R5ii Thedigitalpicture re buffer say he got 161 images at 30fps

Scott Stoness
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p.4 #1 · p.4 #1 · R5ii Thedigitalpicture re buffer say he got 161 images at 30fps

Scott Stoness wrote:
Picked up new r5 Ii today. Put in cfx 150 black. Very fast card.

Shot 30fps 1/100 iso 2000 raw - got 90 frames 3-4 s buffer clear about 55mpx files [craw 27mb got 151 frames but 1/50 light fading]
Shot 15 fps 1/100 iso raw 2000 got 190 frames 3-4 s buffer clear [craw 27mb got 415 frames but 1/50 light fading]

At 30fps fast sd card Kingston 128 canvas react I got about 75 but had to raise iso to 6400 to have similar 1/100 and the files went up to 62mb. Cleared in about 10s.

A quick test...Show more →

Before I start testing let me give you my hypothesis of the outcome

I think the formula is something like:
Expected Frames = [Buffer Max Frames (at iso 2000 Raw) / (fps - 10 frames clear per s) ] x fps (setting)

(60 max raw/ (30fps-10clearing per second) ) x 30fps rate = 90 frames
(60 / (15fps -10) ) x 15fps = 180 frames in 12s
(60 / (20fps -10) x 20fps = 120 frames in 6s
(60 / (12fps-10) x 12ffps = 360 frames in 30s
(60 / (10fps-10 = infinity frames in infiinity s
[which roughly aligns with my previous tests - forcing the numbers]

At craw (Craw are 1/2 the size so twice the buffer assumed]

(120 max craw / (30-10) ) x 30 fps = 180 frames in 6s
(120 / (15- 10) x 15 = 360 frames in 24s
(120 / (20-10) x 20 = 240 frames in 12 s
(120 / (12-10) x 12 = 720 frames in 60s
(120/ (10-10) x 10 = infinity in infinity s

Obviously iso 100 is significantly smaller than iso 2000; and iso 25k is significantly larger. So it would have to be ratioed up or down depending on the iso/busy scene/ exposure.
iso 25k = 70mb [ so the above max would be reduced by 54/74 ] eg 65 frames at 30fps at iso 25k [Craw of 35mb implies 138 craws]
iso 2k = 54mb ------- 90 frames reference
iso 100 = 40 mb [so the above max would be increased by 54/40] eg 121 frames at 30fps raw at iso 100 [CRAW 13.5mb implies 360 frames]

I know that this is very rough but it aligns with my numbers and is logical. 60 size buffer and 10frames per sec clear forces it to work.

Aug 24, 2024 at 10:24 AM

Scott Stoness
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p.4 #2 · p.4 #2 · R5ii Thedigitalpicture re buffer say he got 161 images at 30fps

30fps = 97
20fps = 143
15fps = 215
10 fps = I gave up at 420 and it was still going strong. I got tired and beyond 30s I don't think I will ever shoot.

af/iso / 2000/ Raw / no precapture / complicated scene with 16mm lens/ about 52mpx files/Delkin Black 150 formatted each time

I have had enough testing. And I have put on 5,000 actuations for your pleasure

I expect all of this to roughly double in CRAW but I don't shoot CRAW
And at iso 100 be 40% larger
And at iso 25k be be 40% smaller

So in summary:
frames = 60 (25kiso) to 97 (2000kiso) to 135 (iso100) to 270 (craw/iso 2000) at 30fps
frames = 129 (25k) to 215 (2000k) to 300 (iso 100) to 430 (craw/2000) at 15 fps
20fps is in between
10fps is effectively infinite
All with about 4s buffer clear when pushed to stutter.

Again - it has passed my buffer stress test as indicated above (215 in ~12s is enough for me at 15fps) . And it is roughly consistent with my formulae expressed above. With a good cfx card. [ SD will be much more challenging but why use it for wildlife because of the 10s buffer clear]

I give a big check mark to Canon. Even in 30fps, precapture it provides 75frames plus 15 precapture/2.5s after shutter which should be enough to catch a bird going from perched to flying at 30fps, at iso 2000. [in really bad light (iso 25k) it will be a little tighter - only 54 frames with 15 precapture, but that should be enough. And if you go to craw (who would now) you will be buying 2tb cards (160frames 5s) and culling instead of picture taking

I am going to set my C3-wildlife at 15fps/Raw, precapture. And switch to 30fps/Craw with q as needed. 15fps is a good balance of culling and catching my bears standing up.

Edited on Aug 24, 2024 at 01:39 PM · View previous versions

Aug 24, 2024 at 11:13 AM

Greg Schneider
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p.4 #3 · p.4 #3 · R5ii Thedigitalpicture re buffer say he got 161 images at 30fps

A quick summary of my buffer testing with a 1TB Prograde Gold (CFe 4.0, sustained write of 1500MB/s), in absolutely ideal conditions (1/8000, wide open, ISO100, ES):

At 20fps, the R5II sees a slight increase in overall buffer vs the R5:
CRAW buffer is roughly 300 vs 280, and as Scott noticed, it's possible to continue shooting almost indefinitely at 10fps after that (I stopped at 600 pics) while the R5 will freeze until it can clear a few frames from the buffer.
RAW buffer is approx 175 vs 145 and like both formats on the R5, hitting the limit in RAW on the R5II still results in a hard stop/freeze.

At 30fps the numbers drop slightly, approx 235 and 155 for each, with the same indefinite 10fps shooting for CRAW and the freeze in RAW.

The change for CRAW (which I'd always be using for action) is a huge positive and I don't see the buffer being a real concern for most of my shooting.

Aug 24, 2024 at 11:41 AM

Scott Stoness
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p.4 #4 · p.4 #4 · R5ii Thedigitalpicture re buffer say he got 161 images at 30fps

Greg Schneider wrote:
A quick summary of my buffer testing with a 1TB Prograde Gold (CFe 4.0, sustained write of 1500MB/s), in absolutely ideal conditions (1/8000, wide open, ISO100, ES):

At 20fps, the R5II sees a slight increase in overall buffer vs the R5:
CRAW buffer is roughly 300 vs 280, and as Scott noticed, it's possible to continue shooting almost indefinitely at 10fps after that (I stopped at 600 pics) while the R5 will freeze until it can clear a few frames from the buffer.
RAW buffer is approx 175 vs 145 and like both formats on the R5, hitting the limit in...Show more →

Thanks for the confirmation. Your numbers are consistent with my hypothesis formulae and my tests.

I don't think the CFx 4.0 gets you anymore than CFx2.0 - eg the Delkin Black cfx2.0 is already too fast for the camera at 1400 sustained write.

Are you still going to continue with CRAW as default- for me it only makes sense at 30fps occasionally because of excessive culling. If I was a bird in flight person I would do c1 30fps CRAW precapture, c2 20fps Raw precapture, and c1 15fps raw precapture. I am not much of a birder so I go with c3 - wildlife 15fps precaputre/raw and adjust to H+ 30fps (CRAW) as needed.

Edited on Aug 24, 2024 at 01:34 PM · View previous versions

Aug 24, 2024 at 12:00 PM

Greg Schneider
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p.4 #5 · p.4 #5 · R5ii Thedigitalpicture re buffer say he got 161 images at 30fps

Scott Stoness wrote:
I don't think the CFx 4.0 gets you anymore than CFx2.0 - eg the Delkin Black cfx2.0 is already too fast for the camera at 1400 sustained write.

Are you still going to continue with CRAW as default- for me it only makes sense at 30fps because of excessive culling. If I was a bird in flight person I would do c1 30fps CRAW precapture, c2 20fps Raw precapture, and c1 15fps raw precapture. I am not much of a birder so I go with c3 - wildlife 15fps precaputre/raw and adjust to H+ as needed.

Correct, no cameras have CFe 4.0 support. The newer, faster cards may have a slight edge in sustained use, perhaps running a bit cooler too? While I didn't try my previous 128GB Sony CFe 2.0 (without a guaranteed write speed) in the R5II, I found the buffer in the R5 was identical between both cards, though it's possible the newer Prograde would clear that buffer marginally faster.

I'll likely continue with CRAW for any action or higher ISO use and RAW for landscape, high DR scenes and the like. Other than buffer considerations, I feel that storage is no longer a significant constraint for RAW use with the significant CFe price improvements in the past few years.

Aug 24, 2024 at 01:13 PM

rscheffler
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p.4 #6 · p.4 #6 · R5ii Thedigitalpicture re buffer say he got 161 images at 30fps

Scott and Greg, thanks for the testing/numbers! Regarding CRAW: I would use it (and do with my current cameras) most of the time. I haven't seen any real world differences in my uses to not use it. I also now run practically everything through Adobe Enhance/Denoise as well, which does its own 'magic' with files (though not sure if it actually reconstructs tonal information lost to RAW compression). Previous to CRAW I'd run all my RAW outtakes through DNG Converter with lossy compression to save longterm storage space. The benefit of CRAW here is it saves that extra step and remains compatible with Enhance/Denoise should I ever need to process an outtake, whereas lossy DNG converted files are not Enhance/Denoise compatible (the last time I checked).

Aug 24, 2024 at 01:33 PM

Scott Stoness
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p.4 #7 · p.4 #7 · R5ii Thedigitalpicture re buffer say he got 161 images at 30fps

Greg Schneider wrote:
Correct, no cameras have CFe 4.0 support. The newer, faster cards may have a slight edge in sustained use, perhaps running a bit cooler too? While I didn't try my previous 128GB Sony CFe 2.0 (without a guaranteed write speed) in the R5II, I found the buffer in the R5 was identical between both cards, though it's possible the newer Prograde would clear that buffer marginally faster.

I'll likely continue with CRAW for any action or higher ISO use and RAW for landscape, high DR scenes and the like. Other than buffer considerations, I feel that storage is no longer...Show more →

re I don't know about cooler, but I put in a slower bigger card Anglebird SX (sustained 800) 512gb, and it got similar results to the Delkin Black (sustained 1400) at 15fps (around 200 raw frames but different lighting and iso than previous tests). So not much advantage in spending on cf4.0 unless you plan to keep the card for many years (by the time you get there they may be something bigger and better though eg 20tb, that causes the current cf4.0's to just be backup. So I will go cheap (Anglebird 512 gb SE is $170 cdn last week) because I don't have a camera that could take advantage of the card speed.

Aug 24, 2024 at 05:50 PM

rscheffler
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p.4 #8 · p.4 #8 · R5ii Thedigitalpicture re buffer say he got 161 images at 30fps

Scott, if you're looking for more CFe Type B cards, B&H currently has the Sandisk Extreme Pro 500GB for $150 US. Still not as inexpensive as the Angelbird.

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1551703-REG/sandisk_sdcfe_512g_ancnn_512gb_extreme_pro_cfexpress.html

Sep 02, 2024 at 10:17 AM

Scott Stoness
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p.4 #9 · p.4 #9 · R5ii Thedigitalpicture re buffer say he got 161 images at 30fps

rscheffler wrote:
Scott, if you're looking for more CFe Type B cards, B&H currently has the Sandisk Extreme Pro 500GB for $150 US. Still not as inexpensive as the Angelbird.

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1551703-REG/sandisk_sdcfe_512g_ancnn_512gb_extreme_pro_cfexpress.html

Thanks - it's great that cfeb cards keep getting bigger and more reasonable price.

Sep 02, 2024 at 11:23 AM

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