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How much post processing?

  
 
gdanmitchell
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p.8 #1 · p.8 #1 · How much post processing?


DailyShooter wrote:
Often, my curt "you are wrong" responses are less for the one I am responding to (their minds will rarely change...we see this in the MAGA crowd), and more for the potentially thousands of readers that read bogus and ignorant claims about highlights, and such.

I think your explanations are correct and most who are in the know would agree with you. But it's sad that there are some with decades of experience that still harbor bogus opinions, and on such basic things.

We often cannot change such minds...but the readers of these exchanges...I believe that their minds often can be...and it
...Show more

Once while out photographing I had a long and pleasant conversation with someone who was more comfortable sticking with his older perspective and not trying to understand more accurately how things work with newer tools. The reason it was pleasant is because he didn't take the "you young-ins are idiots and my way is the only way" approach. Instead he said — and I agreed with him — that her had shot and processed using film-based photography for years, he had tried to make the transition to newer photographic technologies, they didn't make sense to him, and he was just more comfortable continuing to work with film.

I thought that was a great perspective — that he was comfortable doing what he was familiar with and that he didn't need to attack everyone else who was moving on. Note also that I felt no need to challenge his preference. We share a pleasant 10-15 minutes chatting at a turnout overlooking a beautiful Sierra Nevada viewpoint that we were both photographing.

That conversation coalesced a thought that I had based on interactions with another photographer I know who has a long and respected career as a well-known landscape photographer (mostly — he is also known for a highly regarded project photographing NASA stuff) and former Ansel assistant who works (almost) entirely with optical/chemical photography. This person is among those who has inspired me, and I eventually realized that continuing to rely on the traditional processes made complete sense for him — he had mastered those tools in the service of his vision, and there was little reason to go in a different direction. (To be fair, he does know about digital techniques and they are part of his workshops — for example, some time ago he was scanning negatives, printing large versions of them on digital printers and making very large contact prints. But, again, I digress...)

In fact, none of the photographers I know in the real world — as opposed to this virtual, semi-anonymous online world — gets into these heated, insulting, attack-trading screaming matches that too many threads turn into. We all use different equipment, different techniques, and photograph different things... but rather than railing against what our acquaintances do we (mostly) are just interested in how they operate or (if it is too much) we just subtly roll our eyes and move on.

FWIW.

Edited on May 29, 2023 at 10:46 PM · View previous versions



May 29, 2023 at 12:48 PM
AmbientMike
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p.8 #2 · p.8 #2 · How much post processing?


gdanmitchell wrote:
Once while out photographing I had a long and pleasant conversation with someone who was more comfortable sticking with his older perspective and not trying to understand more accurately how things work with newer tools. The reason it was pleasant is because he didn't take the "you young-ins are idiots and my way is the only way" approach.



You mean like you are doing here, right now?

Yes, it'd be nice if you and others didn't attack me for posting personal experiences and a link to an extremely credible source. Too bad you are apparently incapable of learning anything, and apparently deserving of the Paine quote you posted earlier. But you are good at accusing me of doing the stuff you are actually doing. Such horrid behavior, but only if I do it, apparently.

It's just funny that I'm more a SOOC photographer and know more about this stuff and try to explain it to your closed mind. Even though I'm not a big pp type. Well anyway I believe you complaied I only gave the 1 sentence Cliff Notes/condensed version of an argument yesterday, then did something actually fun. Happy now that I went into more detail explainig your inaccuracies?




May 29, 2023 at 04:44 PM
DanielScott
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p.8 #3 · p.8 #3 · How much post processing?


gdanmitchell wrote:
In fact, none of the photographers I know in the real world — as opposed to this virtual, semi-anonymous online world — gets into these heated, insulting, attack-trading screaming matches that too many threads turn into. We all use different equipment, different techniques, and photograph different things... but rather than railing against what our acquaintances do we (mostly) are just interested in how they operate or (if it is too much) we just subtly roll our eyes and move on.

FWIW.

It's a shame when discussions turn to one side being insulting. That's when I actively tune them out completely because I no longer have an interest in engaging with them. Perhaps they have valid points, but their points get lost in the degrading, condescending, and insulting way that they convey them.



May 29, 2023 at 09:22 PM
DanielScott
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p.8 #4 · p.8 #4 · How much post processing?



Too bad you are apparently incapable of learning anything, and apparently deserving of the Paine quote you posted earlier. But you are good at accusing me of doing the stuff you are actually doing. Such horrid behavior, but only if I do it, apparently.

It's just funny that I'm more a SOOC photographer and know more about this stuff and try to explain it to your closed mind. Even though I'm not a big pp type. Well anyway I believe you complaied I only gave the 1 sentence Cliff Notes/condensed version of an argument yesterday, then did something actually fun.
...Show more

Case in point to my post above.



May 29, 2023 at 09:23 PM
DailyShooter
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p.8 #5 · p.8 #5 · How much post processing?


gdanmitchell wrote:
Once while out photographing I had a long and pleasant conversation with someone who was more comfortable sticking with his older perspective and not trying to understand more accurately how things work with newer tools. The reason it was pleasant is because he didn't take the "you young-ins are idiots and my way is the only way" approach. Instead he said — and I agreed with him — that her had shot and processed using film-based photography for years, he had tried to make the transition to newer photographic technologies, they didn't make sense to him, and he was just more
...Show more

Context, Dan.

I'd have respond in the same way you did, regarding that 15-minute conversation with that other photographer, and in that context.

But this is a canon photography forum, and if one is a member, then it is safe to assume that one is very likely into photography, progress, attaining better, and aspiring to do better, and the exchange of truth. Sure, there are those who do not fit this mold, but most do.

So in that context...I respond as I do. There are thousands of silent readers, many who are new to photography, learning, hungry for advice, for the truth...shall we let them think that blown highlights can be recovered?

This is not Facebook, nor LinkedIn where millions of pictures of cats, family vacations, and landscapes are shared, exchanged, and commented on. For that context, my comments are very, very graceful, forgiving, light, and nice.

Context...

Edited on May 30, 2023 at 10:12 AM · View previous versions



May 30, 2023 at 10:01 AM
 


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DailyShooter
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p.8 #6 · p.8 #6 · How much post processing?


DanielScott wrote:
It's a shame when discussions turn to one side being insulting. That's when I actively tune them out completely because I no longer have an interest in engaging with them. Perhaps they have valid points, but their points get lost in the degrading, condescending, and insulting way that they convey them.


Back during my Apple days...we were told "attack ideas, not people"...I try to adhere to that as much as possible...but we all need to know the difference...otherwise truth suffers...



May 30, 2023 at 10:06 AM
Sy Sez
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p.8 #7 · p.8 #7 · How much post processing?


gdanmitchell wrote:
In fact, none of the photographers I know in the real world — as opposed to this virtual, semi-anonymous online world — gets into these heated, insulting, attack-trading screaming matches that too many threads turn into. We all use different equipment, different techniques, and photograph different things... but rather than railing against what our acquaintances do we (mostly) are just interested in how they operate or (if it is too much) we just subtly roll our eyes and move on.

FWIW.


It's almost pathetically amusing when so many FM member's bash DP Review forum members for their perceived fragilities, and inabilities, while FM tolerates its share of members consumed with hypocritic narcissism.



May 30, 2023 at 10:09 AM
gdanmitchell
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p.8 #8 · p.8 #8 · How much post processing?


DailyShooter wrote:
Back during my Apple days...we were told "attack ideas, not people"...


None of us a perfect about this, but that's a fine ideal.

Dan

BTW: I had "Apple days," too, though I worked "with" rather than "for" the company. My connection was mostly with folks in the higher education division, though I also had the privilege of a little connection with their final "distinguished scientist" back in the olden days. Does the term "ADE" ring a bell? (Might or might not...)



May 30, 2023 at 10:27 AM
DailyShooter
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p.8 #9 · p.8 #9 · How much post processing?


gdanmitchell wrote:
None of us a perfect about this, but that's a fine ideal.

Dan

BTW: I had "Apple days," too, though I worked "with" rather than "for" the company. My connection was mostly with folks in the higher education division, though I also had the privilege of a little connection with their final "distinguished scientist" back in the olden days. Does the term "ADE" ring a bell? (Might or might not...)


Small world. I cannot place "ADE" (Apple Developer Education?)...I worked in Logistics Services back in the heady days of the 1980s, and 1990s...was a programmer...we had lots of discussions there...loud, and vociferous at times, but personages were always protected, and respect maintained...a lot of good came out of those meetings. It was the best place I ever worked...



May 30, 2023 at 10:35 AM
gdanmitchell
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p.8 #10 · p.8 #10 · How much post processing?


DailyShooter wrote:
Small world. I cannot place "ADE" (Apple Developer Education?)...I worked in Logistics Services back in the heady days of the 1980s, and 1990s...was a programmer...we had lots of discussions there...loud, and vociferous at times, but personages were always protected, and respect maintained...a lot of good came out of those meetings. It was the best place I ever worked...


At that time (late 1990s) I was a college faculty member with 50% released time to work with the California Community College Chancellor's Office on a project (called "@ONE") to support faculty on the 100+ campus system who wanted to learn how to produce and use web resources,. Apple asked me to be a so-called "Apple Distinguished Educator" (ADE), and that brought me in contact with higher ed folks at Apple (and Claris, about which there's another interesting story) and a lot of other higher ed faculty from the US and beyond. The person I mentioned earlier was working on something called the Educational Object Economy.

To be clear, I was never an Apple employee, though the possibility seemed attractive at the time... but not quite enough to give up my tenured position doing something that I loved.

Anyway, enough of this side-trip down Memory Lane... in a thread on post-processing! ;-)

Dan



May 30, 2023 at 01:55 PM
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