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Voigtlander 50mm f/1 Nokton Review

nehemiahphoto
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p.31 #1 · p.31 #1 · Voigtlander 50mm f/1 Nokton Review

BastianK wrote:
I think the VM 21mm 1.4 is a better match. Ergonomics are very similar down to the same filter thread
and they have similar image quality also thanks to both featuring a floating elements design.

Good thought. For several reasons I’ve never picked up a CV 21/1.4. The space of a 21 + 50 is funky to me, but I should give it a whirl.

If I didn’t have a GM 24 and if the coma correction was better WO I’d own the CV 24/1.4 I think.

Nov 07, 2023 at 11:11 PM

josh-himes
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p.31 #2 · p.31 #2 · Voigtlander 50mm f/1 Nokton Review

jshcrlsn wrote:
This is my first experience with a 50mm F1.0-1.2 lens though I am very familiar with several F1.4 offerings.

First, I want to say thanks to Fred for the wonderful write up on this and the contributions from many others here. Also, to BastianK at phillipreeve.net for his wonderful write up comparing fast 50s recently...much respect given.

Your review helped make the decision to plunk down the cash for this lens. For those of us without deep pockets it really makes a difference. I find the aspects of this lens that many complain about to be the main reasons I love it (optical vignetting, edge oof details, swirl, reverse field curvature etc). To me this lens combines modern contrast, color, and field of focus capabilities necessary for decent digital sensor capture with many of the beautiful flaws of vintage fast glass. It is by far my favorite offering by Voigtlander atm.

Im currently on the fence about making an exchange of my new acquisition based on a few observations made from my copy. For such an expensive manual prime lens I have high expectations. I would love some feedback about my particular lens from the likes of Highdesertmesa, Lifeandmylens, Fred, and any others that have had a few specimens through their hands to compare. What are some realistic expectations of performance vs sample variation on a lens such as this? With my lens I feel that contrast and field of focus are very nice. It is well centered so no issue here. However, my lens isnt that sharp wide open where sharpness seems to exist in a hair width between the glow of green and magenta aberrations on either side of best focus (in center frame where I care about it most). Also, like josh-himes my lens focuses well passed infinity at the hard stop wide open or stopped down by quite a bit. It is however pretty spot on at close to mid distances for RF focus wide open on both my M10-R and my M10-M.

Below I will post some testing image data I have collected from it in hopes of some opinions to help me make the best decision possible for what is a substantial investment on my part. Bear with me...I dont post much and so hopefully I get the uploads right enough to gather a decent opinion from.

All images made at ISO 100 on the M10-R white balance 5000k. No sharpening at all and no post processing. Just straight exports of the RAWs with the original camera color profile attached.

First, is a comparison handheld at close to MFD of a recent 50mm Lux ASPH at F1.4 and the Nokton at F1. Just to get a reference for look and detail rendered on a real life 3D subject in high contrast light (My main concern here with this lens is performance on center).

Second, is a test I conducted on a star chart from about 7ft away with both lenses at F1.4 and cropped by 200% in order to see real detail differences on the central part of the frame. I made several takes racking the focus ever so slightly between green to magenta transition of sharpest focus and picked the very best ones for comparison here.

Third, is the field of focus of my lens (exaggerated with detail sliders in Lightroom) to show the ever so slight left downward tilt it has throughout the range from about 4ft to 10ft.

All of my tests followed consistently when conducted on the M10-M and so I feel no reason to add them in here.
Thank you for any opinions offered on my behalf....Show more →

For what it’s worth, I decided that only the outer zone was focusing past infinity on my copy. The center is spot on at infinity, so I figure it’s part of the design and the outer zone focusing slightly past infinity is attributable to field curvature. That may be what you are seeing as well.

It’s absolutely a non issue for me, because wide open landscapes are a pretty rare use-case. By F2 at infinity, everything looks great across the frame on my copy. At any other focus distance, I have no complaints and am amazed at the performance wide open. It’s really an exceptional lens and I’m very satisfied with mine. I suspect yours will prove itself a good performer, but it never hurts to work your way through the process just to verify that it’s performing as designed.

Nov 07, 2023 at 11:50 PM

jshcrlsn
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p.31 #3 · p.31 #3 · Voigtlander 50mm f/1 Nokton Review

josh-himes wrote:
For what it’s worth, I decided that only the outer zone was focusing past infinity on my copy. The center is spot on at infinity, so I figure it’s part of the design and the outer zone focusing slightly past infinity is attributable to field curvature. That may be what you are seeing as well.

It’s absolutely a non issue for me, because wide open landscapes are a pretty rare use-case. By F2 at infinity, everything looks great across the frame on my copy. At any other focus distance, I have no complaints and am amazed at the performance wide...Show more →

Thanks for the feedback josh-himes.
I think my issue follows through center as well at infinity...even when stopped down. I will double check based on your feedback and reply once I am sure.

I really do love my lens as it is. I didn't buy it to shoot it at infinity or stopped down past F1 for that matter. Its all about its special look wide open, and the contrast and separation qualities at short to medium distances for my purposes. So it has already satisficed that desire. To me it is a specialist instrument which in the right hands will pay its owner back in spades.

However, when paying around $2k for a high performance instrument I cant help but scrutinize that extra 1-10% I am paying for. Things like infinity focus stop, RF coupling, construction, focus feel, sharpness on center, proper assembly, transmission corrections and centering are considerations on my mind.
The thought "compared to what" comes to mind here. It seems that phrase rings true for how most of these lens discussions go. My standard of comparison in this category is the 50mm Summilux ASPH when assessing corrections of a high performance fast 50mm lenses for people and mid distance centered objects. My experience beyond F1.4 is limited and so that is why I am reaching out to those with experience to offer up there thoughts...especially on sample variation expectations.
The 50mm F1 Nokton does not catch my ver 1 (2018) 50mm Summilux ASPH at F1.4 in any category until about F2-2.8 but then again that might be a realistic expectation of this design.

Nov 08, 2023 at 08:38 AM

BastianK
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p.31 #4 · p.31 #4 · Voigtlander 50mm f/1 Nokton Review

jshcrlsn wrote:
Thanks for the feedback josh-himes.
I think my issue follows through center as well at infinity...even when stopped down. I will double check based on your feedback and reply once I am sure.

I really do love my lens as it is. I didn't buy it to shoot it at infinity or stopped down past F1 for that matter. Its all about its special look wide open, and the contrast and separation qualities at short to medium distances for my purposes. So it has already satisficed that desire. To me it is a specialist instrument which in the right hands will pay...Show more →
At portrait distances (1.5 m = 5 ft) the two VM 50mm 1.0 I tried are both sharper off center than the one Leica 50mm 1.4 Asph I tried.
In the center the differences were negligible.

However, I never focus these lenses with the rangefinder.
The rangefinder is simply not accurate enough for lenses this fast to yield consistently good results,
especially at closer distances and even more so with focus and recompose when the subject is off center.

In your "centered dog" pictures I doubt the focus is in the right spot with the 50mm 1.0,
but it is very hard to tell from a subject like this, also because the depth of field is noticeably thinner at f/1.0.

Nov 08, 2023 at 08:48 AM

josh-himes
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p.31 #5 · p.31 #5 · Voigtlander 50mm f/1 Nokton Review

BastianK wrote:
At portrait distances (1.5 m = 5 ft) the two VM 50mm 1.0 I tried are both sharper off center than the one Leica 50mm 1.4 Asph I tried.

However, I never focus these lenses with the rangefinder.
The rangefinder is simply not accurate enough for lenses this fast to yield consistently good results,
especially at closer distances and even more so with focus and recompose when the subject is off center.

In your "centered dog" pictures I doubt the focus is in the right spot with the 50mm 1.0,
but it is very hard to tell from a subject like this.

Bastian is exactly right about the focus wide open. I found that mine doesn’t focus perfectly with the rangefinder at MFD until I stop down to f2. It is very hard to nail the focus unless you are using the EVF. However, when you do nail it, the lens is razor sharp at the point of focus, even if that is in the outer zone where most lenses are usually soft wide open.

Nov 08, 2023 at 09:03 AM

jshcrlsn
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p.31 #6 · p.31 #6 · Voigtlander 50mm f/1 Nokton Review

BastianK wrote:
At portrait distances (1.5 m = 5 ft) the two VM 50mm 1.0 I tried are both sharper off center than the one Leica 50mm 1.4 Asph I tried.
In the center the differences were negligible.

However, I never focus these lenses with the rangefinder.
The rangefinder is simply not accurate enough for lenses this fast to yield consistently good results,
especially at closer distances and even more so with focus and recompose when the subject is off center.

In your "centered dog" pictures I doubt the focus is in the right spot with the 50mm 1.0,
but it is very hard to...Show more →

Thanks for the feedback Bastian...that is helpful. Interesting you found the difference on center negligible! Was this at F1.4 for both?
I focused the dog shots with an EVF and red overlay focus peaking aid. I took several snaps and picked the best of the lot. I feel like there is enough subject depth to the area of focus (eyes) that you should be able to pick out the area of best focus somewhere on that face with the 50mm F1...but I cannot. I have also photographed some static rusted metal cylinders with both in the same light around 5ft with a similar result which is that my 50mm F1 does not catch my Lux (at f1.4) until F2 and beyond. That was what led me to test on the star chart at F1.4 for both lenses (tripod with EVF and focus peaking). To me the star chart at 200% shows the strength of the Lux. To be fair I think I won the lens lottery with my Lux...its a good one.

For those who care to engage I can post more samples of other stuff if this peaks your interest.

Nov 08, 2023 at 09:37 AM

jshcrlsn
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p.31 #7 · p.31 #7 · Voigtlander 50mm f/1 Nokton Review

Nov 08, 2023 at 09:41 AM

BastianK
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p.31 #8 · p.31 #8 · Voigtlander 50mm f/1 Nokton Review

jshcrlsn wrote:
Thanks for the feedback Bastian...that is helpful. Interesting you found the difference on center negligible! Was this at F1.4 for both?

I checked my pictures again. VM 50mm 1.0 vs Lux 50mm 1.4 in the center there is a small advantage for the Lux if you look at 100%.
That lens is really good with central sharpness, that is a fact.
For me that small difference in the center is negligible though,
because there are many different factors that have a much higher impact (e.g. shot to shot focus accuracy) than that.

However, off center the difference is much bigger and my subjects are rarely in the center. Like almost never.
And off center at f/1.4 I see the Lux as a bit of a dud considering its price and reputation.
(Same is true for the Leica 50mm 0.95 as well, good sharpness in the central ~10mm, outside of that, ugh...)

Nov 08, 2023 at 11:27 AM

philip_pj
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p.31 #9 · p.31 #9 · Voigtlander 50mm f/1 Nokton Review

'And off center at f/1.4 I see the Lux as a bit of a dud..'

It happens when your lens gives up one third of its centre performance by its mid-frame. The return at the wide edge bothers some people too. The 2023 close focusing lens is little different, stronger centres for fine detail with even more emphatic mid-frame fall-off. It loses about a half of its resolution now.

Summilux-M 50/1.4 2004-2023

Summilux-M 50/1.4 2023 release

Nov 08, 2023 at 03:50 PM

highdesertmesa
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p.31 #10 · p.31 #10 · Voigtlander 50mm f/1 Nokton Review

josh-himes wrote:
Bastian is exactly right about the focus wide open. I found that mine doesn’t focus perfectly with the rangefinder at MFD until I stop down to f2. It is very hard to nail the focus unless you are using the EVF. However, when you do nail it, the lens is razor sharp at the point of focus, even if that is in the outer zone where most lenses are usually soft wide open.

It should focus perfectly at f/1 and MFD. If you prefer it calibrated for f/2 at MFD, then ok, but otherwise I would try another copy (since it might not be technically calibrated for f/2 – f/2 might be covering for the error with increased DOF). I had two copies of the 50 f/1, both focused perfectly at f/1 and MFD on the M11 (one of them had issues at infinity).

Nov 08, 2023 at 05:26 PM

jshcrlsn
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p.31 #11 · p.31 #11 · Voigtlander 50mm f/1 Nokton Review

BastianK wrote:
I checked my pictures again. VM 50mm 1.0 vs Lux 50mm 1.4 in the center there is a small advantage for the Lux if you look at 100%.
That lens is really good with central sharpness, that is a fact.
For me that small difference in the center is negligible though,
because there are many different factors that have a much higher impact (e.g. shot to shot focus accuracy) than that.

However, off center the difference is much bigger and my subjects are rarely in the center. Like almost never.
And off center at f/1.4 I see the Lux as a bit of a...Show more →

Thank you for the additional time and data here Bastian...again helpful for comparison to my observations with my copy.

Nov 08, 2023 at 09:21 PM

jshcrlsn
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p.31 #12 · p.31 #12 · Voigtlander 50mm f/1 Nokton Review

highdesertmesa wrote:
It should focus perfectly at f/1 and MFD. If you prefer it calibrated for f/2 at MFD, then ok, but otherwise I would try another copy (since it might not be technically calibrated for f/2 – f/2 might be covering for the error with increased DOF). I had two copies of the 50 f/1, both focused perfectly at f/1 and MFD on the M11 (one of them had issues at infinity).

Thank you for weighing in Mesa and confirming you saw infinity stop issues as well with one of yours...helpful!

While the RF coupling on my copy is pretty spot on at F1 I did use EVF and focus aids for all my test shots posted. I did another test this afternoon for infinity focus and can confirm that on center and off center the lens focuses past infinity at F1 and never quite catches up with dof even at F5.6 - F8 unless I shift it just so slightly off of the infinity stop. I tested this by focusing on the horizon line of the open Gulf of Mexico.

Nov 08, 2023 at 09:26 PM

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p.31 #13 · p.31 #13 · Voigtlander 50mm f/1 Nokton Review

Ok for the love of Voigtlander and this design I want to post another round of testing I did against the 50mm Lux ASPH. I really want a good one for this lens specifically! Please weigh in.
Again, here I am focused on sharpness in the center. This lens literally draws you into its middle and so that is where I want my performance to be.

Here I took an image of a brick ledge at almost perfect middle of frame. I took this one in shadow with no directional light to eliminate any specular light or contrast issues. I took one at around MFD of the Nokon and one around 7ft for both lenses. As we are dealing with floating element designs in these lenses I feel its appropriate to post results from two distances.

Testing was with an M10-M at ISO 160 with no post processing whatsoever. Shot on a tripod, leveled in camera and focused using EVF with focus aid and full zoom and contrast aid.

50mm Nokton at F1/F1.4/F2 and 50mm Summilux ASPH at F1.4

reference at 3.5ft

50mm F1 Nokt at F1 (3.5ft)

50mm F1 Nokt at F1.4 (3.5ft)

50mm Lux ASPH at F1.4 (3.5ft)

50mm F1 Nokt at F2 (3.5ft)

Nov 08, 2023 at 09:40 PM

jshcrlsn
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p.31 #14 · p.31 #14 · Voigtlander 50mm f/1 Nokton Review

Set 2 at 7ft

reference (7ft)

50mm Nokt at F1 (7ft)

50mm Nokt at F1.4 (7ft)

50mm Lux ASPH f1.4 (7ft)

50mm Nokt at F2 (7ft)

Nov 08, 2023 at 09:44 PM

BrandonSi
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p.31 #15 · p.31 #15 · Voigtlander 50mm f/1 Nokton Review

Nice test! I actually just got my Nokt 1.0 (and have the 1.1 coming just to test it out). I've got a v5 Cron, and previously owned the Summilux 50 1.4 ASPH and Nokton 1.2 ASPH. I've shot with a rented Noctilux 0.95 but never owned it.

I *really* like the Nokton 1.0 on the M11. Base ISO of 64 helps quite a bit, and though large, it does feel very natural on the camera. I think by f/1.4 the Summilux ASPH has it beat by just a hair in sharpness / contrast, but it's very close. I think the 1.0 is a no-brainer for someone who is looking for more capabilities than the Summilux can offer, but doesn't want to spend the $ on the Noctilux, and who can live with the additional size.

The combination of the M11 + Nokton 1.0 is only 300g heavier than the Q3. Not too bad.

Nov 09, 2023 at 07:49 AM

BrandonSi
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p.31 #16 · p.31 #16 · Voigtlander 50mm f/1 Nokton Review

Got the 1.1 in. Definitely smaller in girth, but actually a hair taller than the 50 1.0. The 1.1 weights ~50g less.

Kind of surprised at the performance given everything I've read. The 1.0 ASPH is clearly sharper wide-open, but not by *that* much.. 1.1 does show more purple / green fringing, but again, not by a considerable margin.

Anyway, some random around the house snaps when I was testing them both. I need to get them outside (hopefully tomorrow), but I'm not sure the 1.0 is worth $1,000+ extra for my use (which is a faster backup lens to my Summicron 50).

I have them both 6-bit coded, the 1.0 = Noctilux 0.95, the 1.1 = Noctilux f/1 . Ignore the EXIF, all were wide open.

Dropbox to full resolution JPG's here - https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1hhl0eR7R4QyU6-F2vh25AY5Dt7n9JE02?usp=sharing

LEICA M11 Noctilux-M 1:1/50 lens 50mm f/1.0 1/180s 320 ISO 0.0 EV

LEICA M11 Noctilux-M 1:0.95/50 ASPH. lens 50mm f/1.0 1/180s 200 ISO 0.0 EV

LEICA M11 Noctilux-M 1:1/50 lens 50mm f/1.4 1/180s 800 ISO 0.0 EV

LEICA M11 Noctilux-M 1:0.95/50 ASPH. lens 50mm f/1.4 1/180s 800 ISO 0.0 EV

LEICA M11 Noctilux-M 1:1/50 lens 50mm f/1.0 1/180s 125 ISO 0.0 EV

LEICA M11 Noctilux-M 1:0.95/50 ASPH. lens 50mm f/1.0 1/180s 64 ISO 0.0 EV

Nov 09, 2023 at 07:21 PM

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p.31 #17 · p.31 #17 · Voigtlander 50mm f/1 Nokton Review

BrandonSi wrote:
Got the 1.1 in. Definitely smaller in girth, but actually a hair taller than the 50 1.0. The 1.1 weights ~50g less.
I have them both 6-bit coded, the 1.0 = Noctilux 0.95, the 1.1 = Noctilux f/1 . Ignore the EXIF, all were wide open.

It's a smart move to apply 6-bit coding to the CV 50/1.1 from the Noct f/1, as they produce similar results. I own both the CV 50/1.1 Nokton and the Leica 50/1 Noct, and the former is my preferred ultra-fast 50mm lens from Voigtlander when I don't want the bulk of the heavier Noct. Rendering-wise they are very similar, although the Voigtlander yields higher contrast and less vignetting.

Nov 09, 2023 at 10:20 PM

BrandonSi
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p.31 #18 · p.31 #18 · Voigtlander 50mm f/1 Nokton Review

Fred Miranda wrote:
It's a smart move to apply 6-bit coding to the CV 50/1.1 from the Noct f/1, as they produce similar results. I own both the CV 50/1.1 Nokton and the Leica 50/1 Noct, and the former is my preferred ultra-fast 50mm lens from Voigtlander when I don't want the bulk of the heavier Noct. Rendering-wise they are very similar, although the Voigtlander yields higher contrast and less vignetting.

I was surprised at the performance of the Nokton 50 1.1... judging from all the terrible reviews I was expecting a hot mess. It's not bad at all. It actually reminds me of some of the older pre-asph 35 Summiluxes shot wide-open. Decently sharp in the center, then a bit of a glow which bleeds into the OOF transition zone.

At this price point, i'm amazed this isn't one of those cult-ish lenses with a rabid following, like the Rokkor 58 1.2

Nov 09, 2023 at 10:38 PM

Fred Miranda
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p.31 #19 · p.31 #19 · Voigtlander 50mm f/1 Nokton Review

BrandonSi wrote:
I was surprised at the performance of the Nokton 50 1.1... judging from all the terrible reviews I was expecting a hot mess. It's not bad at all. It actually reminds me of some of the older pre-asph 35 Summiluxes shot wide-open. Decently sharp in the center, then a bit of a glow which bleeds into the OOF transition zone.

At this price point, i'm amazed this isn't one of those cult-ish lenses with a rabid following, like the Rokkor 58 1.2

I'm also amazed it didn't gather a cult following like other unique lenses often do. Perhaps it's because Cosina remade and enhanced the design of the Leica Noct lens, but many still prefer the 50/1 Noct for its unique low-contrast rendering. It's similar to comparing their CV 35/1.4 Nokton with the OG Leica 35/1.4 Lux pre-asph lens.

Nov 09, 2023 at 11:30 PM

nehemiahphoto
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p.31 #20 · p.31 #20 · Voigtlander 50mm f/1 Nokton Review

My copy arrived just this afternoon.

Nov 10, 2023 at 04:32 PM

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