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Should I get the A7C R ?

Garmadon
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · Should I get the A7C R ?

Funny question...
Ive been using the a7c for some time and really like it ,family and travel photography. My lenses can handle the bigger sensor ,and money is not an issue.
I do want 10bit video , and the lut preview , and more pixels are usually welcome.(but the Cii has them as well).
I like the idea of making each lens preform as another ,as Im using primes only. But do I really need 61mp ? And what do I lose in return? (except money).
Do I need to work in faster shutter speeds with the 61mp sensor?
Do I lose dynamic range or low light cqpabilities vs the 33mp sensor?
Is it an overkill? I almost never print but do pixelpeep.
Another thing , I do notice that some of the photos on flickr or on sonyalphablog just look amazing,usually landscapes that look very detailed and 3d like, even when shawn on dpreview and totally downsampled .When I check -those photos are usually taken with high megapixel cameras , is it just in my head?
Thanks

Sep 03, 2023 at 06:46 AM

fotografur
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · Should I get the A7C R ?

Garmadon wrote:
Should I get the A7C R ?
and money is not an issue.

Yes

Sep 03, 2023 at 07:06 AM

GHarris
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · Should I get the A7C R ?

Garmadon wrote:
Funny question...
Ive been using the a7c for some time and really like it ,family and travel photography. My lenses can handle the bigger sensor ,and money is not an issue.
I do want 10bit video , and the lut preview , and more pixels are usually welcome.(but the Cii has them as well).
I like the idea of making each lens preform as another ,as Im using primes only. But do I really need 61mp ? And what do I lose in return? (except money).
Do I need to work in faster shutter speeds with the 61mp sensor?
Do I lose dynamic range or...Show more →

Supposing you take a photo with a bit of hand shake, or too low a shutter speed, with the new high-res camera. And it comes out slightly blurry.

You're no worse off than if you had taken the same photo with your lower-resolution camera, and the resolution had been limited just by the sensor, rather than the blur.

But a lot of the time, you won't blur your photos, and the added resolution will be of a benefit.

Dynamic range on an R model is definitely the same or better than a lower-resolution camera.

As for low-light performance. I'm always a little fuzzy on this. I think it's similar to the "what if motion blur?" issue - when you downscale to equal image sizes, the high-resolution camera is no worse. I think. But I'm not certain. Question marks: Is there, nevertheless, a slight negative difference in that 61 megapixel sensor's output, even when downsized to the same res as your current 24mp A7C? I'm not sure. And is the speed and reliability of the autofocus, in low light, worse on the R model than on the A7C or A7Cii with their lower-res sensors? I can't say. But I think you're alright in pure image-quality terms.

The only other headache is the filesize and processing-time overhead of the larger image files. You might want to buy a larger SD card for the camera, to hold the same number of images as you're accustomed to on your old camera. Or you might need more computer storage space than before, for processing the RAWs (but I think speed will be fine. Every modern computer is basically fine).

Since money is no issue, you might as well get the R model.

Sep 03, 2023 at 07:51 AM

GMPhotography
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · Should I get the A7C R ?

Yes

Sep 03, 2023 at 07:51 AM

swldstn
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · Should I get the A7C R ?

I’ve given it a lot of thought and I’m considering buying the A7C II. Current own both an A7RV and
A7 IV and my images from the 33 Mpixel sensor has really never disappointed even when compared with the 61 Mpixel big brother. We will see though since I preordered both the A7CR and A7C II and have about a month to think about it. The smaller image means the single memory card doubles in capacity which is nice.

Also if I get an A7C II I will sell my A7 IV since it brings more to the party. Not true if I get the A7CR. The A7R V with great viewfinder, 2 CFexpress A card slots and all axis rear LCD are not getting replaced.

Sep 03, 2023 at 09:27 AM

Garmadon
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · Should I get the A7C R ?

swldstn wrote:
I’ve given it a lot of thought and I’m considering buying the A7C II. Current own both an A7RV and
A7 IV and my images from the 33 Mpixel sensor has really never disappointed even when compared with the 61 Mpixel big brother. We will see though since I preordered both the A7CR and A7C II and have about a month to think about it. The smaller image means the single memory card doubles in capacity which is nice.

Also if I get an A7C II I will sell my A7 IV since it brings more to the party. Not true...Show more →
Thanks.
For me , one camera to do it all...

Can the a7cii do some of the things better then the a7cr? Same question with a7iv vs a7v.

Sep 03, 2023 at 09:41 AM

swldstn
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · Should I get the A7C R ?

Garmadon wrote:
Thanks.
For me , one camera to do it all...

Can the a7cii do some of the things better then the a7cr? Same question with a7iv vs a7v.

For video feature/capability you should find a good YouTube video like Gerald Undone. I’m only really considering stills.
For stills it’s inconclusive if the output noise on the A7C II is lower but there is a plot showing this is the case but other than that and the slower 8 vs. 10 fps I’m not sure yet.

Sep 03, 2023 at 09:58 AM

chiron
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · Should I get the A7C R ?

Sep 03, 2023 at 10:14 AM

1bwana1
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · Should I get the A7C R ?

You likely already know the answer for your own needs. But if you need confirmation, try this. It is as accurate as any answer other people are able to give.

https://magic-8ball.com/

Enjoy!

When I typed in the question "should Armadon buy a Sony A7CR?" the eight ball said "YES".

So there you have it...

Sep 03, 2023 at 10:25 AM

Garmadon
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · Should I get the A7C R ?

chiron wrote:
It appears at this point that the A7CII is slightly shifted toward being good for both stills and video while the A7Cr is shifted more toward still photography. If both are important to you, I would worry less about things like DR and low-light noise and more about the feature sets that may be different.
What feature makes the cii better for video ? I think they have the same video specs

Sep 03, 2023 at 10:28 AM

Jonas B
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · Should I get the A7C R ?

Garmadon wrote:
What feature makes the cii better for video ? I think they have the same video specs

It is about the sensor read-out speed mainly. The differnce isn't that big. None of these cameras is a really good video camera.
You can visit Petapixel and see their video about the two cameras. Somewhere in the second half of the video they discuss pros and cons between the cameras including the video capabilities.

Sep 03, 2023 at 10:37 AM

Tarekith
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · Should I get the A7C R ?

I think the CII can do 8k and the CR does not.

Sep 03, 2023 at 10:39 AM

Jonas B
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · Should I get the A7C R ?

Tarekith wrote:
I think the CII can do 8k and the CR does not.

No, that is not correct.

Sep 03, 2023 at 10:48 AM

jaygould
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · Should I get the A7C R ?

Tarekith wrote:
I think the CII can do 8k and the CR does not.

No, but the CII can do 4k30p without a crop. The A7CR can only do it in (1.5x) crop mode.

Both can do 4k24p without a crop though, but the A7CRs footage will be pixel binned (lower quality) where as A7Ciis footage will be downsampled from 7k (higher quality).

Sep 03, 2023 at 12:09 PM

Garmadon
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · Should I get the A7C R ?

Sep 03, 2023 at 12:28 PM

KarmaKramer
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · Should I get the A7C R ?

Flip a coin and before revealing the side think about what you hope it’ll be. That’s your answer.

Sep 03, 2023 at 12:36 PM

cxpics
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · Should I get the A7C R ?

jaygould wrote:
No, but the CII can do 4k30p without a crop. The A7CR can only do it in (1.5x) crop mode.

Both can do 4k24p without a crop though, but the A7CRs footage will be pixel binned (lower quality) where as A7Ciis footage will be downsampled from 7k (higher quality).

Not quite. https://youtu.be/6C5HZqNQq9A?si=pAZwCXC8JDUmtZWf

A7CR has 4k24/30 with no crop and better rolling shutter performance than a7Cii. A7CR does 4k60 with 1.2x crop, whereas the 7Cii is 1.5x crop, and about equal rolling shutter here. The A7cR has no 4k60 in super35 mode, only 4k30 with the worst rolling shutter in that mode.

CR is pixel binned so image quality is similar to A1 video, whereas the cii is a bit sharper again with worse rolling shutter in 4k24/30. The cii will have much better video at night if that matters.

This is just stuff I've learned from Gerald Undones a7RV and a7iv reviews and the above video.

Sep 03, 2023 at 12:36 PM

Garmadon
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · Should I get the A7C R ?

1bwana1 wrote:
You likely already know the answer for your own needs. But if you need confirmation, try this. It is as accurate as any answer other people are able to give.

https://magic-8ball.com/

Enjoy!

When I typed in the question "should Armadon buy a Sony A7CR?" the eight ball said "YES".

So there you have it...
Have you read the dice man?

Sep 03, 2023 at 12:52 PM

Garmadon
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · Should I get the A7C R ?

KarmaKramer wrote:
Flip a coin and before revealing the side think about what you hope it’ll be. That’s your answer.
I dont have enough info to determine which one I secretly want

Sep 03, 2023 at 12:53 PM

jtra
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p.1 #20 · p.1 #20 · Should I get the A7C R ?

Garmadon wrote:
Ive been using the a7c for some time and really like it ,family and travel photography. My lenses can handle the bigger sensor

Maybe. When I upgraded from A7iii to A7Riv, I learned things about my lenses that I did not know before ;-)

Garmadon wrote:
and money is not an issue.

That is the most important point. But new camera starts a shopping spree for better lenses and some new accessories. Possibly faster computer too.

Garmadon wrote:
I like the idea of making each lens preform as another ,as Im using primes only. But do I really need 61mp ? And what do I lose in return? (except money).

When I switched from A7iii to A7riv I also switched to primes because my zooms were sub-optimal on 60MP (then I slowly got back to zooms but better zooms). In fact it is great pairing because better cropping ability of higher resolution makes those primes more useful. With high resolution you get benefits of primes (better size and aperture) but still with some cropping you can use them as limited zooms more than you could with lower MP camera.

Garmadon wrote:
Do I need to work in faster shutter speeds with the 61mp sensor?

So depends on linear resolution (e.g. pixel width of image). Lets say that with some lens and some conditions you start get motion blur visible on 33MP when inspecting pixels at 1/60s, that means you would likely get motion blur visible at 1/80s on 60MP when inspecting pixels. But at 1/100s and faster both cameras deliver as sharp photos as sensor can deliver. Also at 1/30s there is no difference between cameras as both deliver as blurry images (just blur is spanning more pixels on 60MP). Not a big difference in needed shutter speed most of the time to get optimal results. To get same results for smaller downscaled resolutions (e.g. 8MP for high res web picture), you do not need to adjust speed at all.

Garmadon wrote:
Do I lose dynamic range or low light cqpabilities vs the 33mp sensor?

No. DR is the same most of the time except the point at which second step of dual ISO becomes active is for different ISO.

Garmadon wrote:
Is it an overkill? I almost never print but do pixelpeep.

No. I like my 60MP and I never felt it was overkill. I like that when I get perfect conditions for landscape for a great picture that the sensor resolution is not limiting. For example here are my 2022 favorites (4k UHD resolution / 8MP in my gallery): https://jtra.cz/foto/2022-my-top5/#

Garmadon wrote:
Another thing , I do notice that some of the photos on flickr or on sonyalphablog just look amazing,usually landscapes that look very detailed and 3d like, even when shawn on dpreview and totally downsampled .When I check -those photos are usually taken with high megapixel cameras , is it just in my head?

Photographers that spend more of their time/life doing photography prefer to have better cameras. Most of the time you don't get to see full 60MP images online and cameras of the same generation (same processing chips) but different MPs rarely have differences in downscaled output. Differences are most likely in conditions (for landscape) and ability to postprocess well.

There are some disadvantages to high resolution that I encountered that you did not mention.
- Processing speed in Lr is significantly lower at 60MP compared to 24MP (so compared to 33MP there would be some difference too). Theoretically there would be slowdown proportional to MPs, but caches are of limited size so it is somewhat worse than that.
- Long exposures (e.g. 30s) are noisier than on 24MP (no idea how 33MP sensor stacks here, but I guess it would have advange).
- Battery life is lower. Moving more data from sensor to cards takes more energy.
- Buffer clears more slowly. On a7riv with uhs-ii cards 1 uncompressed raw clears in about 1s, for uhs-i card about 3s. When buffer is not cleared fully some functions cannot be activated (I guess with new menu system on recent cameras there is a improvement to this) which makes uhs-i really terrible for usability regardless of buffer size because you have to wait for it to clear. The a7riv has a buffer for 30 uncompressed images while a7cr has only 14, see here https://www.alphashooters.com/compare/sony-a7cii-vs-a7cr/
- Uhs-ii cards bigger than 128GB are quite expensive while you could get cheap 512GB uhs-i which could be usable on lower MP body.

Sep 03, 2023 at 01:16 PM

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