stock of the ones without a rangefinder for around ninety dollars. He bought one and it broke, sent it back, got an exchange and it broke. I don’t think there’s a third one.


Yeah, it was an operation called Photo Village IIRC - they used to be a CV dealer. They were clearing them out for $90, I think the original price was $200.



Aug 27, 2024 at 06:25 PM
Desmolicious
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p.2 #8 · p.2 #8 · It is worth paying extra to get a camera that you enjoy using more.


ottokbre wrote:
Holy smokes! Why even shoot a mechanical camera if it craps out faster than an electric one? Wild that a 50 year old Nikon FE or Olympus OM2 are still outlasting newer mechanical cameras.

I do love a mechanical camera with really excellent haptics and Leica is just about the smallest one that gets out of your way the most. Lately I have been trying to play with every mechanical camera I see just to revisit what kind of handling and cool zip click snap sounds it makes. There is something to be said about a camera as an experience.

...Show more

The difference is those Bessas are actually really cheap mechanical cameras made by Cosina, but dressed up as something fancy.
The clue is the guts were used in so many bargain basement SLRs badged as Vivitars, Nikon FM10s, Cosina CT-1 and I'm sure Sears, Petri, Ritz etc.



Aug 27, 2024 at 06:29 PM
Desmolicious
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p.2 #9 · p.2 #9 · It is worth paying extra to get a camera that you enjoy using more.


ottokbre wrote:
…..

Anyways, some categories since I have been looking at a lot of bodies lately.

Best film advance lever/action:
Best shutter sound:
Best shutter dial:
Best SLR viewfinder layout:
Best blind/by feel control layout:

Worst of -
Ugg, why does it do that:


Leica M7 and Leica R5 onwards.



Aug 28, 2024 at 12:29 AM
ottokbre
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p.2 #10 · p.2 #10 · It is worth paying extra to get a camera that you enjoy using more.


Desmolicious wrote:
What have you looked at and what do you still want to look at?

I really liked my Nikon S2 - 50mm only VF but for 50mm much better than the S3 or SP. And such a smooooth film advance action.


I've got my core kit all worked out. Purged all of my LTM stuff which were also the last of my fully mechanical cameras. So basically whatever excites me and feels under appreciated.




Aug 29, 2024 at 11:19 AM
 


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bjhurley
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p.2 #11 · p.2 #11 · It is worth paying extra to get a camera that you enjoy using more.


Oddly enough I could have stopped at the first film camera I bought last year when I got back into film: a Canon P. I subsequently got a great deal on a Leica M2-R but I still prefer the Canon and use it much more than the Leica. The Canon fits better in my hand, and despite being a decade older than the Leica it feels more modern. The fuzzy rangefinder patch took a while to get used to but now I rarely miss focus. I love shooting with it.


Aug 29, 2024 at 12:10 PM
freaklikeme
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p.2 #12 · p.2 #12 · It is worth paying extra to get a camera that you enjoy using more.


I agree with the sentiment. It's a good feeling when you spend a lot of cash on something and find it as satisfying as you expected and worth the expense. I feel that way about my R9, which is dirt cheap these days in red dot terms but still pricey relative to the rest of the manual SLR market. It's money I'd happily spend again.

For the most part, though, I get my thrills dusting off something out of someone's bargain bin and finding a gem.



Aug 29, 2024 at 02:59 PM
philip_pj
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p.2 #13 · p.2 #13 · It is worth paying extra to get a camera that you enjoy using more.


Some see even the best fit cameras as the necessary means of getting to the fruit of the exercise, so they are already focused on the images the body and its lenses produce. Their excitement comes from the files that open up on their monitors. I am raising a voice for them, while not demeaning others with different attitides to their equipment.


Aug 29, 2024 at 04:24 PM
Luke_Miller
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p.2 #14 · p.2 #14 · It is worth paying extra to get a camera that you enjoy using more.


philip_pj wrote:
Some see even the best fit cameras as the necessary means of getting to the fruit of the exercise, so they are already focused on the images the body and its lenses produce. Their excitement comes from the files that open up on their monitors. I am raising a voice for them, while not demeaning others with different attitides to their equipment.


I agree. For those whose enjoyment primarily comes from the results (i.e., images captured), the equipment used is immaterial. For those who primarily enjoy the process of photography the equipment can be very important since the interaction with the equipment generates the pleasure. I'm a member of both camps and have "process" equipment that gives me the most enjoyment in use as well as "results" equipment which is less fun to use (I see them as merely tools), but often provides better results. Unfortunately, my "process" gear tends to be pricey.




Aug 30, 2024 at 08:32 AM
retrofocus
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p.2 #15 · p.2 #15 · It is worth paying extra to get a camera that you enjoy using more.


For me it has certainly paid off to get my fist Leica M camera in 2014 - my M6 non-TTL for $1100 used in EX+ condition with original plastic box. Other M cameras followed, but the M6 is still my favorite one. There are some technical facts why I like it but it is also an emotional attachment I developed to my M6 over the course of 10 years using it.

I have never tried/explored cheaper rangefinder cameras before getting the M6. Much later I got for free a mint FED 3 camera which is only sitting on the shelf. It is hard to go back to a not as well-rounded rangefinder camera after the Leica bug has bitten.

This said, I don't believe current used "vintage" M6 camera prices are justified. I wouldn't buy one for actual pricing now. I am glad I jumped to Leica 10 years ago before the rangefinder hype started.



Aug 30, 2024 at 09:28 AM
flash
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p.2 #16 · p.2 #16 · It is worth paying extra to get a camera that you enjoy using more.


ISO1600 wrote:
in other news, water is wet.



I have patented powdered water.

Just don't know what to add....

Gordon



Sep 02, 2024 at 08:46 PM
Desmolicious
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p.2 #17 · p.2 #17 · It is worth paying extra to get a camera that you enjoy using more.


flash wrote:
I have patented powdered water.

Just don't know what to add....

Gordon


A silica gel packet to keep out moisture so it stays fresh.



Sep 02, 2024 at 09:13 PM
philip_pj
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p.2 #18 · p.2 #18 · It is worth paying extra to get a camera that you enjoy using more.


We want both ideally, Luke. But fate doesn't always play how we want it to. It's funny, I read the title as a question (Is it...), not a statement (It is). Plenty of room for all takes on this subject, but the bottom line never budges: you have to understand that 'digital' is half the description of 'digital photography'.

If you learn to enjoy watching the image reach its best self in post processing, it is very satisfying and it also give you greater feedback on your shot-time work, re what exposures and apertures you can get away with using. And it even decide lens preferences, because only in this refined state are you able to distinguish them properly and establish your favourite lens characteristics. So say I, anyway.



Sep 02, 2024 at 10:58 PM
Ineound
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p.2 #19 · p.2 #19 · It is worth paying extra to get a camera that you enjoy using more.


Got an M4P recently - love the idea and the mechanics, but wearing glasses makes me hardly see the 28mm lines and the 50 does not have as much "room" around the framelines which kind of contradicts the idea of a rangefinder... will shoot some more rolls to figure out if it is worth it, or if I stick with my Pentax lineup.... (way easier to have 3-4 cameras with different films )


Sep 03, 2024 at 05:03 AM
snapsy
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p.2 #20 · p.2 #20 · It is worth paying extra to get a camera that you enjoy using more.


Caltech: Wine Study Shows Price Influences Perception

A rose by any other name might smell as sweet, but slap on a hefty price tag, and our opinion of it might go through the roof. At least that's the case with the taste of wine, say scientists from the California Institute of Technology and Stanford University.

Antonio Rangel, an associate professor of economics at Caltech, and his colleagues found that changes in the stated price of a sampled wine influenced not only how good volunteers thought it tasted, but the activity of a brain region that is involved in our experience of pleasure. In other words, "prices, by themselves, affect activity in an area of the brain that is thought to encode the experienced pleasantness of an experience," Rangel says.

Rangel and his colleagues had 20 volunteers taste five wine samples which, they were told, were identified by their different retail prices: $5, $10, $35, $45, and $90 per bottle. While the subjects tasted and evaluated the wines, their brains were scanned using functional magnetic resonance imaging, or fMRI.

The subjects consistently reported that they liked the taste of the $90 bottle better than the $5 one, and the $45 bottle better than the $35 one. Scans of their brains supported their subjective reports; a region of the brain called the medial orbitofrontal cortex, or mOFC, showed higher activity when the subjects drank the wines they said were more pleasurable.


Source: https://www.caltech.edu/about/news/wine-study-shows-price-influences-perception-1374



Sep 03, 2024 at 06:25 AM
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