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One big purchase opportunity, what would you choose?

jedibrain
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · One big purchase opportunity, what would you choose?

Dream with me a bit. I'm at a point where I have been saving up for something for a number of years. I started out with the idea of an R1 - always wanted a 1 series, and can't go back to DSLR at this point. Other than the rolling shutter advantages, I don't really NEED one - this is all about a bucket-list/once in a life time purchase thing.

The other thing I always wanted was the 200-400L. For somewhere in the neighborhood of what the R1 might cost (let's guess $7k, though I'm afraid it would be more), this would have to be bought used (maybe new aren't even made anymore?) .

I got a new job at work that comes with some money, my wife got a better job recently. Daughter not in college yet. And despite being middle-age-crisis age I skipped the motorcycle and/or sportscar.

With what I have set aside so far I may have an opportunity over the next year to spend that kind of money on camera gear without hurting college savings or retirement, or taking on debt.

But what which one is like Sophie's choice! I started with the idea that the R1 would be nice, because generally my lens collection meets my needs. I use the RF 24-105L, and EF 100-400II the vast majority of the time. And I have a number of primes that fill in specific things (all EF, except for the 16mm and 800mm f/11 RFs). The major lens advantage of the 200-400 would be for my daughter's soccer, where it is a stop faster than what I have. Not sure how much longer she will be playing (going in to HS, but plays club, so heavy photographing may taper off in a year or two). And its a big lens for travel so I'd probably keep my 100-400. The R1 would come with speed, resolution and probably a stacked sensor that would help many things. (R3 might be OK, but the R 6 I have is so close (aside from stacked) it seems hard to spend that kind of money on an R3.)

I'd love a 100-300 2.8 with the rumored zoom TC. But That'll be a $12K affair.

Could also consider an R5II, once we know what it is, plus something cheaper like the 400 2.8II or 400 f/4 DO.

Good problem to have....I know. How would you approach this situation if it were you? If it WAS you, what did you do? The general rule that glass is king is well known, but i have adequate glass. I have an adequate body as well (R6). So when is dream body > dream lens?

Brian

Aug 02, 2023 at 09:41 AM

Alan Kefauver
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · One big purchase opportunity, what would you choose?

Looks like you are leaning more towards a low fixed aperture. However, I found the upgrade from the EF 100-400 to the RF 100-500 a big step up. Might want to rent/try one for a bit and see what you think. It takes the 1.4TC extremely well.

Aug 02, 2023 at 09:49 AM

marsguy
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · One big purchase opportunity, what would you choose?

If your lenses generally cover all of your typical use cases, why mess with something that isn't broken? The 100-300 would be sweet, but if you've only got 2 years of good reasons to use it (with your daughter's soccer), given the cost and weight and the fact that you'd keep the EF100-400 anyway, I don't think it makes sense to buy this lens.

IMO, buy the R5II when it comes out, and use the rest of the money on a killer vacation. Or maybe a 28-70/2 for those times when you don't _need_ the lower size and weight, and reach, of the 24-105. The R5 already has excellent "croppability" with 45mp, so even if the R5II doesn't have higher resolution, you can still crop for more reach at 70mm.

This post sounds like a solution looking for a problem, but I'm all too familiar with money burning holes in pockets... do what excites you.

Aug 02, 2023 at 11:11 AM

jedibrain
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · One big purchase opportunity, what would you choose?

marsguy wrote:
This post sounds like a solution looking for a problem, but I'm all too familiar with money burning holes in pockets... do what excites you.

Oh its definitely a gear-head driven indulgence rather than a performance based thing. I did rent a 120-300 2.8 (SIGMA EF) for a tournament and loved the look of the photos. It was a little short though. Which reminds me than an EF 300 2.8 could be an option as well.

...more choices.

It did occur to me that the R5 II could be an option. Waiting patiently for some concrete specs...

-Brian

Aug 02, 2023 at 11:19 AM

artsupreme
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · One big purchase opportunity, what would you choose?

The 100-400II is plenty good for field sports and works very well with an extender. Having owned and shot the 200-400 for years I'm not sure I would buy one now for $4000-4500 unless I was shooting field sports 90% of the time. It's a big lens and it gets tiresome to hand hold, but it is a great field sports lens. I would say forget about the R1 considering the old R5 does it all and the R5II will only be better. I just returned from a long trip with R3/R5's and my R5's are still my go to camera for everything. Your R6 is more than adequate with good glass for now which brings me to my recommendation of waiting for an R5II or buying a 300II. I own the 100-500 and it's boring. I would rather shoot field sports with my 300II and play with extenders than use my 100-500. The 300II will produce magic and give you something to be excited about. It's also more portable than the 200-400. The 200-400 will produce magic too, but it's a beast and I take my 300II many more places than I took my 200-400. Now with ML bodies, the 300II with extenders has reached a new baseline and it's very sharp. Shooting primes will force you to be more creative. And most important, large apertures is where it's at. So the 300II gets my vote, and I think it will hold it's value for awhile now that Canon seems to have replaced it with the 100-300.

Aug 02, 2023 at 11:37 AM

Bacalhau
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · One big purchase opportunity, what would you choose?

Spend it on a dream vacation, so you can use all your adequate gear

Aug 02, 2023 at 11:58 AM

thedutt
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · One big purchase opportunity, what would you choose?

before dreaming of gear, you have to dream of what photos you want to take. that will make gear choice a bit more directed to what you will use vs what seems appealing in the vaccum.

If you are having GAS, upgrade to R5 + 100-500, that would give a significant practical boost to your 100-400 in IQ due to IS/focusing & high ISO noise. Add on a used 500mm F4 II and you are in your budget with a great setup. There is no R1 today, there is an R3 today, but I would not choose that over R5.

Aug 02, 2023 at 02:08 PM

AmbientMike
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · One big purchase opportunity, what would you choose?

I'd probably get to f/4 using 300/4 non IS? Weren't you the one that got me thinking about 300/2.8 again in one of these threads? Doable $2k especially if you don't need IS, not really much more money than your current gear.

I'm always seeing people on these "mules," when I'm shooting on backroads, I'd probably get a cheap used car , but you could get a pretty nice lens for the price of one of those. And a used party barge is $30,000 pretty easily, you can probably get a nice boat for much less. So you're not talking huge money in some respects, and it might not be once in a lifetime purchase.

Aug 02, 2023 at 02:41 PM

fgphoto
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · One big purchase opportunity, what would you choose?

Take a look here on the buy/sell boards at the 200-400... there are a few used ones that have been on here a while that are in the 4-5k range. You could probably get a good deal on one of them... I just got the 100-300 but have no intention of selling my 200-400... it is a very versatile lens and very sharp on R bodies (I'm using R3's and R5's with mine.

They are well made lenses and both of the ones on sale here look well cared for.

Aug 02, 2023 at 02:50 PM

jedibrain
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · One big purchase opportunity, what would you choose?

thedutt wrote:
before dreaming of gear, you have to dream of what photos you want to take. that will make gear choice a bit more directed to what you will use vs what seems appealing in the vaccum.

If you are having GAS, upgrade to R5 + 100-500, that would give a significant practical boost to your 100-400 in IQ due to IS/focusing & high ISO noise. Add on a used 500mm F4 II and you are in your budget with a great setup. There is no R1 today, there is an R3 today, but I would not choose that over R5.

I know what kind of photos I take. As I said, I mainly have my needs covered. This splurge would be to improve the sports/wildlife tele shots beyond what I have now, or increase resolution/capability of the body/reduce rolling shutter on everything I do. Not really a 'vacuum' exercise as my original options are aimed right at what I shoot most often, and as I stated much more a splurge than a need.

I do agree that the R3 is in a weird spot. Great body, great ergonomics, but for the price vs. capability compared to the R5, or R6 which is what I have, its a tough sell. If the R1 had 45mp, stacked sensor, QPAF....yummy, as long as its not $10k.

Maybe none of it is worth it....maybe that's why I am having a hard time deciding. But, if it never happens, thinking/chatting about gear isn't the worst way to waste time.

-Brian

Aug 02, 2023 at 03:12 PM

AmbientMike
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · One big purchase opportunity, what would you choose?

The concept of one big once-in-a-lifetime purchase sounds stressful, I'd rather buy something I could replace if (or probably when) I dropped it etc

Aug 02, 2023 at 03:26 PM

artsupreme
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · One big purchase opportunity, what would you choose?

jedibrain wrote:
I know what kind of photos I take. As I said, I mainly have my needs covered. This splurge would be to improve the sports/wildlife tele shots beyond what I have now, or increase resolution/capability of the body/reduce rolling shutter on everything I do. Not really a 'vacuum' exercise as my original options are aimed right at what I shoot most often, and as I stated much more a splurge than a need.

I do agree that the R3 is in a weird spot. Great body, great ergonomics, but for the price vs. capability compared to the R5, or R6...Show more →

Canon is in a weird place right now with bodies. If they release the R5II soon then there goes the remaining R3 sales. If they release a new R3 they must consider the Z8 specs and pricing. They cannot sell an inferior R3II for more than a Z8. The R5II pricing will also have to be considered to slot in under the Z8. Based on the spec, an R5II should be closer to 3K than 4K based on the Z8, assuming it won't have a stacked sensor.

Anyway, you said wildlife? Definitely think about the 300II even more now. You can shoot it at all three focal lengths and it's razor sharp.

Also, I think an R1 spec now would have to be near 60MP and crazy fast to be worth it over an R5II.

Aug 02, 2023 at 03:26 PM

Scott Stoness
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · One big purchase opportunity, what would you choose?

I have the r5, r8, 200-400,600f4v2, RF100-400, and EF 100-400v1. I mainly shoot landscape and big animals like bears.

My observation is - I bought the 200-400 to supplement the 600, and it turns out the 600 is the lessor used lens now. The 200-400 with 1.4x is excellent. Without it also excellent. I think for big animal wildlife and sports it cannot be beaten.

I am not tempted to r3 or r1. Heavier and expensive and marginally better than the R5. I love the r8 for weight and feature set but don't like 24mpx for cropping.

Personally I would favour a 200-400 over an upgraded body. The only downside for me of 200-400 is that it's hard to wield in the car for size and weight. I generally drive with the rf100-400 at the ready and then switch to 200-400 if I have time or its low light.

Aug 02, 2023 at 08:19 PM

Uarctos
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · One big purchase opportunity, what would you choose?

Get the lens, the body is not that important anymore.

Aug 03, 2023 at 12:05 AM

LuckyStrike88
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · One big purchase opportunity, what would you choose?

Scott Stoness wrote:
I have the r5, r8, 200-400,600f4v2, RF100-400, and EF 100-400v1. I mainly shoot landscape and big animals like bears.

Hey Scott.. You take amazing photos ... I do have a question about your 100-400's (I use the EF 100-400ii .. great versatile lens)

***Is there an RF version or did you mean 100-500 RF ? I want to get that lens in the future

Still getting use to the R5 .. switching over from 1DX2 ... The R5 seems like a toy

) and I am still struggling with focus issues

cheers

TerryV

Aug 03, 2023 at 12:45 AM

PicGuy
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · One big purchase opportunity, what would you choose?

jedibrain wrote:
Oh its definitely a gear-head driven indulgence rather than a performance based thing. I did rent a 120-300 2.8 (SIGMA EF) for a tournament and loved the look of the photos. It was a little short though. Which reminds me than an EF 300 2.8 could be an option as well.

...more choices.

It did occur to me that the R5 II could be an option. Waiting patiently for some concrete specs...

-Brian

It seems to me that, for you, the R5/2 is the camera to wait for. It will likely get a big bump in resolution, AF ability and sensor performance among may other improvements. If I were in your position I would use the bulk of your fund to go to places that will give you the photo opportunities you desire if this is feasible. You could buy a camera and just sit tight until you find something compelling enough to spend your money on. Also, when I find myself having a hard time making a decision, it is best for me to not force a decision because I will probably end up regretting it.

Aug 03, 2023 at 06:37 AM

Scott Stoness
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · One big purchase opportunity, what would you choose?

LuckyStrike88 wrote:
There is a RF 100-400 and it is about $1000. It has very light weight, good centre resolution (where you need it) and okay edges. The rf 1.4x works well on it. Its downside is that it is slow (f8 at 400) and a smidge less iq than your current 100-400.
https://www.the-digital-picture.com/Reviews/ISO-12233-Sample-Crops.aspx?Lens=1572&Camera=1508&Sample=0&FLI=0&API=0&LensComp=972&CameraComp=0&FLIComp=0&APIComp=0

The R5 is better than the 1dx2 in several aspects - much more mpx and eye focus and fps are several of them. I would expect as you use it more, you will gain a new appreciation of it. And it is way better for video. My biggest beef...Show more →

Aug 03, 2023 at 09:12 AM

Scott Stoness
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · One big purchase opportunity, what would you choose?

PicGuy wrote:
It seems to me that, for you, the R5/2 is the camera to wait for. It will likely get a big bump in resolution, AF ability and sensor performance among may other improvements. If I were in your position I would use the bulk of your fund to go to places that will give you the photo opportunities you desire if this is feasible. You could buy a camera and just sit tight until you find something compelling enough to spend your money on. Also, when I find myself having a hard time making a decision, it is best for...Show more →

While I agree that the R5ii is likely to be improved (more mpx, better electronic shutter usage, less leaning distortion on panning, faster fps, better high resolution shift)...., for me these improvements are marginal compared to better glass like the 200-400. [I am likely to get it for the increased resolution because of my pursuit of landscape and printing large but it would not appeal to me much for sport or wildlife]

The real question for you is - will there be a much better 200-400 in RF form or whether other lens will make it obsolete. It is quite heavy and large and expensive even used. The 100-500 is very good and smaller and lighter and cheaper than the ef 200-400, but slower than the 200-400 and does not have the 1.4x built in. The 100-300 f2.8 with 1.4x could be attractive (but I really like the flip in adapter). Canon patents suggest that canon could make a 1.4x that is flip in to add to any lens but we have not seen it yet. I think you should rent a 100-500 and try it out.

Aug 03, 2023 at 09:21 AM

Robin Smith
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · One big purchase opportunity, what would you choose?

I would probably get the R5ii. If you can't really think of why you need a lens, you don't need it. As others say your daughter will not be playing soccer for much longer. It is not as though you must have shots of her from a long way away rather than closer, they won't necessarily be any better, and let's be honest how many shots do you need? I have probably 1000 good shots of my son playing basketball. He doesn't look at them. I only need to see a max of 20-100 going forward. He no longer plays. The only other thing might be to get the 100-500 RF (sell 100-400) as this would be a way to modernize your kit.

Aug 03, 2023 at 09:23 AM

artsupreme
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p.1 #20 · p.1 #20 · One big purchase opportunity, what would you choose?

I’m not so sure that R5Ii will get a resolution bump. I’m thinking an incremental improvement of the current sensor to leave room at the top for their flagship.

Aug 03, 2023 at 09:26 AM

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