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Archive 2023 · Any interest in a really basic Leica M?

ottokbre
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p.4 #1 · p.4 #1 · Any interest in a really basic Leica M?

Thury wrote:
It may seem a bit strange but the main reason I bought a Leica M4-P some 30 years ago when I had a Nikon FM2 perfectly functional camera and set of lenses was because of the viewfinder. Not the rangefinder but the position of the viewfinder eyepiece at the extreme left of the body (seen from the back). This because I have a long nose and central viewfinders are a pain in the neck for me forcing a non natural position of my head and eye. It still is the main reason I keep my Leica 240 when my Z6...Show more →

OMG yes. The smaller the SLR body the worse it is too. My massive Nikon D610 does not bother me but the Fuji XT was awful and the Nikon FM had the added terror of needing to bring the film advance back to turn the meter on and unlock the shutter button. All of this is probably worse because I have a massive planet head (7 3/4 hat size) and am left eye dominant.

The Z6 is pretty great though because they stuck out the EVF so much further. Pain to carry on a strap next to your body though. Eventually I’ll get one (again) to replace my DSLR when the $$ is right.

Oct 03, 2023 at 09:02 AM

cookedart
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p.4 #2 · p.4 #2 · Any interest in a really basic Leica M?

Yes, I want my $9000 USD camera to have as much versatility as possible as system. Removing too many features makes it too simple to a fault.

For instance, being an eyeglass wearer, I cannot see the 28mm framelines. Stripping out the LCD and meter makes shooting with wide angle lenses even more cumbersome. Effectively this camera would be a 35mm/50mm specialist camera, which again seems too simple or limited to me.

Keep in mind the M-D was the purest expression of this so far, and was a limited release, more expensive model. Would you be willing to pay more for Leica to remove these features?

Personally, the MP always made more sense to me as the best film camera. The meterless M-A has never had any appeal to me whatsoever (it's only value is providing a "new" version of the m4).

Desmolicious wrote:
It only becomes meaningfully stunted if you wanted those features.

Oct 03, 2023 at 11:28 AM

tommmi
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p.4 #3 · p.4 #3 · Any interest in a really basic Leica M?

Many of you argue that it doesn't make any sense to emit light meter. Does it have to make sense?

I do knowledge that with the sensor revealed you kinda get the metering of light for free there, but does it have to be like that? What if Leica designs a completely new sensor type that - for reason or another - does not actively meter the light, would you still find it silly if the camera would be completely meterless, not even a separate light meter?

Leica did earlier a screenless camera. Fuji made an X-Pro3 with a hidden screen. Nikon did a mirrorless camera which has a pentaprism housing (Nikon Zf). None of these make any sense, nor doesn't need to.. But still, I would buy all of them.

Just trying to think outside of the box. Life doesn't have to be that serious

Oct 03, 2023 at 11:33 AM

airfrogusmc
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p.4 #4 · p.4 #4 · Any interest in a really basic Leica M?

I've never thought of cameras in terms of cars; the more features the better kind of thing. The best cameras I have ever worked with are Canon F-1s., Nikon Fs, Hasselblad 500 C/Ms, 8X10 Deardorffs and M 10 Mono. Not a lot of features on any of those. In fact the M 10 Mono has to many for my liking.

And to carlo's post; I don't think anyone was suggesting that Leica was to do any of this. Only if we were personally interested in a basic digital M.

Leica seems to be one of the few camera manufactures doing well in these changing times. They must be doing something right. And I remember when the original Monochrom was released how many were saying it would not sell. Who would buy such a camera blah blah blah.

Trying to make the M like every other camera out there that already exists, in my opinion, would be the kiss of death for Leica M.

Oct 03, 2023 at 11:42 AM

retrofocus
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p.4 #5 · p.4 #5 · Any interest in a really basic Leica M?

airfrogusmc wrote:
Leica seems to be one of the few camera manufactures doing well in these changing times. They must be doing something right. And I remember when the original Monochrom was released how many were saying it would not sell. Who would buy such a camera blah blah blah.

Leica is doing well due to its change in strategy a few years ago - focus on a luxury brand name. No other camera company does it alike. This makes Leica unique - and admittedly it works for Leica so far. Maybe not the best for users of Leica gear but good for the brand. Leica must make a fortune from collectors of special editions etc. Lower amounts of newly released gear keeps prices up, too. This said, Leica has currently more and less successful camera lines. I believe one misconception was to fully focus on the L-mount in recent past. This strategy did not pay off as well as originally anticipated. Instead the M-series remains the most successful camera series to date followed by the newer fixed lens Q-series.

I think your assessment of making unique cameras is correct. Leica tried a few times to follow the camera mainstream - first with the R-series when SLRs became the standard and more in demand. Good series to this day, but couldn't in the end compete with larger brands. Then Leica tried with the S-series with digital medium format - again good cameras but too expensive and had a hard time to compete against Fuji and Hasselblad here. The SL series was an attempt to bring AF back to Leica and competing with the mirrorless/video market - with limited success to this day. Where on the other hand Leica stands out is with special cameras like monochrome, film, and limited features based rangefinder cameras.

Edited on Oct 03, 2023 at 12:17 PM · View previous versions

Oct 03, 2023 at 11:57 AM

airfrogusmc
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p.4 #6 · p.4 #6 · Any interest in a really basic Leica M?

retrofocus wrote:
Leica is doing well due to its change in strategy a few years ago - focus on a luxury brand name. No other camera company does it alike. This makes Leica unique - and admittedly it works for Leica so far. Maybe not the best for users of Leica gear but good for the brand. Leica must make a fortune from collectors of special editions etc. Lower amounts of newly released gear keeps prices up, too. This said, Leica has currently more and less successful camera lines. I believe one misconception was to fully focus on the L-mount in recent...Show more →

Kinda proving my point. With M and especially M Mono they are the only digital B&W sensor rangefinder game in town. You want one you have to open the wallet. Leica Ms have always been expensive. I remember when I bought my Canon new F-1s in the early 80s Leica M was a lot more expensive. I have never shot with a finer digital camera than the M 10 mono. And I have owned and shot with a few over the years. I don't see folks paying a lot more for something that they can get in a much cheaper package that is an already established brand. And I think the models that you mentioned kinda shows that. M is the flagship and they shouldn't turn their back on the one that gets them to the dance.

It really doesn't make a lot of difference to me either way. I have probably bought my last Leica Ms. When I finally fully retire I will probably sell my 2 M 10s and some glass. But I will keep the M 10 Mono and the 35 Lux FLE and the 24 2.8 Elmarit.

Edited on Oct 03, 2023 at 02:46 PM · View previous versions

Oct 03, 2023 at 12:15 PM

Desmolicious
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p.4 #7 · p.4 #7 · Any interest in a really basic Leica M?

algrove wrote:
yes

So swweeeeet! RUF I think is the only mfg who gets bodies in white from Porsche and so can add their own VIN # to the car. As in they are a legit manufacturer and so you will be buying, for example, a 2023 RUF.
Singer on the other hand, 'restores' old 911s and so if they used a body from 1977, your $2mill Singer would have on the title 1977 Porsche..

Oct 03, 2023 at 02:38 PM

Desmolicious
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p.4 #8 · p.4 #8 · Any interest in a really basic Leica M?

airfrogusmc wrote:
Kinda proving my point. With M and especially M Mono they are the only digital B&W sensor rangefinder game in town. You want one you have to open the wallet. Leica Ms have always been expensive. I remember when I bought my Canon new F-1s in the early 80s Leica M was a lot more expensive. I have never shot with a finer digital camera than the M 10 mono. And I have owned and shot with a few over the years. I don't see folks paying a lot more for something that they can get in a much cheaper...Show more →

and your gonna get an M3 and joint the rest of us...

Oct 03, 2023 at 02:57 PM

algrove
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p.4 #9 · p.4 #9 · Any interest in a really basic Leica M?

Desmolicious wrote:
So swweeeeet! RUF I think is the only mfg who gets bodies in white from Porsche and so can add their own VIN # to the car. As in they are a legit manufacturer and so you will be buying, for example, a 2023 RUF.
Singer on the other hand, 'restores' old 911s and so if they used a body from 1977, your $2mill Singer would have on the title 1977 Porsche..

Yes they used to get them in white, but now for high end models they design their own monocoque in carbon fiber components.

Oct 03, 2023 at 02:59 PM

airfrogusmc
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p.4 #10 · p.4 #10 · Any interest in a really basic Leica M?

Desmolicious wrote:
and your gonna get an M3 and joint the rest of us...

I shot some withem years ago and if I had a darkroom I would definitely pick one up. Probably a Rolleiflex to.

Oct 03, 2023 at 03:49 PM

ottokbre
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p.4 #11 · p.4 #11 · Any interest in a really basic Leica M?

formula4speed wrote:
Maybe that's just shooting a M240 in 2023. I mean, it's technically shooting a Leica, but I don't think anyone is impressed, which is how I feel when someone drives a Boxster. Then again, I haven't even owned a car in almost 8 years, so I might not be the right person to ask.

When someone drives a Boxster, ok, but what about when YOU drive a Boxster? That thing, the original flat-6 S versions at least, felt like a classic sports car not an over teched super car that the contemporary 911 was. Drove the turbo and it suuuuuucked.

But also I loved my M240 so maybe that says more about me.

Oct 03, 2023 at 06:58 PM

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