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RoamingScott
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I shot fuji for years Dan. Ive used every relevant post processing tool available.

Stop telling me to just try it, I did for years, and letting LRs abysmal demosaicing engine for Fuji files have an effect in the sharpening process is less than ideal.

Your example posted is sort of meaningless. You already said (and I agree) that the issue is most exacerbated by the green channel, detail dense vegetation as a fine example. Your tan wall example is as far from that as it gets.

Ultimately, as a landscape-focused guy, shooting Fuji turned out to be more of a pain in the ass with too many downsides, as someone that is completely unwilling to move away from LR.

gdanmitchell wrote:
I want to come back to this for a moment.

I wonder if you actually understand what unsharp masking is and how it is used as part of a sharpening workflow.

This is a little hard to describe in a text-only manner, but unsharp masking (USM) derived from an old film technique in which a somewhat unfocused and inverted version of the negative (thus a positive) was produced and layered with the original negative for printing. (This out-of-focus layer is the "unsharp mask," with mask here "masking" the amount of sharpening.)

The result was that contrast was somewhat increased in areas
...Show more



Jun 20, 2022 at 10:42 AM
Bsmooth
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So what processors do work for Fuji X-trans files other than Capture One,Photoshop and Lightroom ?(Just ignore the last two).


Jun 20, 2022 at 07:24 PM
Michael Everet
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What about DxO? -- the latest version that is.


Jun 20, 2022 at 08:25 PM
Bsmooth
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I'm using DXO Photolab 4 right now.


Jun 20, 2022 at 09:12 PM
curious80
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RoamingScott wrote:
I shot fuji for years Dan. Ive used every relevant post processing tool available.

Stop telling me to just try it, I did for years, and letting LRs abysmal demosaicing engine for Fuji files have an effect in the sharpening process is less than ideal.

Your example posted is sort of meaningless. You already said (and I agree) that the issue is most exacerbated by the green channel, detail dense vegetation as a fine example. Your tan wall example is as far from that as it gets.

Ultimately, as a landscape-focused guy, shooting Fuji turned out to be more of
...Show more

Maybe you guys are right and some issue exists. However in my personal use and comparisons i haven't came across those. When I first got the X-T3, I compared it against a 24MP Sony APS-C camera for some test shots including shots with foliage. I didn't see any meaningful difference between the two. Yes at 200% you could see some difference in how each sensor rendered, but neither had more detail than the other. What I could see is that the areas which were beyond the resolution limits of the sensor were handled somewhat differently by both. I repeated a similar comparison later when I had a Sony A7RIV since the APS-C crop of that exactly matches the 26MP resolution of the X-T3. I had similar observations with that comparison as well.

I won't lose my sleep over some real or perceived issue that only occurs in some very specific type of scenario, with some specific type of processing, and requires viewing at 200% magnification.

And certainly based on OP's description it doesn't seem that 200% pixel peeping and obsessing over pixel level artifacts was his concern. Not every discussion has to degenerate into this silly pointless x-trans vs non-x-trans debate which will never be agreed upon and is irrelevant for 99.9% of the users.



Jun 20, 2022 at 10:29 PM
Makten
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curious80 wrote:
Not every discussion has to degenerate into this silly pointless x-trans vs non-x-trans debate which will never be agreed upon and is irrelevant for 99.9% of the users.


It's not pointless to bring up the topic since there obviously are numerous photographers that simply don't like x-trans for various reasons. We don't know if the OP is one of those or not.
But I agree that the debate is pointless. Just look at images and decide if it's to your liking or not.



Jun 21, 2022 at 12:01 AM
curious80
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Makten wrote:
It's not pointless to bring up the topic since there obviously are numerous photographers that simply don't like x-trans for various reasons. We don't know if the OP is one of those or not.
But I agree that the debate is pointless. Just look at images and decide if it's to your liking or not.


It becomes pointless when some people make it their life's mission to bring up the same topic again and again and again in every thread they see and derail the thread from its actual topic which has nothing to do with this



Jun 21, 2022 at 12:50 AM
Makten
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curious80 wrote:
It becomes pointless when some people make it their life's mission to bring up the same topic again and again and again in every thread they see and derail the thread from its actual topic which has nothing to do with this


You better tell Dan. The pointlessness is in refusing to understand that every photographer don't want or like the same things.

Edit: Whether this is on topic or not, we don't know. The OP has not stated what image quality he expects from the camera.



Jun 21, 2022 at 01:26 AM
curious80
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Makten wrote:
You better tell Dan. The pointlessness is in refusing to understand that every photographer don't want or like the same things.

Edit: Whether this is on topic or not, we don't know. The OP has not stated what image quality he expects from the camera.





Jun 21, 2022 at 02:16 AM
gdanmitchell
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I agree that this thread is not the place to continue this discussion. There are a couple of reasons for that, one of which is that it has diverged too far from the original topic, into areas that deserve a separate thread.

Another reason is that there's a small group of forumtographers who resort to ad hominem when faced with evidence, and engaging with them beyond a certain point is a waste of time.

The topic of how to get good quality results from x-trans files keeps coning up in Fujifilm threads, at least in part because a persistent group of posters are utterly convinced, despite the evidence from photographers who disagree and who get excellent results, that the x-trans cameras are afflicted by some awful IQ issues that are only made worse by using Adobe products.



Jun 21, 2022 at 09:37 AM
 


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Makten
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It's baffling that someone actually can believe that "excellent" means the same thing to every photographer. The x-trans crops provided in this thread are far from excellent in my opinion.


Jun 21, 2022 at 10:01 AM
RoamingScott
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Dan: "worms are an artifact of a bygone era!"

Me, opening a pic I took this weekend:

There's a reason the X-T2 is relegated to my son, and this is it.

Worms are already visible at LR's default sharpening settings on import on his tricep/background, these are at 100% zoom:

40% LR sharpening (default)


150% LR sharpening just to prove how wormy it gets for reference


USM applied instead of LR sharpening, less artifacts on the skin and foliage




Jun 21, 2022 at 10:21 AM
chez
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You are all set for a good day of fishing with that can of worms.


Jun 21, 2022 at 11:43 AM
molson
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curious80 wrote:
It becomes pointless when some people make it their life's mission to bring up the same topic again and again and again in every thread they see and derail the thread from its actual topic which has nothing to do with this


So much "advice" on Fuji gear from a handful of super-dedicated forum posters who never seem to have any images to share here...



Jun 21, 2022 at 01:37 PM
Robin Smith
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I can't see worms in Dan's image. Maybe it's your retina?


Jun 21, 2022 at 02:50 PM
Sharona
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The good news is that at actual printing/viewing size, you're unlikely to see the "worms" or whatever you want to call them. I shoot with an XH-1 and XT-3. I don't show or print anything at 200%!


Jun 21, 2022 at 03:33 PM
Makten
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Sharona wrote:
The good news is that at actual printing/viewing size, you're unlikely to see the "worms" or whatever you want to call them. I shoot with an XH-1 and XT-3. I don't show or print anything at 200%!


It depends on what type of photography you do, and how you like to view your images. I love zooming in on photos with lots of details to "discover" all the parts of the scene, that I never even saw when I made the shot. Which makes digital artifacts and/or crappy lenses very evident.

If you never peep at large magnification, I'm sure the x-trans sensors are fine.



Jun 21, 2022 at 04:59 PM
chez
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I find it ironic that we analyze the sharpness of lenses in the deep corners at 100% to find the winners from the losers and then just say these worms caused in post processing wont affect the printed image.


Jun 21, 2022 at 05:16 PM
molson
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chez wrote:
I find it ironic that we analyze the sharpness of lenses in the deep corners at 100% to find the winners from the losers and then just say these worms caused in post processing wont affect the printed image.


Try to keep up... you're getting confused between the GFX medium format threads and this one.



Jun 21, 2022 at 08:43 PM
chez
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molson wrote:
Try to keep up... you're getting confused between the GFX medium format threads and this one.


Yeh its hard to keep up with all the issues flying around the Fuji world.



Jun 21, 2022 at 09:13 PM
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