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Archive 2023 · New Leica SL 35 and 50?

wdshuck
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · New Leica SL 35 and 50?

Interested to see how these will be different / improved vs the Panasonic versions. Given the Panasonic reviews, I would assume the focus speed would be improved vs the existing Summicrons?

https://leicarumors.com/2023/02/06/coming-soon-new-leica-summicron-sl-35mm-f-2-asph-and-leica-summicron-sl-50mm-f-2-asph-lenses.aspx/

Feb 07, 2023 at 08:21 AM

steve.chang
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · New Leica SL 35 and 50?

Just wondering how are these going to help the brand or the current sales.

Feb 07, 2023 at 09:51 AM

Fred Miranda
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · New Leica SL 35 and 50?

I'm hoping that the upcoming phase detect AF SL bodies won't affect the focusing speed of our current APO lenses. I've always been intrigued to see how our trusty SL APO lenses will perform with a different AF system.

Feb 07, 2023 at 10:41 AM

flash
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · New Leica SL 35 and 50?

The older lenses won't focus slower. The PDAF systems are hybrid so the CDAF stuff is still there. They may not do AFC well though and the new lenses may be faster there, although without being APO. Time will tell.

More likely that they a: want a cheaper option like they did with the rebadged Sigma 24-70 or b: Are propping up the other L mount partners with some business because the L mount hasn't gained much traction yet.

Gordon

Feb 07, 2023 at 01:21 PM

highdesertmesa
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · New Leica SL 35 and 50?

The Fujifilm GF lenses got much faster (felt almost 2x as fast) when Fujifilm added PDAF to the GFX, so I would expect no less from the current SL glass.

Feb 07, 2023 at 04:27 PM

highdesertmesa
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · New Leica SL 35 and 50?

wdshuck wrote:
Interested to see how these will be different / improved vs the Panasonic versions. Given the Panasonic reviews, I would assume the focus speed would be improved vs the existing Summicrons?

https://leicarumors.com/2023/02/06/coming-soon-new-leica-summicron-sl-35mm-f-2-asph-and-leica-summicron-sl-50mm-f-2-asph-lenses.aspx/

It's a lot less glass to move around versus the SL APOs, so surely they have to be faster focusing.

It will be interesting to see how well these compete with the small Sigmas that have the aperture rings.

All the current SL lenses are sold out in many places (zero stock at Leica USA's online store), so I'm also hoping for an updated v2 of the older APOs with faster focusing motors. Not holding my breath, though.

Feb 07, 2023 at 04:33 PM

flash
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · New Leica SL 35 and 50?

highdesertmesa wrote:
The Fujifilm GF lenses got much faster (felt almost 2x as fast) when Fujifilm added PDAF to the GFX, so I would expect no less from the current SL glass.

Whereas most of the Hasselblad X2D lenses see no improvement at all. A few do like the zoom and 90mm 3.2 but most of the others are the same(slower) as they were on the X1D. The Leica S007 broke the AF gears when it tried to increase the focus speed of the S lenses. The couldn't handle the increased torque.

Also the AFS in the Leica glass is already very quick. As fast as most PDAF systems. It's only AFC that lags behind. SO I definitely don't see a doubling of AF speed. Hopefully an improvement in AFC while AFS will likely be very similar to what we have now.

Likely Fuji planned for PDAF from the start, unlike Hasselblad. We will have to wait and see what Leica did in the SL APO lenses. AFS should be fast. It already is. But I have no idea if the motors and gears can handle the extra load from AFC at the speed of PDAF.

Gordon

Feb 07, 2023 at 04:58 PM

blessingx
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · New Leica SL 35 and 50?

highdesertmesa wrote:
It's a lot less glass to move around versus the SL APOs, so surely they have to be faster focusing.

I wonder how the Panny S 50 f/1.4 13 elements and Sigma Art 40 f/1.4 16 elements are in comparison to either.

Feb 07, 2023 at 06:46 PM

Fred Miranda
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · New Leica SL 35 and 50?

flash wrote:
The older lenses won't focus slower. The PDAF systems are hybrid so the CDAF stuff is still there. They may not do AFC well though and the new lenses may be faster there, although without being APO. Time will tell.

More likely that they a: want a cheaper option like they did with the rebadged Sigma 24-70 or b: Are propping up the other L mount partners with some business because the L mount hasn't gained much traction yet.

Gordon

Hey Gordon,
It never crossed my mind that a new SL camera equipped with PDAF would focus the current SL APO lenses slower. My worry was that these lenses were not designed for phase detect in mind but hopefully will work just fine. As @highdesertmesa mentioned, there's a chance that they will still perform well and possibly even see an improvement in speed. Fingers crossed!

Feb 07, 2023 at 07:52 PM

maxx9photo
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · New Leica SL 35 and 50?

SL is dead.

Feb 07, 2023 at 09:02 PM

LBJ2
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · New Leica SL 35 and 50?

"Luigi Chiurchi with the Leica SL2-S and the new Summicron-SL primes"

Feb 08, 2023 at 09:11 AM

Planetwide
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · New Leica SL 35 and 50?

Leica made a serious error when they slowed development of the SL line. Sales effectively ground to halt, and only price cuts could re-invigorate them. In todays world, new product announcements and product development drive sales. Witness Sony/Canon.

The inclusion of PDAF (I assume), will drive a new round of sales, but only for existing users. Without new lenses, it will be for a diminished base of current customers, and a body only. Leica, hopefully, realizes this and will move forward with lens introductions. Rebadged Sigma's and Panasonics can only get them so far. They need to introduce genuine purpose designed SL mount lenses, after all, that is why you buy the Leica. The delay on the Summicrons has been unacceptable, and consequently, many people just left the brand.

Right now, Sigma is doing the heavy lifting lens wise in the L mount. Panasonic has not introduced a high end S line lens for over three years, and has shifted to the low end of the market. Leica has also not introduced a SL summicron for two years. The L mount needs new bodies, and new Pana/Leica lenses.

The SL line is not dead, it just needs some love. Rumour has it, that 2023 will indeed be a better year - hopefully.

Feb 08, 2023 at 09:15 AM

fjablo
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · New Leica SL 35 and 50?

steve.chang wrote:
Just wondering how are these going to help the brand or the current sales.

Yeah also not convinced that these obviously rebranded Panasonic lenses (and same thing for the Sigma zooms) really help Leica. They are probably betting on consumers who don't want to pay the price for the APO, but are less well informed and so focused on the brand that they pay 5x the price of the Panasonic version. The more "casual" Leica target group.

But overall the closer cooperation between Panasonic and Leica is likely needed for both brands so that they can pool resources and speed up development, esp. of new bodies.

I'm wondering how often Leica is revisiting the "interchangeable lens Q or M with EVF" business case. My guess is at least once a year

If they bring it in L mount, I think the risk to the M would be minimal. People who want an M will always still go for an M.

Feb 08, 2023 at 09:56 AM

selahsean
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · New Leica SL 35 and 50?

Having tried various systems (M/SL/GFX/FE) I never really saw the selling point of the SL system other that it's ability to make better use of M glass. It's heavy enough that it's in the same category of weight as the Fuji GFX system but slower and less featured than the Sony FE system. Given the price I find it to be neither a cost effective solution nor compact enough to be an everyday setup.

The addition of PDAF into L mount bodies may help start to bridge the gap in features between SL and FE, but I'd still be hesitant to make it a go to for the type of things I want an FE body (action / burst shooting). Perhaps these new lenses will find a nice compromise between quality, weight and speed to make a Leica setup a little more compelling. As it is it feels like a VERY niche system.

Feb 08, 2023 at 10:33 AM

LBJ2
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · New Leica SL 35 and 50?

"Lightweight & compact and almost half the weight" is certainly one way to address SL kit size and weight forum complaints. "Made in Portugal" probably contributes on the budget side too.

Referencing the "rebranded" thread comments, does Panasonic have a lens manufacturing facility in Portugal as well?

From a marketing email I received from Leica Store Miami:

"Leica Announces New Lightweight & Compact 35mm & 50mm Summicron-SL Lenses
At almost half the weight and 20% smaller, the new Summicrons offer a lighter and more compact alternative to their APO-Summicron-SL counterparts at an attractive new price point...

At-A-Glance

-Lightweight : 13 oz / 400 grams
-Compact: only 3.25 inches / 83 mm in length
-E67 Filter Size
-Fully weather and dust sealed
-AquaDura lens coatings
-Three aspherical elements
-All metal barrel construction
-Made in Portugal

And until April 30, 2023, you can save an additional $1,300 with the revamped Leica Customer Appreciation Program. Taking advantage of both of these programs will net up to to $2,595 in savings, lowering the entry point to just $4,595 for a brand new SL2-S and 50mm Summicron-SL."

Feb 08, 2023 at 11:44 AM

wdshuck
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · New Leica SL 35 and 50?

The MTFs look fairly close between the Panasonic and Leica. Unfortunately looks to be less sharp than the APO, although not really surprising.

Leica SL 50

Panasonic

Feb 08, 2023 at 01:27 PM

tri_fin
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · New Leica SL 35 and 50?

“Lightweight and compact”; 370g and 83mm for a 50mm f2 prime lens @ £1700.

It is neither light nor compact but it is overpriced.

Leica ought to be ashamed.

Feb 08, 2023 at 01:53 PM

fjablo
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · New Leica SL 35 and 50?

wdshuck wrote:
The MTFs look fairly close between the Panasonic and Leica. Unfortunately looks to be less sharp than the APO, although not really surprising.

The optical design is identical. The difference in the MTF graphs is likely due to different l/mm and Leicas being measured vs Panasonics being theoretical? Oh and maybe f1.8 vs f2.0 if that isn’t just due to rounding (maybe the lens is f1.92 or something)

Feb 08, 2023 at 02:02 PM

hkrazerx
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · New Leica SL 35 and 50?

What are sales figures for the APO SL primes? I gave up on them because they were so big and heavy for someone who walks for miles with camera gear. There are multiple used VE 24-90 zooms in every online camera shop in the US. It’s the only SL lens I own and I love it but honestly I need a really good reason to walk around with it. Do other users have the same neck and shoulder pain that they are trading it for a lighter VE24-70?

Feb 08, 2023 at 02:38 PM

Matt Kerby
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p.1 #20 · p.1 #20 · New Leica SL 35 and 50?

I'm glad they released these, smaller and lighter is better, although, once you use the 35APO, I don't think you'd want to settle for the new ASPH. But the 50 ASPH might be a nice option and hopefully a 21mm?
I gave up waiting on the 21 APO anyways.
I just moved back from M and Sony E, to M and Leica L. I can't stand Sony bodies anymore. Even though they have every cool feature...After using the SL/SL2 then the SL2-S, maybe I just got used to them and just this week re-bought an SL2....
For now I'm enjoying all my m glass on it....Man, the pics are way more clear than on my M10 ...lol

Feb 08, 2023 at 02:51 PM

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