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Archive 2020 · Sony RX1/RX1R worth it (used) in 2020?

  
 
AdaptedLenses
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p.2 #1 · p.2 #1 · Sony RX1/RX1R worth it (used) in 2020?


https://www.photonstophotos.net/Charts/PDR.htm#Sony%20DSC-RX1,Sony%20DSC-RX1RM2

Here's another link to Bill's measured values. IIRC, I did at least one sample of the RX1 for him and we discussed some after. He was surprised o find that the RX1 has a sensor response closer to the A7R than the A7 despite the assumption that it was based on the older A7 sensor. Similar to A7R vs A7RII, base DR isn't really an improvement, though certainly higher ISO and Dual Gain are big differences.

I've long felt the older sensor had better contrast and richer colors, but use the RII sensors now for other improvements.



Apr 14, 2020 at 01:21 PM
Fred Miranda
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p.2 #2 · p.2 #2 · Sony RX1/RX1R worth it (used) in 2020?


Graphs and DR tests are useful but there is sensor variation to keep in mind as well. What I saw with the two cameras I tested (RX1R vs RX1R II), DR was pretty close at base ISO but there was slight advantage to the RX1R II.


edit: Oh, you compared the RX1R, not RX1. The RX1R is the worst of the group easily.
edit 2: Now I see, you're talking about the RX1R versus the RX1R2, and I am talking about the RX1 original, which does even better DR wise than the RX1r2. This makes sense now.


Do you really think the RX1R is worse than the RX1 in terms of DR as a test shows? Perhaps there were other variances that gave that result. I mean, they basically use the same sensor! (minus the AA filter)

Let's not get too caught up on this. Both great cameras thanks to the amazing Sonnar 35/2!



Apr 14, 2020 at 01:31 PM
nehemiahphoto
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p.2 #3 · p.2 #3 · Sony RX1/RX1R worth it (used) in 2020?


Fred Miranda wrote:
Graphs and DR tests are useful but there is sensor variation to keep in mind as well. What I saw with the two cameras I tested (RX1R vs RX1R II), DR was pretty close at base ISO but there was slight advantage to the RX1R II.


Do you really think the RX1R is worse than the RX1 in terms of DR as a test shows? Perhaps there were other variances that gave that result. I mean, they basically use the same sensor! (minus the AA filter)

Let's not get too caught up on this. Both great cameras thanks to the
...Show more

It's not a big deal to me either--I just noticed it was worse when I shot it, just when I read your initial post my experience didn't line up, that's all. I did find the RX1R worse, but not in some huge way. Not looking to argue. I also don't see much difference between the RX1 versus RX1R2's as base ISO I've owned. And yes, the 35 Sonnar is king, and that's what makes/breaks the RX1x line, not relatively minor differences in DR



Apr 14, 2020 at 01:46 PM
KarmaKramer
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p.2 #4 · p.2 #4 · Sony RX1/RX1R worth it (used) in 2020?


You’re inferring I meant unreliable,I didn’t. I’ve read the AF is slow. Slow,to me, is iffy

AdaptedLenses wrote:
Autofocus is fine and accurate, just slow. Iffy implies unreliable which is unfair. Manual focus is fair, but only an RX1 issue. RX1R and RX1RII do not seem to have that problem.





Apr 14, 2020 at 01:47 PM
Fred Miranda
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p.2 #5 · p.2 #5 · Sony RX1/RX1R worth it (used) in 2020?


nehemiahphoto wrote:
It's not a big deal to me either--I just noticed it was worse when I shot it, just when I read your initial post my experience didn't line up, that's all. I did find the RX1R worse, but not in some huge way. Not looking to argue. I also don't see much difference between the RX1 versus RX1R2's as base ISO I've owned. And yes, the 35 Sonnar is king, and that's what makes/breaks the RX1x line, not relatively minor differences in DR


The question is: Will Sony ever release a 35/2 lens for the A7R series with similar IQ and rendering? They did a great job with the 24/1.4 GM, so it's not impossible.



Apr 14, 2020 at 01:49 PM
nehemiahphoto
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p.2 #6 · p.2 #6 · Sony RX1/RX1R worth it (used) in 2020?


AdaptedLenses wrote:
https://www.photonstophotos.net/Charts/PDR.htm#Sony%20DSC-RX1,Sony%20DSC-RX1RM2

Here's another link to Bill's measured values. IIRC, I did at least one sample of the RX1 for him and we discussed some after. He was surprised o find that the RX1 has a sensor response closer to the A7R than the A7 despite the assumption that it was based on the older A7 sensor. Similar to A7R vs A7RII, base DR isn't really an improvement, though certainly higher ISO and Dual Gain are big differences.

I've long felt the older sensor had better contrast and richer colors, but use the RII sensors now for other improvements.


Interesting, thanks for the share. That confirms what we've been saying--the dual gain is really where you'll feel the difference.

I've seen a lot of people say they prefer the images from the RX1, and do think the sensor has a different signature. Images feel punchier with more contrast to my eyes and a different color palate, though we can also mess around with stuff in post.

I feel like RX1R2 sensor has deeper color and is more tonally nuanced and images have a little more pop or 3D, but I think that's more on account of the 42 vs 24 MP and effectively no AA Filter.

This whole discussion underscores what a bummer it is we don't have an RX1R3 yet.

Edited on Apr 14, 2020 at 02:02 PM · View previous versions



Apr 14, 2020 at 01:52 PM
nehemiahphoto
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p.2 #7 · p.2 #7 · Sony RX1/RX1R worth it (used) in 2020?


Fred Miranda wrote:
The question is: Will Sony ever release a 35/2 lens for the A7R series with similar IQ and rendering? They did a great job with the 24/1.4 GM, so it's not impossible.


Yes please. Or maybe they scale up the RX1 Sonnar to a 44x33 sensor fixed lens MF camera. No real competition there either right now, with the Q or their own FF options.



Apr 14, 2020 at 01:58 PM
Fred Miranda
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p.2 #8 · p.2 #8 · Sony RX1/RX1R worth it (used) in 2020?


Anyone using the Voigtlander 35mm (or Zeiss) optical viewfinder on the RX1 series? I know EVF is available for all bodies but sometimes, Wide AF (or Eye AF) + optical viewfinder would do a trick for a more natural (less electronic) framing.


Apr 14, 2020 at 02:38 PM
AdaptedLenses
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p.2 #9 · p.2 #9 · Sony RX1/RX1R worth it (used) in 2020?


I'm of the opinion it has to do with BSI architecture. I instantly notice the same if/when I use an A7RII or an A7II, and I think your assessment is a good one.

Interestingly, I used Nikon Z for a while, the Z6 edits very similarly as well (as expected) but the Z7 feels more like the A7II. I guess that goes against my argument of a BSI issue... but anyway...

nehemiahphoto wrote:
Interesting, thanks for the share. That confirms what we've been saying--the dual gain is really where you'll feel the difference.

I've seen a lot of people say they prefer the images from the RX1, and do think the sensor has a different signature. Images feel punchier with more contrast to my eyes and a different color palate, though we can also mess around with stuff in post.

I feel like RX1R2 sensor has deeper color and is more tonally nuanced and images have a little more pop or 3D, but I think that's more on account of the 42 vs
...Show more




Apr 14, 2020 at 03:18 PM
serhan_
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p.2 #10 · p.2 #10 · Sony RX1/RX1R worth it (used) in 2020?


I used the Olympus vf-1 (m4:3 34mm equiv) with RX1, but still I bought the electronic evf for the RX1... VF-1 was cheap. Ebay still has it for $53. I covered with black electric tape. I have not tried with RX1R II...
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/631822-REG/Olympus_260052_VF_1_Viewfinder_f_17mm.html

I tried Ricoh GV-2 (mini) for GR and the older Leica 50mm vf for Sigma FP, but they were too small/short to see the lines, since I wear glasses. I didn't want to big/heavy vf on a small camera also... Voigtlander VF might give a better eye relief...

Fred Miranda wrote:
Anyone using the Voigtlander 35mm (or Zeiss) optical viewfinder on the RX1 series? I know EVF is available for all bodies but sometimes, Wide AF (or Eye AF) + optical viewfinder would do a trick for a more natural (less electronic) framing.





Apr 14, 2020 at 03:57 PM
AdaptedLenses
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p.2 #11 · p.2 #11 · Sony RX1/RX1R worth it (used) in 2020?


No disagreement there, that is 100% accurate. It’s CDAF only. Just wanted to clarify for the folks at home.

Which is... everyone?

KarmaKramer wrote:
You’re inferring I meant unreliable,I didn’t. I’ve read the AF is slow. Slow,to me, is iffy





Apr 14, 2020 at 04:37 PM
derKoekje
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p.2 #12 · p.2 #12 · Sony RX1/RX1R worth it (used) in 2020?


AdaptedLenses wrote:
Off topic but can the GRIII send RAWs to your phone (Apple or Android?)



No idea about Android but iPhone yup it can send RAWs no problem.



Apr 15, 2020 at 05:59 AM
NickD81
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p.2 #13 · p.2 #13 · Sony RX1/RX1R worth it (used) in 2020?


So after reading the responses and looking at all the fantastic photos posted in the images thread I'm on the lookout for a used RX1 in good condition. What sort of price should I be looking to pay for one in good condition? If I find one for a good price and don't like it then hopefully won't make too much of a loss if I sell it


Apr 18, 2020 at 10:30 AM
grahamgibson
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p.2 #14 · p.2 #14 · Sony RX1/RX1R worth it (used) in 2020?


A couple considerations if you're looking at the older RX1--that model has been known to have the manual focus motor fail after a time. Certainly something to be aware of in an 8 year old used camera. The RX1r and II don't suffer this issue as far as I'm aware.

Sensor dust is another thing to check in the older RX1 or RX1r, since it will eventually creep into the body, an older camera would be more prone to this. (Worth a check on any used fixed lens camera I suppose)

I've wanted one of these cameras for a loooong time, and weighed the differences of the different models. I've had the A7 and now A7rII, which are pretty close to the AF capabilities of the RX1 vs RX1rII. I was never satisfied with the A7's AF, but the A7rII has stayed with me for years now. Very happy. Considering that and the other RX1rII upgrades, I've personally decided that's the one to get IF I ever decide to spend the money. For now, I get by with my A7rII and CV40, but maybe one day I'll come across a deal that's too good to pass up 😁



Apr 18, 2020 at 10:49 AM
NickD81
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p.2 #15 · p.2 #15 · Sony RX1/RX1R worth it (used) in 2020?


Thanks, some good points. I've seen a few for sale on eBay where the manual focus no longer works. Also one with a couple of dust spots visible from F8 to F22. Just out of interest is it possible to DIY clean the sensor or is that a bit risky? I have dust spots on my Ricoh GRII, seems to be a common issue on fixed lens cameras.
I might just save up and wait for the used price of the RX1RII to come down



Apr 18, 2020 at 11:03 AM
ggweci
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p.2 #16 · p.2 #16 · Sony RX1/RX1R worth it (used) in 2020?




NickD81 wrote:
So after reading the responses and looking at all the fantastic photos posted in the images thread I'm on the lookout for a used RX1 in good condition. What sort of price should I be looking to pay for one in good condition? If I find one for a good price and don't like it then hopefully won't make too much of a loss if I sell it


Looks like there’s one available in the For Sale forum. Original version and pricing seems decent. I have only really shopped Mk2 prices. The one for sale also includes a grip and extra batteries (which you will definitely need!)

The lens and IQ on these cameras is stunning. The AF on the mk2 is definitely much better, but I have tried the mk1 and it was adequate outside of continuous tracking.



Apr 18, 2020 at 11:08 AM
Fred Miranda
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p.2 #17 · p.2 #17 · Sony RX1/RX1R worth it (used) in 2020?


NickD81 wrote:
So after reading the responses and looking at all the fantastic photos posted in the images thread I'm on the lookout for a used RX1 in good condition. What sort of price should I be looking to pay for one in good condition? If I find one for a good price and don't like it then hopefully won't make too much of a loss if I sell it


If you find one for ~$750, you should be good.



Apr 23, 2020 at 11:16 AM
NickD81
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p.2 #18 · p.2 #18 · Sony RX1/RX1R worth it (used) in 2020?


I found a barely used RX1R on eBay for £650 (about $800) but it's a bit more than I'm willing to pay. I might wait to see if I can get an RX1 as they tend to be slightly cheaper.


Apr 23, 2020 at 11:20 AM
AdaptedLenses
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p.2 #19 · p.2 #19 · Sony RX1/RX1R worth it (used) in 2020?


NickD81 wrote:
I found a barely used RX1R on eBay for £650 (about $800) but it's a bit more than I'm willing to pay. I might wait to see if I can get an RX1 as they tend to be slightly cheaper.


Good price on a RX1R though... remember it'll also keep resale value a bit better... always a trade off.



Apr 23, 2020 at 01:49 PM
gordec
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p.2 #20 · p.2 #20 · Sony RX1/RX1R worth it (used) in 2020?


RX1RII will hold value well as long as Sony doesn't release an update. This is unlikely given how things look. There is really no competition at $1800--$1900 used market for full frame, compact fixed lens camera. The Q MK1 is the only other option but with only half the MP count.

I know you can't really put the RX1RII in your pocket like RX100, but when you bring it out, it doesn't scream camera douche to other people as much as a7/a9 with any lens attached to it. Part of the reason I take it everywhere.



Apr 23, 2020 at 02:00 PM
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