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Archive 2022 · My R6II Impressions

leftymgp
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · My R6II Impressions

First some background, I’ve been shooting with an original 5D for the last 11-12 years or so. That camera has been great. It’s traveled the world with me and has captured some really great shots over the years. (Check out my Flickr page if you’re curious). But it has some limitations and I’ve finally decided to get something newer. Read on for details.

So I mention the 5D because that’s the perspective of where I’m coming from. The 5D pretty had everything I needed from a camera. The 12.8mp sensor was adequate for my needs. I found myself mostly shooting things that were stationary, so the basic autofocus system wasn’t really a drawback. The review LCD was terrible, so I pretty much never used it except for the histogram. I found myself using that camera more like it shot film; I’d take the shots and then I’d see what I got later. But I didn’t really mind that part of it.

The things I found really limiting: First, the high ISO performance. I could notice noise at 400. 800 was very noisy, and >= 1600 was almost unusable. I found myself putting the camera away once the sun started going down. Indoors, a flash was pretty much a necessity.

Second, while the center point AF point in the 5D is great, the other AF points were not very accurate. Like many, I would use the center point to focus and then recompose. This works until you’re working with a really narrow depth of field and you lose the precise focus once you recompose.

I’d been eyeing the 6D series for a few years. I almost sprang at the original 6D when it first came out. The 6DII was tempting, but it seemed like a marginal upgrade. I was hoping Canon would release a really extraordinary 6DIII as a sendoff to the series, but I finally gave up on waiting for that.

I’d also been evaluating upgrading to the 5DIV, and thought very seriously about it. However, looking at the trends in cameras, I finally figured that maybe it was just time for me to go mirrorless.

Why the R6II; a few reasons.

The R6II had just came out. I put my chips on a bet that it would have groundbreaking high ISO performance.
It seemed apparent that most of Canon’s engineering investment was going in to its mirrorless cameras and the RF lens mount. Buying another DSLR seemed like an investment in antiquated tech.
Having lived with the 5D’s 12.8mp for so long, 24.2mp seemed like it would be plenty.
I’ve got 5 month old baby boy, and he won't hold still for anything. Consistently nailing those shallow DOF shots with my 5D was not easy. Nor is capturing that exact moment with just the right facial expression taking a picture one shutter button at a time. I wanted something with good AF and high FPS.
My budget was around $2500. The R5 was tempting, and had the R5II just come out I just may have stretched for it. But 45mp seemed excessive, I was also just tired of waiting.

So now I’ve had my R6II for about a month. Here are my impressions:

The body feels less solid than my 5D, which feels like tank in comparison. That said, I don’t anticipate any problems with the R6II’s durability
I miss the top LCD screen. I’ve realized I had a habit of adjusting the settings on my 5D to suit the current environment as I walked around. I’d just look down and spin some knobs here and there so I was ready for the moment given the lighting situation. Having to activate a screen to know what my settings are is kind of inconvenient.
Not being able to put the camera up to my face at any time to look through the lens is a big adjustment. I would frequently just have a look through the 5D viewfinder just to see how things framed up through the lens. Now I’l put the R6II up to my face, see black, and think the lens cap is on. Oh wait, no, I just need to wake it back up.
The EVF almost seems extraneous to me. I’ve got the back LCD which I can actually touch and use to make adjustments.
The EVF seems to have more detail, I suppose. But I could probably live without it.
24mp is enough for me. But I do kind of wish it was 30mp.
Video is cool. Never had that in a camera body before. Neat!
The AF is really really good with people and animals. I’m amazed at the number of keepers, even at wide apertures.
AF for landscapes has been slightly frustrating. The AF seems to prioritize closer things over farther things. So I find it will focus on the ground when I really want the focus far field. I probably need to program in a quick way to switch back and forth from single point AF to whole area.
The R6II being a new camera, this thing has about 100x more settings than I’m used to. I actually had to read the manual to figure this thing out!
I’m simultaneously blown away and disappointed by the high ISO performance. I’m impressed because the ISO speeds that were visibly noisy with my 5D are now completely usable. To my subjective eyes, ISO 6400 with my R6II is about as noisy as ISO 400 with my 5D (can see noise if I look for it). 12800 roughly as noisy as 800 (definitely seeing some noise, but mostly usable files), and 25600 about like 1600 (I’m desperate, I’ll take the noise!). However, ISO < 6400 on the R6II looks really very clean. And that’s a game changer for me.
Overall image quality seems very good. Images on my R6II just look really crisp and clean.
40 fps in reality is more than I need. But I’m also happy to try to find a use for it!
The EF->RF adapter is a pain. But I knew that’s what I was getting myself into.

In summary, I think the R6 MarkII is a really decent all around camera. I’ve been particularly impressed with the percentage of spot on focus keepers I’m getting with it. But while I do think that it’s a great camera, it doesn’t feel like it’s really pushing the envelope in the area I was mostly concerned about - high ISO performance. However, that’s not to say it’s bad in this respect, just I had hoped for a little more.

Dec 30, 2022 at 01:20 AM

gipper53
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · My R6II Impressions

Congrats on the new camera! I'm enjoying my R6II very much as well. Quite delighted, actually. I came from the latest 5D series bodies and I had a 6 month stint with the R5 in 2020, so I was pretty familiar with what the camera is capable of. Overall I'm very impressed.

You coming from the 5D I can imagine it feels overwhelming. The shear amount of custom options and all of the new tools it has will take some time to figure out. But it sounds like you keep cameras around for a while. I think once you get it suited to your way of shooting, you'll really like it. Definitely plan to invest some time in this, especially the AF modes. The issue you described can be solved with customization and the relevant settings can be switched on the fly.

I'm not too sure what to make of the high ISO comment. Sounds like you're impressed but not impressed? If the R6II doesn't impress you in this regard, I'm not sure what camera will. It's among the best available, and the only cameras that improve upon it for high ISO are splitting hairs. Or were you just expecting the improvement to be that much better after all this time?

Edited on Dec 30, 2022 at 02:55 AM · View previous versions

Dec 30, 2022 at 02:00 AM

Mike_5D
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · My R6II Impressions

Regarding the back LCD vs EVF, using the EVF provides better stability with the camera pressed against your face instead of hanging out in front of you. It is also much easier to see in sunlight. With mirrorless, I can now review images through the EVF I could have never seen on the LCD.

Dec 30, 2022 at 02:10 AM

Gochugogi
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · My R6II Impressions

I bought the R6 MK II at launch and the ability to dig out shadows and use high ISO knocked my socks off, and I was coming from an EOS R, a camera with a pretty decent CMOS. I haven't used a 5D since 2008 but I remember I tried not to go above ISO 800 otherwise the noise looked like grains of sand, especially on skies.

I don't find the Whole Area (automatic AF point selection) useful most of the time and prefer single point or small area focus. Tracking in AI servo is so good once you place the point where you want it, you can recompose and the camera keeps tracking. Switching AF patterns using the AF point selection button only takes a second or two while looking through the EVF.

Dec 30, 2022 at 02:21 AM

TeamSpeed
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · My R6II Impressions

I never use the rear lcd for shooting, in fact I almost always have it turned inwards. The EVF shows me everything, and with auto ISO, I only worry about two settings. Just my perspective here regarding the lack of a top lcd and the evf. Congrats though!

Dec 30, 2022 at 07:16 AM

leftymgp
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · My R6II Impressions

gipper53 wrote:
I'm not too sure what to make of the high ISO comment. Sounds like you're impressed but not impressed? If the R6II doesn't impress you in this regard, I'm not sure what camera will. It's among the best available, and the only cameras that improve upon it for high ISO are splitting hairs. Or were you just expecting the improvement to be that much better after all this time?

To refine my comment a bit: while the high ISO performance is very good, judging from high ISO images I've seen from other cameras, including the original R6, the R6II doesn't seem to really push the envelope very much.

That said, the ISO performance across the spectrum I use 90% of the time is superb. So I don't want to come across as complaining too much. Just that I was hoping for a little more.

Dec 30, 2022 at 10:32 AM

jedibrain
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · My R6II Impressions

leftymgp wrote:
To refine my comment a bit: while the high ISO performance is very good, judging from high ISO images I've seen from other cameras, including the original R6, the R6II doesn't seem to really push the envelope very much.

That said, the ISO performance across the spectrum I use 90% of the time is superb. So I don't want to come across as complaining too much. Just that I was hoping for a little more.

If you use a good noise reduction software like DXO or Topaz, ISO 52600 is very usable. There are free trials of both you can mess with. I use DXO Photolab instead of Lightroom, but they also have just a raw converter if you want it. Both include their excellent noise reduction software.

You're right the II isn't much better than the R6 in terms of ISO noise. But both of those are pretty close to the best there is on the market.

Its also funny how different people interface with the camera differently. I don't miss the top LCD at all. Having everything at the press of a button in the viewfinder keeps me from having to take my camera away from my eye but still allows me to change everything. Or I can do it on the rear LCD. But its a personal thing.

Couple of tips to help you get used to the new camera. I came from a 5DIII, which was more advanced than the 5D but still had a ton less than the R6 does (I have the regular R6).

- Try multiple back button focus. for instance, put face/eye tracking on the * button, and current AF mode on the AF-on button. Then set the plus sign button next to the * button to cycle between AF modes. This allows you to cycle between spot and zone modes quickly, and still have eyeAF instantly available. If you also take AF start off of the shutter button half-press, then you don't even need to switch between one shot AF and servo. You'll have to hold the rear button to focus (which takes some getting used to), but if you want one shot AF you just hit the rear button to focus on what you want, then let go and the camera will not re-focus when you press the shutter. Good for focus/recompose, though that is not necessary as much as it used to be since AF points go all the way to the edges now. If you want a more detailed explanation of how this works let me know.
- Set up a button to switch between the EFV and the rear LCD. its a HUGE power saver. And it sounds like you don't use the EVF much anyway. I use the DOF preview button for this.
- Run airplane mode all the time - also a huge power saver, though I hear the II is more power efficient than the original.
-

Brian

Dec 30, 2022 at 10:54 AM

gipper53
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · My R6II Impressions

Dec 30, 2022 at 11:15 AM

Jeff Nolten
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · My R6II Impressions

leftymgp wrote:
In summary, I think the R6 MarkII is a really decent all around camera. I’ve been particularly impressed with the percentage of spot on focus keepers I’m getting with it. But while I do think that it’s a great camera, it doesn’t feel like it’s really pushing the envelope in the area I was mostly concerned about - high ISO performance. However, that’s not to say it’s bad in this respect, just I had hoped for a little more.

This is pretty much my assessment of the R6II. The ISO noise wasn't bad just not up to the high ISO king I'd expected from the hype around the original R6. From the PtoP graphs, it seems the R6II actually improves on the original, but that is also linked to pixel count. Since this camera was to be the replacement for my main 5D4, I opted to trade it for the R5 during the returns period. I'm happy with the trade. The higher pixel count averages noise a bit better. I prefer the R7, R6II button configurability, but learning the differences, the R5 has the same AF usage and performance, (horses notwithstanding

).

Two other comments about ISO noise. If you are using RF lenses, the enhanced stabilization of lens IS and IBIS allows one to use lower ISOs and longer shutter speeds on static subjects. IBIS helps with non-IS lenses as well. Also, noise software like Topaz works wonders at reducing image noise. I've used it to reduce sky noise in many of my original 5D images.

While still nostalgic for the view through an optical viewfinder, I've come to appreciate the info in the EVF. I like reviewing my images through the EVF and using the zoom function. I've discovered using the zoom function during AF as well. I turn the camera off when not in active use and have developed the habit of using the off/on switch while lifting the camera to my eye so the EVF is active when it gets there.

Dec 30, 2022 at 11:20 AM

Rivermist
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · My R6II Impressions

For focus, try the Flexible Zone AF 1 to AF 3, you can size the area for focus search into a square or any rectangle depending on the type of picture you are trying to take, and move this area around with the joystick. Very powerful (admittedly a learning curve coming from a 5D mk1). I have upgraded from the RP, so a much easier path, but still a lot to learn on this very powerful camera.

Dec 30, 2022 at 12:13 PM

Mike_5D
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · My R6II Impressions

jedibrain wrote:
- Try multiple back button focus. for instance, put face/eye tracking on the * button, and current AF mode on the AF-on button. Then set the plus sign button next to the * button to cycle between AF modes. This allows you to cycle between spot and zone modes quickly, and still have eyeAF instantly available. If you also take AF start off of the shutter button half-press, then you don't even need to switch between one shot AF and servo. You'll have to hold the rear button to focus (which takes some getting used to), but if you want...Show more →

I have a similar set up but swap the AF-ON and * buttons. I use eye AF with an initial point and AI servo most of the time so I want that on the AF-ON button which is more comfortable. Unfortunately, I don't like how certain configurations don't give me an initial focus point square. I've found the following trick to solve that:

- Camera's focus method set to single point
- * button set to engage AF with no overrides
- AF-ON button set to engage AF but in face+tracking mode

- button to the right of * toggles servo/single-shot AF
- top/back wheel selects focus method

Since the focus method is single point, the AF square is displayed whether in servo or single-shot mode. I can use it as the starting point for face tracking or as a traditional AF point, depending on which button I press. If I need an expanded AF area, I can just roll the wheel and hit the * button.

The advantage of quickly toggling between servo and single-shot mode is that single-shot will focus in much lower light than servo will. So it's handy to have quick access to, especially if using a slower lens.

The R series is almost endlessly customizable which is great, but can take a while to find the perfect set up.

Dec 30, 2022 at 12:17 PM

Imagemaster
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · My R6II Impressions

You are faulting the camera just because you don't know how to use it properly yet. The 5D is a slug compared to pretty well every mirrorless camera.

I never use the LCD screen in the field except if I want to shoot at ground level when it is advantageous. Can't do that with the 5D. The only other time I use it is when sitting somewhere and making adjustments in the menu.

Otherwise, it is disabled. I use the EVF for viewing subjects, making setting changes, and reviewing images. You don't have to wake the camera back up if you didn't put it to sleep in the first place.

Can you look through an OVF and tell if your image will be over or under-exposed? No. You can with an EVF.

Have your camera set up properly and you can whip it up to your eye and immediately see your subject (and if it is properly exposed) and lock focus on your subject in seconds.

Don't blame the camera.

Dec 30, 2022 at 01:25 PM

leftymgp
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · My R6II Impressions

Imagemaster wrote:
You are faulting the camera just because you don't know how to use it properly yet. The 5D is a slug compared to pretty well every mirrorless camera.

I never use the LCD screen in the field except if I want to shoot at ground level when it is advantageous. Can't do that with the 5D. The only other time I use it is when sitting somewhere and making adjustments in the menu.

Otherwise, it is disabled. I use the EVF for viewing subjects, making setting changes, and reviewing images. You don't have to wake the camera back up if you didn't...Show more →

Perhaps you should reread my post as I didn't "blame the camera" for anything you mentioned. I merely stated that the EVF feels extraneous. Thinking on it further, a viewfinder seems like a curious option on a non-DSLR camera. Why do I need two screens? Perhaps just have one, but make it good enough to do everything?

I do agree with a previous comment about how having the camera up to your face can help steady your shot. I tried using the camera today with the rear LCD turned inwards, so with only the EVF. It still feels unnatural to see a computer screen through the viewfinder. Something I'll have to get used to...

Thanks to those with suggestions on how to setup the camera. Over the past month I've been experimenting with all the different settings and modes, reprogramming buttons, etc. (I did mention that I read the manual!) I think I'm honing in on something that works.

Dec 30, 2022 at 07:45 PM

rscheffler
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · My R6II Impressions

@leftymgp you should try running some of your favorite higher ISO 5D raw images through modern noise reduction software, such as from DxO.

The 5D is still from roughly an era when Canon and other manufacturers didn't do much in-camera processing and left it for the photographer to tackle in post instead. Things have changed with the newer cameras. A lot more in-camera processing. You'll find that straight out of camera Jpeg processing is much better now, as is in-camera noise reduction, plus all the other corrections it will do, such as CA, vignetting, diffraction, etc. You can also do in-camera HDRs, focus stacking, etc. They're starting to catch up to the processing power of smartphones. Kind of.

Using the lens adapter will take a bit of time to get used to. It looks like you're only using EF mount lenses, so try to make it a habit of leaving the adapter on the camera and just changing lenses. Otherwise, if you're adding RF lenses to the mix, I'd advise getting a couple (or more) adapters to keep on your most used EF lenses to save some hassle swapping those.

I recently added the R6II to my DSLR system too, after spending a few months trying many of the Canon mirrorless cameras. As you've found, mirrorless can be much superior when it comes to tracking people/faces/eyes and especially at wider apertures and off center compositions. But it's not perfect and can still get fooled, particularly in low contrast situations, such as strong backlighting. Sometimes it doesn't want to focus on the face or eyes. But this could also be challenging for a DSLR... I found with landscapes containing objects at many distances, that the AF didn't necessarily always want to focus on what I put the AF point on. I got into the habit of using the magnify button to punch in to confirm if focus was correct, then fix it manually if it wasn't. If you disable AF from the shutter release and, as someone else already suggested, use the various thumb buttons to initiate AF instead, you can immediately tweak focus manually without having to switch the lens to manual focusing. And as suggested in that post, I never switch between One Shot AF and AI Servo now. I just leave it in AI Servo and lift my thumb off the AF-ON button if I wish to lock focus.

leftymgp wrote:
I merely stated that the EVF feels extraneous. Thinking on it further, a viewfinder seems like a curious option on a non-DSLR camera. Why do I need two screens? Perhaps just have one, but make it good enough to do everything?

I do agree with a previous comment about how having the camera up to your face can help steady your shot. I tried using the camera today with the rear LCD turned inwards, so with only the EVF. It still feels unnatural to see a computer screen through the viewfinder. Something I'll have to get used to...

I agree at first seeing a monitor instead of a natural image through an optical viewfinder is slightly disconnecting, but yes, you'll get use to it. Particularly how well it works in really dark conditions where you'd struggle to see anything with your eyes through an OVF.

EVF vs rear display really depends a lot on the lens in use. I wouldn't want to use the rear display while shooting sports with my 200-400, particularly in bright light and reflections on the display. But that flip screen is super useful for shooting at odd angles and pseudo waist level shooting that sometimes can put your subject more at ease (because they see your face and not a camera pointed at them).

Dec 30, 2022 at 08:00 PM

Rivermist
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · My R6II Impressions

I agree at first seeing a monitor instead of a natural image through an optical viewfinder is slightly disconnecting, but yes, you'll get use to it. Particularly how well it works in really dark conditions where you'd struggle to see anything with your eyes through an OVF.

EVF vs rear display really depends a lot on the lens in use. I wouldn't want to use the rear display while shooting sports with my 200-400, particularly in bright light and reflections on the display. But that flip screen is super useful for shooting at odd angles and pseudo waist level shooting that sometimes...Show more →

Beyond the argument about EVF, try holding e.g. the RF 100-500 in a position to use the rear screen, 4-5 inches away from your face, versus holding it up against your eye with the EVF. It is IMHO more difficult to track subjects, and your forearms will start to ache pretty soon.
For me, even with the RP that I have been using since March 2019, the EVF offers so much information during shooting, such as the histograms, the level and WYSIWYG exposure. Plus the image review in the viewfinder as opposed to having to lower the camera to do an image check on the back screen, this is priceless in terms of remaining engaged in the viewfinder and ready for the next shot. Maybe not such a big issue with a small lightweight lens but it starts to matter with heavier / larger glass. Now that I have upgraded from the rather spartan RP EVF to the 6DmkII, it is a huge step up in quality and capabilities.

As you and others mentioned some posts back, "it takes some time to adapt". My first year with a 5DIII and an RP in tandem, it was not always easy to go back and forth between mirror and EVF. At the end of that adaptation time I sold the 5D, as the merits of mirrorless became more obvious, and the limitations of the older generation were clearer to me in the context of the main focus of my photography: outdoors - travel. In a flash studio context there may well be no merit at all in switching to mirrorless, beyond new lens technology.

Dec 31, 2022 at 09:35 AM

Imagemaster
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · My R6II Impressions

The first EVF's were dismal and annoying. The latest ones are great. Why anyone shooting action or using telephotos would want to use the LCD in such cases is beyond me. Probably why 95+% of photographers shooting in such cases use the EVF.

Having the option to use either is a bonus. Hardly a negative.

Dec 31, 2022 at 10:49 AM

artsupreme
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · My R6II Impressions

My LCD is closed 99% of the time. I rarely open it unless shooting video.

Dec 31, 2022 at 01:25 PM

garyvot
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · My R6II Impressions

Re. the preference for rear LCD versus EVF: I suspect the OP is not a sports or action photographer. I do see a lot of commercial and portrait photographers (at least, those who vlog) using the rear LCD to compose and shoot. (I personally still think it looks ridiculous and amateurish, but there is no right or wrong, just what works for the individual I suppose. I imagine this is a popular practice for those who shoot video as well as stills or who grew up with the smartphone.)

Dec 31, 2022 at 01:54 PM

Gochugogi
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · My R6II Impressions

I see people shooting stills in Waikiki and at student events using the rear screen with a telezoom all the time. I figure they started photography on a smart phone (or don't want to mess up their eye makeup). Oddly, my wife does it all the time with her 55-250 zoom and most of her pictures are sharp. I need to brace on my face or blur city...

Dec 31, 2022 at 02:04 PM

Mike_5D
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p.1 #20 · p.1 #20 · My R6II Impressions

Gochugogi wrote:
I see people shooting stills in Waikiki and at student events using the rear screen with a telezoom all the time. I figure they started photography on a smart phone (or don't want to mess up their eye makeup). Oddly, my wife does it all the time with her 55-250 zoom and most of her pictures are sharp. I need to brace on my face or blur city...

I guess it depends on your shutter speed and how tightly you're trying to compose. For short clips without a tripod, using the OVF definitely helps stabilize video too, especially at longer focal lengths.

Dec 31, 2022 at 02:09 PM

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