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New Z Roadmap October 2021

  
 
swifty168
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · New Z Roadmap October 2021


Perhaps equally exciting is the roadmap update which I wasn’t expecting.

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Oct 28, 2021 at 10:39 AM
mawz
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · New Z Roadmap October 2021


That 26mm looks TINY.

Still no consumer or f4 telezoom.....Nikon needs both.

the 24DX should have been released in about 2006 in F mount. Nice Nikon finally figured out the need for it.



Oct 28, 2021 at 10:41 AM
swifty168
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · New Z Roadmap October 2021


Note the ‘short’ 400 and 800 S-line lenses.
PFs are coming to Z



Oct 28, 2021 at 10:43 AM
ilkka_nissila
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · New Z Roadmap October 2021


swifty168 wrote:
Note the ‘short’ 400 and 800 S-line lenses.
PFs are coming to Z



Yes, it seems these two are PF judging from the short length, while the 600 appears to be conventional.

The smaller 400mm could be an f/4, and the 800mm f/5.6.



Oct 28, 2021 at 11:20 AM
ilkka_nissila
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · New Z Roadmap October 2021


mawz wrote:
the 24DX should have been released in about 2006 in F mount. Nice Nikon finally figured out the need for it.


It's likely that they couldn't make a compact 24 mm DX for the F mount without severe performance compromise, while the Z mount allows high quality in a compact short focal length lens.



Oct 28, 2021 at 11:21 AM
cvrle59
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · New Z Roadmap October 2021


ilkka_nissila wrote:
Yes, it seems these two are PF judging from the short length, while the 600 appears to be conventional.

The smaller 400mm could be an f/4, and the 800mm f/5.6.


It's gonna take some time, but 400F4 PF is the one I could afford, I guess..



Oct 28, 2021 at 11:23 AM
mawz
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · New Z Roadmap October 2021


ilkka_nissila wrote:
It's likely that they couldn't make a compact 24 mm DX for the F mount without severe performance compromise, while the Z mount allows high quality in a compact short focal length lens.


I don't believe that for a second. Canon pulled it off (EF-S 24mm f2.8 STM), Pentax pulled it off (DA 21 Limited)....

Nikon simply didn't bother.



Oct 28, 2021 at 11:46 AM
EB-1
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · New Z Roadmap October 2021


The roadmap is still rather spare. That FTZ II had better work well.

EBH



Oct 28, 2021 at 12:57 PM
reggieb
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · New Z Roadmap October 2021


swifty168 wrote:
Note the ‘short’ 400 and 800 S-line lenses.
PFs are coming to Z


Those are the first Z mount lenses I'm properly excited about. The 400mm with the built in TC is awesome, but I doubt I'll ever own it. I have the 24-70 f/2.8 which is spectacular, but here's where I'll show that I'm spoiled, it's more of a workhorse than something that gets me "Excited." I also have the 20mm f/1.8 which gives me a relatively small, lightweight, compact kit for photographing my daughter in the house. Again, it's a great lens, but not exciting.

But for me, those small teles are properly exciting. The 300mm PF is the only lens I've ever pre-ordered, and I'll probably trade it in for that 400. I love hiking to places where it's impractical to bring a big prime, but where there's lots of good reason to have a tele. Giving me an extra 100mm will be awesome. I'd honestly considered the Canon 40mm DO and a teleconverter (EDIT: lens mount converter for the Z, not teleconverter).

Time will tell on the 800, but I'll have that 400 fo sho (assuming it's F/4, I'll be disappointed if it's 5.6). My 500mm f/4 might never leave the house once I have that.

Of course, don't tell Nikon, I was going to order the 100-400 until I saw that. With that on the roadmap, I'll just continue to adapt F-mount lenses for now.

Edited on Oct 29, 2021 at 05:47 AM · View previous versions



Oct 28, 2021 at 01:09 PM
swifty168
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · New Z Roadmap October 2021


I’m digging through my old patent thread and these seem relevant:

Patent number: 2020-086159
400mm f/4.7 PF
400mm f/4.2 PF

Patent number: 2018/180359
400mm f/4 PF
400mm f/5.8 PF
800mm f/8 PF

If I had to guess, I think the 400mm might be f/4.5 (rounded from f/4.7 actual) or f/4 (rounded from f/4.2 actual) judging by the silhouette.
But then again the silhouette might not be particularly accurate.
For the 800, there’s the one f/8 patent but maybe a f/7.1 might be possible?



Oct 28, 2021 at 07:10 PM
 


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arbitrage
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · New Z Roadmap October 2021


FWIW:

Canon 400 f/4 DOII retails for $6,899. And that is a price based on 2016.



Oct 28, 2021 at 08:28 PM
gpelpel
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · New Z Roadmap October 2021


I agree… If the lens silhouettes have the same scale as the existing lenses the 400mm looks like a f/4.5 and the 800m a f/7.1.
The 400mm silhouette is not wide enough for the lens to be f/4.
Their length clearly suggest they are PF lenses.

A portable 800mm f/7.1 would be heaven for birds in flight.



Oct 28, 2021 at 08:50 PM
swifty168
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · New Z Roadmap October 2021


There’s something about the 100mm diameter mark where prices seem to skyrocket when front elements become larger than that mark.
I dunno what the actual f-number of the Canon 400mm DO is but they are frequently rounded. If Nikon are rounding an f/4.2 to f/4 in specs, then that front element requirement goes down to minimum of 95mm.
But I’m guessing f/4.5 might be more likely though.



Oct 28, 2021 at 09:32 PM
Pixel Perfect
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · New Z Roadmap October 2021


If you measure the lenses on my screen the 200-600 is 3.1cm, the 800 4cm. The 200-600 looks without doubt to be and internal zooming f/6.3 that's ~ 95mm aperture, scale that by 4/3.1 and you get 123mm, 800 f/6.3 would have ~ 126mm aperture, 800 f/7.1 would have 112mm aperture. So the 800 looks to be f/6.3 too. The 400 and 200-600 are within 1mm, so close enough to say they are the same and that would indicate f/4.2 if 200-600 is f/6.3.

You can't measure this exactly from the lens barrel diameters of course, so just ballparks. Definitely the 400 and 800 would have to be PF for those lengths.



Oct 29, 2021 at 12:02 AM
MazeRunner
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · New Z Roadmap October 2021


Lenses I’d like for them to add:

105mm f/1.4S
58mm f/1.4S
200mm f/2.0S

So I can stop using the FTZ.



Oct 29, 2021 at 12:13 AM
freaklikeme
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · New Z Roadmap October 2021


Two 400's, a 600, and a compact 800, but no 300/2.8. It seems like the big three manufacturers have intentionally skipped this focal length when it used to be a critical lens. Has the pro market moved on from it now that FF sports cameras are the norm?


Oct 29, 2021 at 05:52 AM
Steve Spencer
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · New Z Roadmap October 2021


Pixel Perfect wrote:
If you measure the lenses on my screen the 200-600 is 3.1cm, the 800 4cm. The 200-600 looks without doubt to be and internal zooming f/6.3 that's ~ 95mm aperture, scale that by 4/3.1 and you get 123mm, 800 f/6.3 would have ~ 126mm aperture, 800 f/7.1 would have 112mm aperture. So the 800 looks to be f/6.3 too. The 400 and 200-600 are within 1mm, so close enough to say they are the same and that would indicate f/4.2 if 200-600 is f/6.3.

You can't measure this exactly from the lens barrel diameters of course, so just ballparks.
...Show more

As I pointed out in the other thread it is not clear that you can use the formula focal length divided by aperture to get the smallest size of the front element with PF lenses. That formula assumes a non-PF lens and PF lens might or might not follow it. As an example, Canon's 800 f/11 DO lens uses that formula has a smallest front element of 73mm, but that lens has a much larger diameter of 105mm. If you saw the silhouette of that lens and did the analysis you are doing, then you would assume it is an f/8 lens, which of course it is not and isn't even close to that.



Oct 29, 2021 at 06:17 AM
Ripolini
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · New Z Roadmap October 2021


swifty168 wrote:
I dunno what the actual f-number of the Canon 400mm DO is but they are frequently rounded. If Nikon are rounding an f/4.2 to f/4 in specs, then that front element requirement goes down to minimum of 95mm.
But I’m guessing f/4.5 might be more likely though.


Agree. Minolta made a good 400/4.5 Apo, weighing 1,9 kg (109x275 mm, 9 elements in 7 groups). A PF version could have same diameter. A f/4 should be larger (like the Tamron 400/4 LD, discontinued in 1995, thad had 112 mm filter size).



Oct 29, 2021 at 06:58 AM
bernardl
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · New Z Roadmap October 2021


MazeRunner wrote:
Lenses I’d like for them to add:

105mm f/1.4S
58mm f/1.4S
200mm f/2.0S

So I can stop using the FTZ.


The 50mm f1.2 S sounds like an excellent new gen 58mm f1.4 though.

Cheers,
Bernard




Oct 29, 2021 at 07:08 AM
ChrisMak
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p.1 #20 · p.1 #20 · New Z Roadmap October 2021


The 800mm is the lens that might break some barriers if it is indeed a PF lens. I don't really believe it will be a f5.6 lens though, but much more likely a f8 lens. That would still make it a much more desireable lens than the Canon 800mm f11 though. But it would not be able to replace other lenses, as f8 is really dark and good background separation is unlikely as well.
If it were a 800mm f5.6PF lens, I would almost certainly switch to the Z system instantly, and probably sell my dslr gear.

That will amost certainly not be the case, Nikon is looking at Sony and Canon closely, and probably thought that it would be good to beat Canon on its own turf: mainstream super telephoto lenses, but do it just that bit better. It is a S line lens after all. Still, the size of the front element might leave open the possibility that it is a lens with a less obvious maximum aperture, like f6.3 or f7.1.
F6.3 would still be tempting for sure. As I said, if it is actually f5.6PF, then I will pre-order as soon as announced.

Edited on Oct 29, 2021 at 07:36 AM · View previous versions



Oct 29, 2021 at 07:26 AM
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