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Tamron 28-75 G2 for Nikon Z Announced

  
 
bernardl
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p.2 #1 · p.2 #1 · Tamron 28-75 G2 for Nikon Z Announced


No, I am not talking about Keiretsu. I am talking about influence.

And how exactly did Nikon not acknowledge that Tamron manufactures for them the 28-70mm f2.8?

We know they do just like we know that you told us that the 28-400mm is a Tamron design?

Cheers,
Bernard





Edited on Mar 29, 2024 at 06:39 PM · View previous versions



Mar 29, 2024 at 06:33 PM
unchecked
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p.2 #2 · p.2 #2 · Tamron 28-75 G2 for Nikon Z Announced


1bwana1 wrote:
Exactly. Which is a small minority shareholder as I said. I would classify above 33% as a large minority share holder, and of course above 50% as a majority shareholder that drives the boat.


That's not exactly what you said. You said "very minority share position". Yes they don't have a majority share, but of all the shareholders, they have the biggest share.

They don't have powers to unilaterally make decisions like a majority shareholder, but as their position as the largest shareholder and even at that percentage, they can sway decisions or hold some decision making powers.

Like Jim Radcliffe buying 25% share of Manchester United. Not a majority shareholder, but as the largest shareholder of the lot, he came in and got powers to make quite a lot of hiring changes to the team.



Mar 29, 2024 at 06:33 PM
1bwana1
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p.2 #3 · p.2 #3 · Tamron 28-75 G2 for Nikon Z Announced


unchecked wrote:
That's not exactly what you said. You said "very minority share position". Yes they don't have a majority share, but of all the shareholders, they have the biggest share.

They don't have powers to unilaterally make decisions like a majority shareholder, but as their position as the largest shareholder and even at that percentage, they can sway decisions or hold some decision making powers.

Like Jim Radcliffe buying 25% share of Manchester United. Not a majority shareholder, but as the largest shareholder of the lot, he came in and got powers to make quite a lot of hiring changes to
...Show more

Now you are just being silly. What is your point? You object to the term "very" or what? Tamron is a company with a long history. Sony only recently became Tamron's largest shareholder. This was not the result of Sony buying lots more shares. It is the result of Tamrons largest share holder, New Well Co, selling off shares of its much larger 18.78% holding. Yes, as a large share holder Sony likely gets listened to more than an outsider. But to say that Tamron is run by Sony, or for Sony's benefit above other shareholders is just plain ignorant. How does that affect which lenses Tamron contracts to build for or supply parts for, to Nikon. It doesn't.

So I ask, once again, what is your point.




Mar 29, 2024 at 07:32 PM
bernardl
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p.2 #4 · p.2 #4 · Tamron 28-75 G2 for Nikon Z Announced


The point is that the relationship between Sony and Tamron is way deeper than the 14.8% of shares indicates.

The relationship between these companies and how their priorities are decided is not a function of the % of shares owned. It's a function of business relationships made up of interpersonal trust and influences deeply rooted in the Japanese history in the context of the tradition of dealing with what matters behind closed doors, often in close alignement with the government btw.

It is not completely unrelated to Keiretsu, but not the official Keiretsu that have been kept for appearances and because it was just too complicated to completely get rid of them. Virtual Keiretsu that operate without much noise but shape the industry nonetheless.

Does Sony own Tamron and drive all their decisions? No but their influence is nonetheless tremendous. Does it prevent Tamron from working with Nikon? Most definitely not.

Ownership isn't more required than censorship. We live in free societies where most people don't dare to say anything that isn't 100% aligned with what the majority thinks in the community they belong to. Nowhere is this more obvious than in the US. Well similar mechanisms exist in the Japanese corporate world. And they are very real even if they are not visible in corporate reports and shareholders structures.



Mar 29, 2024 at 08:21 PM
Kruth22
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p.2 #5 · p.2 #5 · Tamron 28-75 G2 for Nikon Z Announced


Anyway, back to the lens.

I have a 24-120, at the price, I wonder if this would be a good pickup and how it compares at f4. Hopefully all the YouTube crowd will be on it soon. Not much there yet.



Mar 29, 2024 at 08:30 PM
1bwana1
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p.2 #6 · p.2 #6 · Tamron 28-75 G2 for Nikon Z Announced


bernardl wrote:
The point is that the relationship between Sony and Tamron is way deeper than the 14.8% of shares indicates.

The relationship between these companies and how their priorities are decided is not a function of the % of shares owned. It's a function of business relationships made up of interpersonal trust and influences deeply rooted in the Japanese history in the context of the tradition of dealing with what matters behind closed doors, often in close alignement with the government btw.

It is not completely unrelated to Keiretsu, but not the official Keiretsu that have been kept for appearances and because it
...Show more


So lets look at the impact on Tamron's products as in indicator of how much benefit is being bestowed. Tamron is licensed to make E-Mount lenses by Sony. That license contains the very same restrictions on Tamron as any other 3rd party lens. As exemplified by the same 15 fps and no TC, just like it is with all the other third party lens manufactures. We know that Tamron knows how to build lenses for the E-Mount because they do just that for the OEM Sony lenses. No special apparent special treatment from Sony there. Tamron focused on building E-Mount lenses not because of Sony restricting them. The E-Mount has been the fastest growing mirrorless mount for some time now. Nikon wouldn't license them to build the Z mount, and Canon wouldn't license them for their mounts. Now that Nikon has lifted that restriction Tamron is aggressively pursuing lenses for the Z mount.

So I will ask you where this ownership stake shows up in Tamron products either by inclusion or exclusion?

Like I said, you guys keep trying to make something out of nothing. The most humorous part of this is that what you are saying about how Sony operates here flies in the face of your arguments regarding the sensor business and firewalls. Finally, you resort to secret deals that get done behind close doors. These are publicly traded companies.

Just silly stuff that breaks down with even the most cursory examination.

By the way, I live in the US and feel free to say anything I want to, to whomever I want to, as do most people I know. I recognize that while the Netherlands has a free speech clause in its constitution it has draconian laws against "hate speech". The definition of hate speech seems to be a moving target at times. Maybe this is the source of your views on the topic.

Finally, your last post doesn't align very well with your first post on the subject. Which I will quote here:

"Tamron is basically a Sony group company and they are known for being responsible for the design and manufacturing of many lenses sold by Sony under the Sony brand."

That certainly is a bigger back peddle than my use of the word "very".





Mar 29, 2024 at 08:47 PM
SCoombs
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p.2 #7 · p.2 #7 · Tamron 28-75 G2 for Nikon Z Announced


I'm at a loss to understand why the ownership and influences of Tamron have any significance to a discussion of this lens. Who cares if Sony has something to do with it?


Mar 29, 2024 at 08:55 PM
bernardl
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p.2 #8 · p.2 #8 · Tamron 28-75 G2 for Nikon Z Announced


SCoombs wrote:
I'm at a loss to understand why the ownership and influences of Tamron have any significance to a discussion of this lens. Who cares if Sony has something to do with it?


Yes, I apologize.

Cheers,
Bernard




Mar 29, 2024 at 09:26 PM
1bwana1
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p.2 #9 · p.2 #9 · Tamron 28-75 G2 for Nikon Z Announced


The thing I think we all agree on that is that this G2 version of the Tamron 28-75 f/2.8 is a super valuable addition to the Z lens ecosystem. It is small, light, value priced, has unique features, and excellent optical performance. All backed up with the best service and warranty in the industry.

I have the E-Mount version and it has never disappointed me. It is a significant improvement over the G1 version.



Mar 30, 2024 at 11:49 AM
Joseph Marney
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p.2 #10 · p.2 #10 · Tamron 28-75 G2 for Nikon Z Announced


I'm happy to see this addition to the line-up and hope the 70-180mm G2 isn't far behind. Both lenses are better balanced with a Z5/6/7 series body than the Nikon S glass, and hopefully we'll be seeing the next iteration of those bodies in the near-term.


Mar 30, 2024 at 11:57 AM
 


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novalaker
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p.2 #11 · p.2 #11 · Tamron 28-75 G2 for Nikon Z Announced


1bwana1 wrote:
Why so defensive?

Tamron is the largest lens manufacturer in the World. They make OEM labeled lenses for many of the major camera brands, Sony and Nikon included. Most have no coresponding version in the Tamron labeled line. The situation with the 28-75 f/2.8 and the 28-200 f_2.8 being known older versions of an existing Tamron lens is a very rare exception to the norm. It looks like that experiment is destined to end soon as Tamron is now selling the new version in Z mount under its own name at a good price. Probably a good thing to end
...Show more

The irony is you seem to be the one being defensive here, as your argument is quite literally the same argument he is making in his post. I read his post as "this isn't a Tamron lens, but even if it were, it would be fine because they have a history of making strong lenses for other brands." How is that in any way defensive?



Apr 01, 2024 at 03:55 AM
novalaker
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p.2 #12 · p.2 #12 · Tamron 28-75 G2 for Nikon Z Announced


Joseph Marney wrote:
I'm happy to see this addition to the line-up and hope the 70-180mm G2 isn't far behind. Both lenses are better balanced with a Z5/6/7 series body than the Nikon S glass, and hopefully we'll be seeing the next iteration of those bodies in the near-term.


Agreed, the 28-75 doesn't interest me personally, but the 70-180 G2 seemed like a significant improvement with the addition of VR and improved optics. I would seriously consider that for my sports needs. This is great news and seems like Nikon is loosening up on allowing "competing" lenses.



Apr 01, 2024 at 03:57 AM
billsnature
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p.2 #13 · p.2 #13 · Tamron 28-75 G2 for Nikon Z Announced


Kruth22 wrote:
Anyway, back to the lens.

I have a 24-120, at the price, I wonder if this would be a good pickup and how it compares at f4. Hopefully all the YouTube crowd will be on it soon. Not much there yet.


I have the Sony version of the Gen 2 and the Z 24-120. At f5.6-6.3 there is very little to choose between. The Tamron is a bit better from 28-35 and the Nikon 24-120 is better above 50 mm and significantly better at 75mm. I have not compared them at f4 or for bokeh differences between 2.8 and f4 in the shared range. I too am hoping that the You Tube crowd handles that as it isn't my gig.



Apr 01, 2024 at 11:24 AM
1bwana1
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p.2 #14 · p.2 #14 · Tamron 28-75 G2 for Nikon Z Announced


novalaker wrote:
The irony is you seem to be the one being defensive here, as your argument is quite literally the same argument he is making in his post. I read his post as "this isn't a Tamron lens, but even if it were, it would be fine because they have a history of making strong lenses for other brands." How is that in any way defensive?


The defensive part is that he brought it up. I didn't. I agree that it makes no practical difference so why even bring it up?



Apr 01, 2024 at 01:05 PM
tntcorp1
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p.2 #15 · p.2 #15 · Tamron 28-75 G2 for Nikon Z Announced


novalaker wrote:
The irony is you seem to be the one being defensive here, as your argument is quite literally the same argument he is making in his post. I read his post as "this isn't a Tamron lens, but even if it were, it would be fine because they have a history of making strong lenses for other brands." How is that in any way defensive?


+1. to be fair, @1bwana1 brought up "e-mount" in his comment and not "sony". he must be referring to the company that started with the "a-mount" but definitely NOT sony. ))

tamron or not tamron doesn't matter as long as there is continuing support for fw upgrade to ensure a working af down the road.



Apr 01, 2024 at 03:15 PM
1bwana1
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p.2 #16 · p.2 #16 · Tamron 28-75 G2 for Nikon Z Announced




tntcorp1 wrote:
+1. to be fair, @1bwana1@ brought up "e-mount" in his comment and not "sony". he must be referring to the company that started with the "a-mount" but definitely NOT sony. ))

tamron or not tamron doesn't matter as long as there is continuing support for fw upgrade to ensure a working af down the road.


The only reason I brought up the e mount is that I actually have this lens and find it very good for the reasons I posted. I am happy that my Z shooting friends now have the opportunity also enjoy the lens. It wasn't a brand thing at all.




Apr 01, 2024 at 04:12 PM
deadwolfbones
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p.2 #17 · p.2 #17 · Tamron 28-75 G2 for Nikon Z Announced


Got a copy to test today. Gotta say, super sharp and contrasty. Bokeh is okay to very good depending on FL and background distance. AF is decent but not outstanding (on a Z 6II).

Sample dump here for anyone who wants to look (I make no claims for my skill as a photographer): https://deadwolfbones.smugmug.com/Landscapes/Dogwalk-4-2-24



Apr 02, 2024 at 04:17 PM
RoamingScott
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p.2 #18 · p.2 #18 · Tamron 28-75 G2 for Nikon Z Announced


No no no, you're not supposed to buy and use lenses, you're supposed to endlessly participate in internet forum dumbassery about brands, stakeholders, and pretend that you're a japanese business expert.

(They look good and on par with what I'd expected from that lens based on the G2 results on other mounts)



Apr 02, 2024 at 04:47 PM
bernardl
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p.2 #19 · p.2 #19 · Tamron 28-75 G2 for Nikon Z Announced




deadwolfbones wrote:
Got a copy to test today. Gotta say, super sharp and contrasty. Bokeh is okay to very good depending on FL and background distance. AF is decent but not outstanding (on a Z 6II).

Sample dump here for anyone who wants to look (I make no claims for my skill as a photographer): https://deadwolfbones.smugmug.com/Landscapes/Dogwalk-4-2-24


Thank you, itís looking good indeed.

Cheers,
Bernard



Apr 02, 2024 at 04:57 PM
richyirich
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p.2 #20 · p.2 #20 · Tamron 28-75 G2 for Nikon Z Announced


A review of the lens, and comparing it to Nikon Z 24-120mm f/4 S. It seems like a great alternative to Nikon Z 24-70mm f/2.8 S. I may purchase one when it comes up in a used market down the road.




Apr 07, 2024 at 09:44 AM
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