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Used Laptop -- yay or nay?

George Welch
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · Used Laptop -- yay or nay?

Good morning

Looking to change from an underpowered Windows desktop to a Windows or Mac laptop.

Wondering if you have gone the used route and what your experience was, good or bad.

Appreciate your thoughts.

Cheers.

George

Aug 14, 2023 at 05:45 AM

EB-1
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · Used Laptop -- yay or nay?

Nope. I wasted just too much money on laptops and moved to high performance desktops that just perform so much better since they are not power limited like laptops. I use a cheap laptop for travel and good desktop for heavy use.

If you buy anything used, make sure there is a decent warranty. Laptops in general have very few replacement parts on the mainboard. The entire mainboard, including CPU and usually RAM, must be replaced if there is a defect, often making the repair not economically viable compared to a new device.

EBH

Aug 14, 2023 at 07:23 AM

Abbott Schindl
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · Used Laptop -- yay or nay?

I've only bought 1 used laptop—a 2012 MacBook Pro bought several years ago from "Mac of All Trades". They were great to deal with and offered a sufficient warranty to give me enough time to test the machine and make sure it worked. I spoke with them on the phone first, and their person was knowledgeable and very helpful. I'd buy from them again.

I also bought a 2012 Mac Pro off eBay. The seller and I exchanged correspondence, which convinced me that he was legit (he also had a number of listings there), and again offered a sufficient return period for me to test the machine thoroughly.

OWC's another highly regarded source for used/tested/certified Macs.

Both machines worked fine and are still perfectly good.

If you're looking at Macs, checkout Apples refurbished deals. I've bought a couple of units from them, but the last one I bought (a 2019 MBP) had a number of issues and ended up going back to Apple ~4 times, including a couple of motherboard replacements and a keyboard/case replacement (because they're inseparable). That's probably the last refurb I'll buy.

As for moving to a laptop, the only ones I'd consider are M1/M2 MacBooks. If you're doing a lot of photo/video/heavy graphics work, go for a MacBook Pro. If you're doing mostly light work with some photo and similar work, an Air would probably suffice. The problem with MacBooks is that they're not upgradeable, so you need to size the memory and disk for what you plan to do over your ownership period, which often means paying for more than you need now.

The nice thing about Apple Silicon MacBooks is that they perform about like desktops and most of the time don't run all that warm. As opposed to Intel MacBooks. There's a lot of info available online, including in FM Forums.

Aug 14, 2023 at 09:47 AM

George Welch
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · Used Laptop -- yay or nay?

Thanks EBH and Abbott. I appreciate the advice.

Looking at laptops both for some freedom to work wherever in the house as well as having a better tool on vacation.

For vacation I currently edit some images on LRC mobile on an iPad which is barely ok.

Abbott, good recommendations for used/refurb.

MacBook-wise, I’ve been looking at the multitude of M1/M2 offerings.

While I’ve had great luck over the years buying used photo gear, I don’t want to inherit someone else’s lemon either.

Cheers

George

Aug 14, 2023 at 01:36 PM

RoamingScott
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · Used Laptop -- yay or nay?

Would never buy a used laptop. You just don't know what it's been subjected to.

M1 macbook pro prices are low enough to skip that idea all together.

Aug 14, 2023 at 01:38 PM

George Welch
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · Used Laptop -- yay or nay?

RoamingScott wrote:
Would never buy a used laptop. You just don't know what it's been subjected to.

M1 macbook pro prices are low enough to skip that idea all together.

Yeah, that is the big one for me.

Thanks Roaming Scott.

Aug 14, 2023 at 01:48 PM

Imagemaster
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · Used Laptop -- yay or nay?

https://www.apple.com/shop/refurbished

Aug 14, 2023 at 10:19 PM

rscheffler
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · Used Laptop -- yay or nay?

Almost all my Mac purchases in the past 10-15 years have been Apple refurbished. They're like new (you wouldn't know they're refurbs) with the same warranty as new. The savings isn't huge, but it's at least something. And sometimes a certain refurb configuration will be immediately available while the same one 'new' may have shipping delay (particularly for less popular configurations). The only time I bought used was a 2011 MBP from an FM member and it was fine. It still works. If you want to go used for the savings, then definitely consider OWC. You could get something a couple generations back for a considerable savings.

That said, If you're interested in a Mac, I think it's worth getting the more recent Apple silicon. It's powerful while also very energy efficient. My past Intel-chip Mac laptops (all the Air variety) got maybe 2-3 hours of battery life with moderate editing/image browsing. Keep an eye on places like B&H. From time to time they'll have decent discounts on new slightly older model Macs. If not in a rush, waiting until Black Friday might be worthwhile. Not necessarily directly from Apple, but places like B&H offloading slightly older models.

Aug 14, 2023 at 10:22 PM

George Welch
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · Used Laptop -- yay or nay?

Imagemaster wrote:
https://www.apple.com/shop/refurbished

Thanks, Tony. I had found that, but I appreciate you reaching out.
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rscheffler wrote:
Almost all my Mac purchases in the past 10-15 years have been Apple refurbished. They're like new (you wouldn't know they're refurbs) with the same warranty as new. The savings isn't huge, but it's at least something. And sometimes a certain refurb configuration will be immediately available while the same one 'new' may have shipping delay (particularly for less popular configurations). The only time I bought used was a 2011 MBP from an FM member and it was fine. It still works. If you want to go used for the savings, then definitely consider OWC. You could get something a...Show more →

Thanks Ron

You’ve given me some things to think about.

Aug 15, 2023 at 03:23 AM

doady
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · Used Laptop -- yay or nay?

I would avoid any old computer. They are cheaper for a reason. Laptops in particular have battery with a certain lifespan.

Newer computers are more efficient, so the cost isn't as high as it seems.

If you want to stay with Windows, look for a laptop with the Ryzen 7840U processor. For Mac, look for M2 Pro.

A laptop with the latest processor is way, way more powerful than my current desktop, and I will be making the transition from desktop to laptop myself. It will be my first laptop computer ever. I don't need a laptop, but the dedicated desktop computer is just an obsolete concept now. Just set the laptop on the desk, plug in the USB hub that already connected to an external drive, mouse, keyboard, and monitor, and boom there is your desktop.

Aug 15, 2023 at 03:32 PM

kthung2
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · Used Laptop -- yay or nay?

Maybe I'm a little less risk averse than some people here. I have no problem with buying used, especially a mac if it still has apple care intact. My main rig is now a desktop PC, but my 11 yr old MBP is still working for light tasks.

Aug 15, 2023 at 06:33 PM

George Welch
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · Used Laptop -- yay or nay?

doady wrote:
I would avoid any old computer. They are cheaper for a reason. Laptops in particular have battery with a certain lifespan.

Newer computers are more efficient, so the cost isn't as high as it seems.

If you want to stay with Windows, look for a laptop with the Ryzen 7840U processor. For Mac, look for M2 Pro.

A laptop with the latest processor is way, way more powerful than my current desktop, and I will be making the transition from desktop to laptop myself. It will be my first laptop computer ever. I don't need a laptop, but the dedicated desktop computer is...Show more →

Thanks, David. I’fe decided to look for a 16” M1 Max w/32GB and 1TB. I think the M2 offerings for same may be a little rich for me right now. Recently retired, I have to balance want/desire. 🤷🏻 Appreciate your comment.
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kthung2 wrote:
Maybe I'm a little less risk averse than some people here. I have no problem with buying used, especially a mac if it still has apple care intact. My main rig is now a desktop PC, but my 11 yr old MBP is still working for light tasks.

Thanks kthung, I’ve decided to probably not go used unless it’s an unbelievable deal.

Cheers

George

Aug 15, 2023 at 06:56 PM

Ferrophot
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · Used Laptop -- yay or nay?

I have both laptop and desktop. Only used the laptop for travelling, at home the 2 x 27" monitors make photoviewing and editing much better. On my most recent trips I left the laptop at home, too much trouble charging it up and pretty useless for viewing and processing.

Aug 16, 2023 at 08:09 AM

jeffbuzz
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · Used Laptop -- yay or nay?

The used versus new debate takes the same form whether you're talking about cameras, computers or cars. Everyone has different risk metrics. I typically buy slightly used computers that are ~2-3 years old and 1-2 generation behind latest. 99% of laptops never move and function as a "desktop". The other 1% that actually get carried around either work or they don't. If it works when you buy it, it is unlikely it will die a week later.

For my purposes there isn't a clear benefit to paying full retail for a 13th gen i7 CPU when an 11th gen chip feels the same in use. Same with NVMe 3 versus 4 drives. If you're doing work that pushes that much data around and you have fast enough network components to prevent bottlenecking, then you may find the newest gear worthwhile. Many folks overestimate the benefits of upgrading a single component in a long data pipeline. You really are better off keeping all equipment at a similar level of performance rather than buying one super fast piece of gear and surrounding it with slower ones.

Aug 16, 2023 at 10:30 AM

George Welch
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · Used Laptop -- yay or nay?

Ferrophot wrote:
I have both laptop and desktop. Only used the laptop for travelling, at home the 2 x 27" monitors make photoviewing and editing much better. On my most recent trips I left the laptop at home, too much trouble charging it up and pretty useless for viewing and processing.

Yeah, don't plan on traveling with it.
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jeffbuzz wrote:
The used versus new debate takes the same form whether you're talking about cameras, computers or cars. Everyone has different risk metrics. I typically buy slightly used computers that are ~2-3 years old and 1-2 generation behind latest. 99% of laptops never move and function as a "desktop". The other 1% that actually get carried around either work or they don't. If it works when you buy it, it is unlikely it will die a week later.

For my purposes there isn't a clear benefit to paying full retail for a 13th gen i7 CPU when an 11th gen chip...Show more →

I've always felt this way with Cameras and Lenses but am hesitant with the computer, for whatever reason.

Appreciate the comment, Jeff

Aug 16, 2023 at 01:44 PM

EB-1
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · Used Laptop -- yay or nay?

jeffbuzz wrote:
The used versus new debate takes the same form whether you're talking about cameras, computers or cars. Everyone has different risk metrics. I typically buy slightly used computers that are ~2-3 years old and 1-2 generation behind latest. 99% of laptops never move and function as a "desktop". The other 1% that actually get carried around either work or they don't. If it works when you buy it, it is unlikely it will die a week later.

For my purposes there isn't a clear benefit to paying full retail for a 13th gen i7 CPU when an 11th gen chip...Show more →

Actually I just did testing of same brand and model line of ultra-light laptops with a 1165G7 vs. a 1360P. Both had the same OS/apps installation and what looks like the exact same cooling system inside. The 1360P is giving 1.6x faster processing times with both DPP and DXO. That's a huge improvement in relative performance.

Most of the difference was from 11th-12th genration.

EBH

Aug 16, 2023 at 04:09 PM

jeffbuzz
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · Used Laptop -- yay or nay?

EB-1 wrote:
Actually I just did testing of same brand and model line of ultra-light laptops with a 1165G7 vs. a 1360P. Both had the same OS/apps installation and what looks like the exact same cooling system inside. The 1360P is giving 1.6x faster processing times with both DPP and DXO. That's a huge improvement in relative performance.

Most of the difference was from 11th-12th genration.

EBH

There is undoubtedly faster performance in absolute terms between various hardware generations. I am not disputing that at all. I simply cannot appreciate the difference in my own daily tasks. To me it is like comparing an a7R III to a7R IV. The new sensor has 45% better resolution. But I can't see the difference in typical images where I am downsizing to far fewer pixels than either of those raw formats has for final output anyway.

Even if I could feel the difference in processing speed between two CPU's. I can buy a used, 11th gen machine for 25% the price of a new 13th gen machine. A 60% speed gain is not worth a 400% price jump.

Aug 16, 2023 at 04:50 PM

George Welch
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · Used Laptop -- yay or nay?

I ended up buying new.

I went with a MacBook Pro M2 Max, 32 Gb, 1 Tb.

Thanks for everyone who chipped in with advice, comments and answered other questions via PM.

Cheers,

George

Aug 18, 2023 at 04:24 AM


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