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AI; Generative Fill: Free or Not Free

  
 
raminolta
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · AI; Generative Fill: Free or Not Free


I assumed generative fill like all new features of Photoshop are offered for free. It turns out,that's not quite the case. This video explains it in details:



As it is now, old subscribers to the photography plan have 250 free credits per month but new subscribers (November 2023 or later) only get 100 free credits. I don't know if the old subscribers will always have the 250 free credits or that will also be reduced to 100 in the future. I also don't know if the removal tool is now considered part of the 'generative fill' (hence its use is counted with credits) or not.

I have used generative fill a few times so far on two of my photos and I find it a useful tool unless the photographer insists on being faithful to the actual original image.

Let us know what you think.

Edited on Sep 24, 2023 at 09:37 PM · View previous versions



Sep 23, 2023 at 01:07 PM
dmcphoto
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · AI; Generative Fill: Free or Not Free


Apparently these features transmit the area you want filled to Adobe's servers over the Internet. Those servers do the heavy lifting and then return the results to you over the Internet. Perhaps Adobe has determined that the new features require much more computing power than their minimum computer requirement, though there could be other reasons. Regardless, this goes beyond adding functionality to the software running on your computer. It requires Adobe servers, a LOT of Internet traffic, and continuing expense for Adobe to keep the features working.

Given all of that I think the restrictions imposed by their credit system, as stated toward the end of the video, are quite generous. I do see potential issues with the way these new features operate. The video states that the creative fill area has a maximum dimension of 2000 x 2000 pixels. For larger selections the fill content is restricted to 2000x2000 and then "stretched" to fit the actual area in your image, which has serious IQ ramifications. Those dimensions may be adequate for most creative fill requirements, but I wonder about the creative extend feature.

What happens if I want to extend one or more sides of a 60MP image by a small amount? Do they transmit very a low res version of my image to their servers? Transmitting a 60 MP (roughly 130 MB) would be insane and take a long time with most broadband connections. Without the high resolution original they can't generate a high resolution fill, so the results they send back to me can't be at the same resolution as my original. The "creative extend" feature is the only one I might infrequently find useful. If it works as I've described I'll make do without it. OTOH perhaps they don't need the entire image to generate extended edges? Doing a few test cases and fiddling around with it will soon tell how useful it is, or isn't.

I do not think that the current removal tool works as I described above, but there's no reason they couldn't improve it with the computing power of their servers. If they do I'd think it would become part of the "credit system", and the 2000x2000 pixel restriction wouldn't be an issue, at least in my use cases.

If one takes a pessimistic view, it's possible that Adobe could eventually change features that operate solely on your computer to use Adobe servers via the Internet for the purpose of "improvement" and capital generation. Time will tell.

There's a load of conjecture in what I've written here and lots of different possibilities for how things might progress in the future. We can only look at what Adobe actually provides and based on that determine its usefulness for what we do.



Sep 23, 2023 at 04:57 PM
runamuck
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · AI; Generative Fill: Free or Not Free


So glad my graphics card does not run adobe


Sep 23, 2023 at 07:34 PM
raminolta
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · AI; Generative Fill: Free or Not Free


Perhaps a down-sampled version of up to 2000x2000 is sent to Adobe over the Internet hence, also the reason the fill content is limited to this resolution.Clearly sending large file back and forth is impractical considering there are millions of users across the globe using Adobe products at any time.

dmcphoto wrote:
Given all of that I think the restrictions imposed by their credit system, as stated toward the end of the video, are quite generous. I do see potential issues with the way these new features operate. The video states that the creative fill area has a maximum dimension of 2000 x 2000 pixels. For larger selections the fill content is restricted to 2000x2000 and then "stretched" to fit the actual area in your image, which has serious IQ ramifications. Those dimensions may be adequate for most creative fill requirements, but I wonder about the creative extend feature.

What happens if
...Show more




Sep 23, 2023 at 08:34 PM
 


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ytwong
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · AI; Generative Fill: Free or Not Free


I have setup Stable Diffusion (for fun) and Llama2 LLM on my PC with a RTX 4090 GPU, and also on my M1 Mac Studio. Those "generative AI" require really good hardware to run and is way above average consumer hardware (even more difficult when people use laptop). I suppose they need to use the "cloud" server to handle that otherwise only a very small percentage of their existing customers can use those features. Those powerful hardware and computing power are finite resources also consume electricity (my desktop has a 1000W power supply) so I can see they need to set a limit.

Given I have fairly good hardware I wish they have the option to run the AI locally.

2000x2000 is quite sufficient for lots of quick commercial tasks (like fix a picture to post on web, social media, or as element of part of a bigger poster), and don't forgot PS is not just for photography now but people also use it for say making texture for 3D model etc. For photography, 2000x2000 probably ok for small fix but it's certainly not for people take right part of a building and let AI generate the left side of it.





Sep 24, 2023 at 06:53 AM
Zenon Char
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · AI; Generative Fill: Free or Not Free


Well I'm not going to worry about credits because as a hobby shooter I have no use for it. If I was not there to capture a great sky in my photo it's not being replaced. But that is just me. Masking is more than plenty for me. I can see the benefit for anyone earning or commercial applications.


Sep 24, 2023 at 09:29 AM
Zenon Char
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · AI; Generative Fill: Free or Not Free


Zenon Char wrote:
Well I'm not going to worry about credits because as a hobby shooter I have no use for it. If I was not there to capture a great sky in my photo it's not being replaced. But that is just me. Masking is more than plenty for me. I can see the benefit for anyone earning or commercial applications.


I should have stated that if hobbyists want to use it I'm all behind that too. Whatever floats your boat. It's just not for me right now.

I am glad my price did not go up. It may one day.



Sep 24, 2023 at 11:44 AM
pr4photos
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · AI; Generative Fill: Free or Not Free


Wait, what. I didn't know this isn't free. I assumed all the AI features were included in the subscription - without limits. Not that I have gone anywhere near 100 AI images in a month, but I would expect to be able to do as many as I wanted!


Sep 25, 2023 at 03:06 AM







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