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Archive 2023 · Experience from DSLR to Mirrorless

  
 
PhilPDX
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p.5 #1 · p.5 #1 · Experience from DSLR to Mirrorless


Rivermist wrote:
(from another Phil) - surprising that the numbers are so bad, any details on which features were on?


https://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1748138/0

I tried everything to save energy (I even bought new batteries and new memory cards), but to no avail: the battery drainage continued. What irks me the most is that Canon repair service told me that 150 shots out of a fully charged battery is "according to specs", which cleary isn't.

-Phil




Mar 13, 2023 at 08:30 PM
AmbientMike
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p.5 #2 · p.5 #2 · Experience from DSLR to Mirrorless




MarshallG wrote:
I don’t think you understand.
If there’s a spotlight in the photo, it’s going to be blown out. I’ll crop it out or whatever. You’re going to have some blown out spotlights and areas of solid black. That’s the nature of the genre.

So, yeah, if you try to expose a concert photo by using the histogram, the performer will be WAY underexposed. The histogram just doesn’t work when you know something in the frame will be deliberately blown out. You only care about the reflected light coming off of the performer. Little else matters.

Besides… Canon put zebra stripes in
...Show more

I haven't tried it on this, but assuming you shoot Raw, you might be able to make it not blown out in DPP. Like on a sunset, although I'm not convinced the sun being really bright is a bad thing. Probably spotlights either.



Mar 14, 2023 at 12:24 AM
melcat
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p.5 #3 · p.5 #3 · Experience from DSLR to Mirrorless


MarshallG wrote:
ISO, controlled with the other top dial, is a royal PITA, because once I move out of AutoISO it’s very cumbersome to put it back. I’d like to be able to dial a click before ISO 100 to re-enable AutoISO, but I can’t. Maybe I’ll figure this out, but it’s an aspect I dislike a lot.


A workaround to quickly enter AUTO ISO is to assign ISO to a button, say Mfn. You can press this button and then immediately press INFO to enter auto ISO. To be able to permanently leave auto ISO at any time by turning the wheel past ISO 100, change the custom function “Speed from metering/ISO Auto” to “Retain speed after metering”.

These hacks and the motivation behind them were discussed in my thread "The missing TAv mode":

https://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1799698

The above is for the R3, but from that thread it seems also applies to the R5. Mfn may be by default set to DIAL FUNC, which can also pop up an ISO adjuster, and some might find that preferable to the first hack.



Mar 14, 2023 at 01:52 AM
slowdad
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p.5 #4 · p.5 #4 · Experience from DSLR to Mirrorless


Im glad I found this thread. I want to give my opinion and perspective from a 20 year full time wedding photographer viewpoint, and a part time hobby wildlife photographer viewpoint. I dont own a mirrorless but I have used one of my assistants. I have been on canon 1D bodies since the 1D2 and 1DMK3 introductions. I used 1D bodies because they had dual card capabilities and I would never shoot a wedding on a single card camera. I have used all the 1D and 5D bodies that came out since 2004 and I currently use a 1Dx2 and 5D4 combo. I updated cameras due to ISO sensor performance. 2004 we were lucky to get clean images at 1600 ISO...today we can shoot at 12800 all night long

Something clicked with the 1D bodies and I have never had an issue with the AF systems. I rarely miss shots. With my current 1Dx2, it is by far the best AF system and SERVO function I have ever used on a camera. It doesnt miss. My keeper rate for weddings is over 85%. I dont spray and prey. I typically shoot 1200-1500 images for an 8 hour wedding and I typically deliver 800-1100 images to my clients

When we took the mirrorless bodies to weddings the immediate red flag was wedding receptions in dark venues. The mirrorless hunted and missed shots like crazy. They just didnt cut it when the lights went low. Especially with dance shots and activities where I would need to use servo. They also did not play well with a flash. This was also not just my experience. I know numerous wedding pros that use both mirrorless and DSLRs and when the receptions starts.....they reach for the DSLRs. They are extremely reliable, especially with flash use.

For the majority- the draw to mirrorless is auto eye focus and no lens calibration issues

But for me, I just dont have problems hitting focal points and delivering products to my clients with the current AF system on the 1Dx2 and 5D4. The advantage of the DSLRs is dark venues. I think really experienced wedding photographers like me are having a tough time justifying switching to all mirrorless because we have good DSLRs to use. We are business and we know how to use the equipment we have. For what I do....I dont have to have a mirrorless body and i really dont need to expense or mirrorless to take away from my profit line. I got the 1Dx2 at release. Im going on year 7 and my shutter count is less than 150K.

That said- Im am retiring this summer. So I will consolidate some gear and I am going to buy an R62. I will be shooting wildlife and grand kids. I can easily do that with the 1Dx2 and 5D4. But at some point I wont have any choice but to go mirrorless....so im will jump in this fall and get my feet wet



Mar 14, 2023 at 07:33 PM
Mike_5D
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p.5 #5 · p.5 #5 · Experience from DSLR to Mirrorless


slowdad wrote:
When we took the mirrorless bodies to weddings the immediate red flag was wedding receptions in dark venues. The mirrorless hunted and missed shots like crazy. They just didnt cut it when the lights went low. Especially with dance shots and activities where I would need to use servo. They also did not play well with a flash. This was also not just my experience. I know numerous wedding pros that use both mirrorless and DSLRs and when the receptions starts.....they reach for the DSLRs. They are extremely reliable, especially with flash use.


It sounds like they're using older mirrorless cameras if they can't focus in the dark. My R6 can focus in light I can barely see in.

Here's a pro shooting an R6 in an extremely dark environment:






Mar 14, 2023 at 07:49 PM
slowdad
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p.5 #6 · p.5 #6 · Experience from DSLR to Mirrorless


Mike_5D wrote:
It sounds like they're using older mirrorless cameras if they can't focus in the dark. My R6 can focus in light I can barely see in.

Here's a pro shooting an R6 in an extremely dark environment:





She is a rookie. I would never walk into a reception like that w/o a flash. And the flash would be geld....I dont know many that would shoot like that. She is pushing everything in post, the skin tones are horrible and heavy noise clean is going to be needed.....I came from a film background...not a chance for me



Mar 14, 2023 at 08:30 PM
Mike_5D
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p.5 #7 · p.5 #7 · Experience from DSLR to Mirrorless



slowdad wrote:
She is a rookie. I would never walk into a reception like that w/o a flash. And the flash would be geld....I dont know many that would shoot like that. She is pushing everything in post, the skin tones are horrible and heavy noise clean is going to be needed.....I came from a film background...not a chance for me


She said flash was not allowed.

Regardless, my point was about mirrorless focusing in low light.



Mar 14, 2023 at 08:34 PM
slowdad
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p.5 #8 · p.5 #8 · Experience from DSLR to Mirrorless


Thats code for I dont know how to use a flash

I have photographed over 650 weddings. There has never been a reception venue where I was not allowed to use a flash. I would know this before a customer signed a contract with me. If I was not allowed to use a flash in that venue, i would decline to shoot the wedding.



Mar 14, 2023 at 08:39 PM
downhillonwater
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p.5 #9 · p.5 #9 · Experience from DSLR to Mirrorless


Regarding the original question of the OP..... One of the best assessments of DSLR vs mirrorless can be found going back the first part of the R5 thread. There are many, many opinions on the use of EF lenses on that camera and nearly all conclude that the adapted EF lenses perform better on the R5 than any previous Canon camera.

Only one variable changes... Same lens, same photographer, same suubjects. Different camera.



Mar 14, 2023 at 09:07 PM
Jeff Nolten
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p.5 #10 · p.5 #10 · Experience from DSLR to Mirrorless


I sure get a lot of strange noises from my USM EF lenses mounted on my R5 and the medium weight ones, 100L, 16-35 f4, etc feel a bit awkward on the adapter. But they all take at least equivalent images. I prefer using native mount lenses since this enhances stabilization and I save the weight of the adapter. Their cost is limiting the number I will buy, however.

My EF-S STM lenses all work fine on the R7 (and R5) and they are generally light enough that mounting on the adapter doesn't affect handling. And the STM AF doesn't sound a jittery as earlier USM models.



Mar 15, 2023 at 10:14 AM
TeamSpeed
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p.5 #11 · p.5 #11 · Experience from DSLR to Mirrorless


The adapters so far haven't bothered me, I haven't noticed the 3 ounces and extra 30mm (just slightly over 1") or so that the lens might stick out from my eye. That may change over time.


Mar 15, 2023 at 10:36 AM
PhilPDX
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p.5 #12 · p.5 #12 · Experience from DSLR to Mirrorless


Jeff Nolten wrote:
I sure get a lot of strange noises from my USM EF lenses mounted on my R5....


Interesting. I complained about that months ago and nobody seemed to be able to duplicate.

https://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1748138/0


-Phil




Mar 15, 2023 at 06:51 PM
Jeff Nolten
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p.5 #13 · p.5 #13 · Experience from DSLR to Mirrorless


Well, I use focus tacking a lot more with the Rs, could be that. Used to be I just used single shot and assumed that whatever I was pointing at was in focus, who knew


Mar 15, 2023 at 07:40 PM
MarshallG
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p.5 #14 · p.5 #14 · Experience from DSLR to Mirrorless




TeamSpeed wrote:
The adapters so far haven't bothered me, I haven't noticed the 3 ounces and extra 30mm (just slightly over 1") or so that the lens might stick out from my eye. That may change over time.

The lens does not stick out any further from your eye than it does on a DSLR.



Mar 16, 2023 at 07:30 AM
melcat
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p.5 #15 · p.5 #15 · Experience from DSLR to Mirrorless


TeamSpeed wrote:
The adapters so far haven't bothered me, I haven't noticed the 3 ounces and extra 30mm (just slightly over 1") or so that the lens might stick out from my eye.


I measured this difference between my 1Ds Mk III and R3 by setting them beside each other with the eyepieces level, and then measuring the difference between the flange of the DSLR and that of the adapter on the mirrorless. It’s roughly 17mm. This is how much bigger front-to-back the R3 is with an EF lens fitted, compared to the 1Ds Mk III with the same EF lens fitted (since the EF lens has a fixed length).

The extra thickness is, I would guess, needed to fit the in-body image stabilisation.



Mar 16, 2023 at 08:01 AM
Mike_5D
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p.5 #16 · p.5 #16 · Experience from DSLR to Mirrorless


DSLRs had their sensor set farther back in the body than mirrorless cameras do. So if the bodies are equal thickness, the adapted package will be thicker overall.


Mar 16, 2023 at 09:43 AM
TeamSpeed
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p.5 #17 · p.5 #17 · Experience from DSLR to Mirrorless


Correct, different cameras have different locations of the sensor plane, marked by that icon on the top of the body of a line going thru a circle.

If you line those up camera to camera, the lens would end at the same distance on each. So the delta of the RF and adapter and EF as compared to an equivalent DSLR, is the delta of any two cameras from VF to that sensor plane.

I simply stated 30mm as a worst case number and even at double the real numbers, it isn’t that much to deal with.



Mar 16, 2023 at 02:26 PM
AmbientMike
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p.5 #18 · p.5 #18 · Experience from DSLR to Mirrorless


Rf 20mm
EF 44mm

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flange_focal_distance



Mar 17, 2023 at 12:47 AM
TeamSpeed
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p.5 #19 · p.5 #19 · Experience from DSLR to Mirrorless


That isn’t what we are talking about though, directly. We are talking about depth of an RF body compared to an EF body and the difference of where the sensor plane is between them. That is what dictates this feeling of an EF lens plus adapter being “longer” on an RF body over the lens on an EF body.

IE. sensor plane to VF …

I do know there is some sort of psychological effect of knowing you had to add something to a lens, and therefore it “must” be that much longer away from your face, but that isn’t necessarily so.



Mar 17, 2023 at 05:24 AM
MarshallG
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p.5 #20 · p.5 #20 · Experience from DSLR to Mirrorless




melcat wrote:
I measured this difference between my 1Ds Mk III and R3 by setting them beside each other with the eyepieces level, and then measuring the difference between the flange of the DSLR and that of the adapter on the mirrorless. It’s roughly 17mm. This is how much bigger front-to-back the R3 is with an EF lens fitted, compared to the 1Ds Mk III with the same EF lens fitted (since the EF lens has a fixed length).

The extra thickness is, I would guess, needed to fit the in-body image stabilisation.

Ahh, I see. About 1/2”, for those of us still on the stupid system of measurement. I never noticed, but there it is.



Mar 17, 2023 at 11:32 AM
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