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Official: Leica APO-Summicron-SL 28mm F2 ASPH lens ($5,195)

  
 
Alpha_Geist
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p.3 #1 · p.3 #1 · Official: Leica APO-Summicron-SL 28mm F2 ASPH lens ($5,195)


LBJ2 wrote:
From what I read, the SL2-S has the latest focus system, so am curious if that might make a difference or not.


I know I updated all three of my APO primes with the latest lens firmware as well. However, I recall that particular firmware update included some manual focus ring electronic override controls. There may or may not be other items addressed in that latest firmware though.

I last used the lens when I was doing some downtown exploring and ďstreetĒ shooting a few weeks ago...when the weather was nice and I had some time to myself. I donít remember any strange noises coming from either the camera or lens, but then again I wasnít looking for abnormalities. Iíll give it a listen tonight and report back.

Edit: typos

Edited on Feb 19, 2021 at 05:02 PM · View previous versions



Feb 19, 2021 at 04:52 PM
LBJ2
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p.3 #2 · p.3 #2 · Official: Leica APO-Summicron-SL 28mm F2 ASPH lens ($5,195)


zhangyue wrote:
Yes, I personally don't mind camera size like SL2 at all. If Leica introduce a CL like full frame, I'd welcome for that as well as 2nd body. There is hole in SL line I think but SL2 is not a problem IMO.

For camera like SL2, or for Z8/9, A1 matters, size is really not a concern IMHO if they want keep priority for ergo, ruggedness and reliability.

Again, If their cron have real aperture ring and focus ring, I don't mind get a few at asking as well. The thing is I don't trust Leica AF tech. If
...Show more

Have you had an opportunity to try and compare the latest AF in the SL2-S compared to the SL/2?



Feb 19, 2021 at 04:55 PM
freaklikeme
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p.3 #3 · p.3 #3 · Official: Leica APO-Summicron-SL 28mm F2 ASPH lens ($5,195)


I think what we're forgetting here is that there's Leica, and then there's everything else. You either like what they're offering so much that you don't consider anything else to be competition (which is how they market) or you make a competitive evaluation and buy something else.


Feb 19, 2021 at 05:17 PM
zhangyue
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p.3 #4 · p.3 #4 · Official: Leica APO-Summicron-SL 28mm F2 ASPH lens ($5,195)


LBJ2 wrote:
Have you had an opportunity to try and compare the latest AF in the SL2-S compared to the SL/2?


No, I don't have a plan for SL2-S. It makes less sense than SL2 which many think it doesnt make any sense already at least SL2 has one of best IQ if not the best IQ in FF.

However, I have to say if buy Leica SL, AFC has to be low on your priority anyway. My old z6 is still better than it miles away however it is adequate for my use most of times saving for capture my dog or kids running toward me. (I dont have native SL glasses experience but only sigma and panasonic zooms or primes )





Feb 19, 2021 at 06:17 PM
Alpha_Geist
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p.3 #5 · p.3 #5 · Official: Leica APO-Summicron-SL 28mm F2 ASPH lens ($5,195)


dog rocket wrote:
I took to an SL2 (previously Sony and Nikon mirrorless systems), not for the fabulous SL glass, but for much the same reasons I've been enjoying mirrorless in general for the last - what's it been(?) 7/8 years Sony? I have an embarrassing amount of old, fun and unique glass that I like to adapt. I have 2 Sigma lenses that AF but the rest are MF. Those are also my only two native mount lenses. I'm no pro... more of a gearhead. And I get a great deal of joy and amusement putting a lens I have no
...Show more

Like you, I moved from Nikon->Sony->Leica and have lots of older MF glass that I adapt to my SL2-S. Iím lucky to own some of the SL primes as I had a few buyers who helped make my transition that much easier. While the lenses are indeed larger and heavy, their image performance is fantastic! The size and weight doesnít really bother me as I was use to carrying the larger Nikon pro bodies (D3/D4s) around with the trinity lenses all over. As for the same results that can be had with a smaller form factor, I donít think you could eek out the same performance in a smaller body with AF. This is comparing the SL lenses with their M lenses. From my understanding, the SL primes best their M counterparts. I use to own the Leica 50 and 75 APO lenses, and while their size was great for their amazing performance, the SL primes do come out ahead optically. Even still, with the sheer engineering involved to achieve such performance in such a small package (Iím looking at you 50 APO) for M mount is mind blowing....and the $8k retail price speaks to that in some ways too. I thought about picking up the 50 APO SL prime (cheaper than the M mount 50 APO), but Iím more than ecstatic with the Sigma 45/2.8 i lens that I donít feel the need or the want for the SL 50 APO.



Feb 19, 2021 at 07:41 PM
rico
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p.3 #6 · p.3 #6 · Official: Leica APO-Summicron-SL 28mm F2 ASPH lens ($5,195)


System lenses with uniform size regardless of FL makes sense for cinematography because the rig is surrounded by apparatus like support rods, follow focus, matte boxes, etc. Switching lenses is not like a simple twist of the wrist like M shooters can do in the dark. For still photography, every lens being the same size is a pointless burden and not sustainable at the far ends of the FL rangeójust look at Batis. And superteles are right out.


Feb 19, 2021 at 08:14 PM
teiki arii
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p.3 #7 · p.3 #7 · Official: Leica APO-Summicron-SL 28mm F2 ASPH lens ($5,195)


I have been a Leica-R lenses' user for more than 20 years. I switched form Nikon to Leica lenses at that time (1996) because of their rendering and quality to use them with B&W rolls. I don't still grow tired of these gems for different reasons:

- their compact design and their low weight (except Modular design)
- their mechanical aperture ring that makes them universal with any FF mirrorless camera body of any brand for the day I want one
- their fabulous quality even on new digital sensors (>36Mp)
- their inimitable smoothing focus ring vs focus ring on new AF lenses

So, for sure Leica SL2 could be a must-have for my way of shooting (manual focus). The Leica SL lenses probably are fabulous, but I just can't afford it. Even if design of new digital era lenses of any brand is outstanding, it doesn't worth according to my criteria to switch.
Anyway, if I had the money, I would probably go for the Fujifilm GFX 100S if corpulence was not a criteria...
For the time being, and thanks to amazing constantly being renewed softwares (photoshop, DxO PhotoLab and his fabulous DeepPRIME, RawTherappe for PixelShift mode, Gigapixel AI & Sharpen AI used advisedly), I prefer keeping my Leica-R lenses...







Leica Apo-Summicron-R Asph 90/2, Canon EOS 6D. Bali, 2015.






Leica Apo-Summicron-R Asph 90/2, Canon EOS 6D. Bali, 2015.






Cathťdrale Saint Jean-Baptiste de Perpignan, l'immaculťe conception.
Leica Elmarit-R 28/2.8 E55, Pentax K-1 2016. Iso1600, 1/8s, f:3.4, hand held...






Gisant de Sanch, roi de Majorque.
Leica Elmarit-R 28/2.8 E55, Pentax K-1 2016. Iso1600, 1/15s, f:3.4, hand held...



Feb 20, 2021 at 02:55 AM
Alpha_Geist
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p.3 #8 · p.3 #8 · Official: Leica APO-Summicron-SL 28mm F2 ASPH lens ($5,195)


LBJ2 wrote:
@Alpha_Geist. Are you able to hear the same 35/2 autofocus as Jesse presents in his video with your new SL2-S SL 35/2 kit?


So I was able to bust out the 35 APO with the SL2-S and test for its AF sound. I hear the stepper motor moving very clearly, but it doesn't sound like sand or gravel. This is both in AFs and AFc modes. With AFc mode the stepper motor is constantly moving, even on a static object (as AFc nornally does), but it doesn't sound like loose gravel or a grinding sound. It's not very loud, but you can hear it. When I tested it, I was expecting something loud and "grindy", but the AF sound/motor didn't sound any different or alarming.

I watched the YT video of the gentlemen with his 35 APO and in the comments section he mentions in a reply:

"The noise and feel of the motors is noticeable but Iím in a quiet room and the iPhone is boosting the audio for the sound that is there. The noise is noticeable, but it is not going to be as loud as it appears in this video."

I was expecting the sound of the AF motor to be "worse" than what I recall hearing (or not hearing) when I was out shooting with it. It didn't bother me then. At least, I didn't notice it so it didn't concern me. I have a feeling that you can make any AF motor sound pretty jarring if you're recording it very close with a microphone in a quiet room and then boosting the sound. Just my 2 cents.

TDLR: I expected something worse after reading about this sandy/gravel-like sound, but when really listening to the sound the stepper motor made I asked myself "that's it?" Nothing seemed out of the normal.




Feb 20, 2021 at 05:34 AM
SlowDriver
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p.3 #9 · p.3 #9 · Official: Leica APO-Summicron-SL 28mm F2 ASPH lens ($5,195)


Alpha_Geist wrote:
TDLR: I expected something worse after reading about this sandy/gravel-like sound, but when really listening to the sound the stepper motor made I asked myself "that's it?" Nothing seemed out of the normal.

Same here on the (original) SL. The autofocus is definitely not silent but that being said it does not disturb me at all.



Feb 20, 2021 at 07:24 AM
LBJ2
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p.3 #10 · p.3 #10 · Official: Leica APO-Summicron-SL 28mm F2 ASPH lens ($5,195)


Alpha_Geist wrote:
So I was able to bust out the 35 APO with the SL2-S and test for its AF sound. I hear the stepper motor moving very clearly, but it doesn't sound like sand or gravel. This is both in AFs and AFc modes. With AFc mode the stepper motor is constantly moving, even on a static object (as AFc nornally does), but it doesn't sound like loose gravel or a grinding sound. It's not very loud, but you can hear it. When I tested it, I was expecting something loud and "grindy", but the AF sound/motor didn't sound any different
...Show more

Thanks for doing this test! It is interesting to note that you never noticed an AF sound when using under normal conditions until it was brought to your attention. With the Sony GM 85 and Sony/Zeiss 50 F1.4 You can hear and feel the AF the minute you focus either of these lenses with the GM 85 being the loudest which might eliminate both for some types of video work but otherwise IQ is excellent. Sony has since changed/ upgraded AF motor technology a couple of times on their more recent lenses.

I assume Leica and Panasonic are both using the same Stepper motors (?) and of course both applying the same DFD AF technology (?) so I think there may be more adjustments/movements while going through the focus process which might be more noticeable to some compared to other AF systems ( PDAF).



Feb 20, 2021 at 07:25 AM
 


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dog rocket
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p.3 #11 · p.3 #11 · Official: Leica APO-Summicron-SL 28mm F2 ASPH lens ($5,195)


freaklikeme wrote:
I think what we're forgetting here is that there's Leica, and then there's everything else. You either like what they're offering so much that you don't consider anything else to be competition (which is how they market) or you make a competitive evaluation and buy something else.


You forgot one...

Or (like me) you decide to get off the upgrade train and decide to settle down with one camera that you can grow old with (OLDER with in my case)

I got tired of upgrading Sony cameras every other year (and putting up with their crappy ergos and UI) and I can see that it wonít be too many more years until my income is my retirement account, so I waited until the tech and resolution got to the point that I could see myself happy with a camera for the rest of my shooting days and for me that tech and resolution hit a sweet spot in 2020. Add a camera that is well made to last a lifetime, a joy to use and behold, and Iím a happy camper.

Now that Sony has a $6K camera (loaded for bear for sure), does that swing the pendulum for any shooters? At what point does price become important enough to want to last you beyond the next best thing?




Feb 20, 2021 at 10:45 AM
Rob L
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p.3 #12 · p.3 #12 · Official: Leica APO-Summicron-SL 28mm F2 ASPH lens ($5,195)


Hear. Hear!
Not even the slightest bit of GAS when GM 12-24, 35 or A7C and A1 came out!! Only a little tiny bit for this SL 28 but don't need it because I have the 35!



Feb 20, 2021 at 02:20 PM
serhan_
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p.3 #13 · p.3 #13 · Official: Leica APO-Summicron-SL 28mm F2 ASPH lens ($5,195)


Dreams of Summertime with the Leica 28mm APO Summicron SL
by Jonathan Slack February 19th 2021
https://www.slack.co.uk/28-summicron-sl.html



Feb 20, 2021 at 04:04 PM
Arka
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p.3 #14 · p.3 #14 · Official: Leica APO-Summicron-SL 28mm F2 ASPH lens ($5,195)


joakim wrote:
Well all Leica SL Summicron lenses are of the same size so this is no surprise and I think this is roughly the size you get with AF lenses when optical excellence is the goal wether they are built by Leica or someone else.


Yeah, sure. I'll tell that to my Sony 24mm f/1.4 hitched up to my A7R4 - no optical excellence to be found there.

I still love my Leica M lenses, but the SL is a real head-scratcher for me. $5000 for what might be the heaviest 28mm f/2 on the market, hitched to a camera with mediocre AF and decent but hardly class leading technology. I'll pass, thanks.



Feb 22, 2021 at 09:19 PM
Arka
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p.3 #15 · p.3 #15 · Official: Leica APO-Summicron-SL 28mm F2 ASPH lens ($5,195)


zhangyue wrote:
Well, Leica donít know gfx100s at the time develop SL system.

I kind of agree the system may not for everyone. At least I personally havenít bought any SL glasses yet. However, I can clearly see the system is still attractive and niche for certain customers include some fashion pros. Maybe that is all Leica needed for their system. They donít need a broader appreciation as other brand or systems.



What does the system offer fashion pros that a medium format system that costs and weighs the same doesn't? What does it offer fashion pros that the cutting edge equipment from Canon or Sony doesn't? As hard as I've tried to understand the appeal of the SL (and I've used it on several shoots), I always come away confused. Adding to the confusion is the fact that flash manufacturers like Profoto always take forever to release compatible flash triggers, and often choose not to support Leica at all (probably because there aren't enough buyers for the SL system cameras to justify the cost). To each their own but the use cases seem exceptionally narrow to me, aside from "I really want to use a heavy-ass Leica camera."



Feb 22, 2021 at 09:34 PM
nehemiahphoto
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p.3 #16 · p.3 #16 · Official: Leica APO-Summicron-SL 28mm F2 ASPH lens ($5,195)


dog rocket wrote:
It's amazing how a brand gets slammed with anything they do. I had a Sony mirrorless with damn huge native glass (look at the GM series) and Sigma also has a boat anchor of a mirrorless lens (that I owned and sold to the tune of "she's too fat for me"). The Sony guys are lamenting how they have a gazillion 35mm choices but nobody brave enough to make a fabulous 28mm. Does anyone have any doubt this will be a fabulous 28mm?

To me, mirrorless has many other attributes going for it other than size and I dare
...Show more

The GM series is not damn huge. The GM 85 1.4 is the only oversized one.

The GM 24,35 and 135 are small for their class.

This is not a fabulous 28 if you consider it's size, it's an f2 and it's over 5k. If you don't care about size or price (this is really very few shooters), you'll probably be happy.

To me, the m-mount system remains vastly more interesting and specific. If I want modern big fast corrected glass, other systems offer something similar if not better for far cheaper than the SL system.

Edited on Feb 22, 2021 at 10:11 PM · View previous versions



Feb 22, 2021 at 09:38 PM
Arka
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p.3 #17 · p.3 #17 · Official: Leica APO-Summicron-SL 28mm F2 ASPH lens ($5,195)


dog rocket wrote:
It's amazing how a brand gets slammed with anything they do. I had a Sony mirrorless with damn huge native glass (look at the GM series) and Sigma also has a boat anchor of a mirrorless lens (that I owned and sold to the tune of "she's too fat for me"). The Sony guys are lamenting how they have a gazillion 35mm choices but nobody brave enough to make a fabulous 28mm. Does anyone have any doubt this will be a fabulous 28mm?

To me, mirrorless has many other attributes going for it other than size and I dare
...Show more

Many of the people "slamming" the SL (myself included) own Leica lenses and optics.

Clearly mirrorless has many attributes going for it "other than size." Indeed, it seems to me that just about every camera manufacturer except Sony seems to believe that size isn't much of an attribute at all. Most lens offerings from Nikon, Canon, and Panasonic mirrorless cameras are pretty big. Though none of them combine mediocre AF, lower light gathering capability, enormous weight, and exorbitant cost quite like the Leica SL. Leica through its SL system seems particularly committed to showing that mirrorless should not result in weight, cost, or technology improvements of any kind.

Leica thrives with its expensive niche systems when they have no competition and they offer a truly unique workflow and feel. The M is an example of this. But the SL makes the M system look cheap, and its other mirrorless competition look good! My M35 Summilux costs less than its SL counterpart, weighs less than half as much, and gathers twice as much light. Same between my M50 Summilux ASPH and the SL equivalent (though at least the SL version is just as bright as the M). It would take a hell of a lot of optical superiority and perfect AF to justify carrying around the extra burden. And at least in the latter department, Leica's AF is far behind anything competitors like Canon or Sony are offering.

But hey, perhaps the lightening of a wallet might help one bear the extra weight of an SL system.



Feb 22, 2021 at 09:51 PM
Alpha_Geist
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p.3 #18 · p.3 #18 · Official: Leica APO-Summicron-SL 28mm F2 ASPH lens ($5,195)


Personally, Iím not interested in the 28, as the 35mm FL is pretty much the widest Iíll ever shoot. Plus, if I ever need to shoot a bit wider than 35mm, then Iíll just adapt my ďnew old stockĒ 28/2.8 Ai-S and be done with it. It sure wonít compare (optically) against this 28 APO, but my lens cost me peanuts compared to the new 28 APO, and for not being a wide shooter to begin with...Iíll just save my money for something else, like a vacation once weíre safely out of this pandemic.

As someone who has had quite a handful of different camera bodies, Iím happy with what I have now. Sure, the SL2-S doesnít have the AF speed and capabilities of a Sony or my lenses donít have the light gathering ability of the f/1.4ís (or faster) out there, and the camera body and lenses will weigh more than the competition. It doesnít bother me because Iím happy with what I have. So with all the Leica love/hate, shoot with what makes you happy and if what you have doesnít make you happy, then find something that will!



Feb 22, 2021 at 10:39 PM
zhangyue
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p.3 #19 · p.3 #19 · Official: Leica APO-Summicron-SL 28mm F2 ASPH lens ($5,195)


Arka wrote:
What does the system offer fashion pros that a medium format system that costs and weighs the same doesn't? What does it offer fashion pros that the cutting edge equipment from Canon or Sony doesn't? As hard as I've tried to understand the appeal of the SL (and I've used it on several shoots), I always come away confused. Adding to the confusion is the fact that flash manufacturers like Profoto always take forever to release compatible flash triggers, and often choose not to support Leica at all (probably because there aren't enough buyers for the SL system cameras to
...Show more

I don't know, I regularly browse Leica S magazine and saw many fashion pros used it in past few years. A set of APO AF Leica glasses certainly won't cheap, no deny size is a negative but really nothing out of line at 700g a piece. We don't have a APO lens set like this before. The plan happen a few years back. I agree it seems in just a few years, more and more great performer show up make them less convincing. But still, Leica is competing at different market, you can't really judge them traditionally. I for one don't mind them if they are at $3000 a piece than $5000. It just doesn't meet my certain requirement so that I haven't consider them.

SL2 is actually the most enjoyable MILC camera I ever used, bar none. The AF is fast and accurate, even not the top, it really meets my need. IBIS is better than any Nikon and Sony I ever used. Then IQ and ergo are just top top IMHO. High resolution mode is really useable for landscape. M and S alone with AF L glasses support are all top notch as good as you can expect. Everyone is different, that is why you guys brought A1/A9/A7Rx really doesn't do anything much for me personally. I know R5 and Z7x are both top notch as well but automated stuff just doesn't feel as enjoyable for me as I don't do bird or sports shooting. I just enjoy SL2 a lot more. For user like me within Leica ecosystem, SL line actually is a bargain at 5~6K.

I am subjective on gear I bought but I am also quite objective on how others think about Leica. So, I don't mind criticizing them. As long as there are people like me can appreciate certain thing Leica offer, they will continue deliver. Until, it shows that really no more enough customers to support their business model, they will fail. Market is always fair. Peoples' opinion are not.

We all soon find out. Who knows, what will happen in the future. I have a feeling that future cameras are become more and more capable like R5 and A1, it nevertheless makes people less care about tech spec of camera. Ultimately, enjoy using it seems more important, at least for me.




Feb 23, 2021 at 01:19 AM
rico
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p.3 #20 · p.3 #20 · Official: Leica APO-Summicron-SL 28mm F2 ASPH lens ($5,195)


Like most others in this thread I'm a Leica fan and have many $1K's sunk into the brand. The SL, however, makes no sense at all to me as a product line. See postings above mine for numerous good reasons. This new 'cron-SL 28 is competing with a host of top-grade glass in this FL from many vendorsóincluding Leica itself! I own the Elmarit-M ASPH, for example. If speed is an issue then I switch over to the Nikkor 28/1.4E which is a magnificent optic with quite silent AF. I believe the Otus is strongly recommended if one has a few grand in the budget. If Leica mystique is the goal then the purist purchase is the Summaron.


Feb 23, 2021 at 01:20 AM
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