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Archive 2020 · Cost Factors?

  
 
batchelor22
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · Cost Factors?


Tons of good information here and lots on other sites about the pros and cons of one brand over another.

I don’t see as much discussion around cost factors.

Recently decided to move to M4/3 and ready a lot about the characteristics of the Olympus vs Panasonic systems.

Ultimately the Panasonic system with similar lenses during the Holiday sales was MUCH cheaper than the similar Olympus set up.

Picked up my G9, w 12-35 2.8 and 35-100 2.8 for $1950 USD, all new items.

So curious where brand loyalty/preference versus value comes in.

I have used Nikon, Canon, Sony and Fuji in past and found pros and cons with all.



Jan 12, 2020 at 02:41 PM
bobbytan
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · Cost Factors?


That just about sums it up! There is no bad camera brand or system today. They all have their strengths and peculiarities. You should just choose the system that you are most comfortable with. It’s hard to beat the Sony A7R IV for resolution and the A9 for AF but if you are not overly obsessed with IQ or AF, the other brands/systems have A LOT to offer, price notwithstanding.

batchelor22 wrote:
I have used Nikon, Canon, Sony and Fuji in past and found pros and cons with all.




Jan 12, 2020 at 03:11 PM
Imagemaster
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · Cost Factors?


All I know is that the best gear is the gear that I am using at the moment.

And you made a big mistake buying Panasonic gear instead of Olympus.

You get what you pay for. If you are lucky.

Grass is still green here and above freezing. Not the same up there, eh?



Jan 12, 2020 at 04:33 PM
batchelor22
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · Cost Factors?


Definitely not green and definitely not above freezing today. 🤬

There are many who believe the equipment and its relative cost are what determines photo quality, I know you are not one of those. 😏

Based on the changes I see many making, the BEST equipment must change almost weekly! 😂😂



Jan 12, 2020 at 04:44 PM
galenapass
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · Cost Factors?


I bought into Olympus when they had an edge on IBIS years ago...and then just stayed with Olympus mostly due to inertia. I recently bought a G9 for my father. I tested it out a little before shipping it off to him. Great little camera with good ergos. I would not hesitate to buy one if I was just starting to build my system. Many people here have noted that the G9 menus are much better than Oly, but I am used to the insane number of options in Oly menus.
I think you don't see to many discussions on Olympus vs. Panasonic because most people probably feel like I do and that is both systems are good and offer similar capabilities. I also like the fact that when Panasonic/Leica (for example) come out with a new lens, that's a win for everyone using m43, regardless of the camera used. Honestly, I never think about Olympus and Panasonic brand loyalty - I just buy what makes sense for my needs or if I am too lazy to change that plays a factor too. Cost for each system varies by time, location, availability and new vs. used.

Edited on Jan 12, 2020 at 05:20 PM · View previous versions



Jan 12, 2020 at 04:45 PM
johnvanr
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · Cost Factors?


Same here, I bought Olympus when it was just ahead of Panasonic with its top cameras. I rented Panasonic cameras a few times and they didn’t feel as good to me as my Olympus gear (this was quite a while back, so saying nothing about current gear).

Lens-wise I have both and have sold off lenses of either brand to replace them with what I considered better options of the other brand, for example I sold my Panasonic 42.5mm f/1.2 for the Olympus 45mm f/1.2 but replaced both my Olympus 9-18mm and the 7-14mm with the Panasonic 8-18mm. And I have the first generation Panasonic 35-100mm for travel next to the Olympus 40-150mm for regular use.

I’m not really price conscious, until we’re talking switching the whole kit to another format. I couldn’t afford the kind of kit I have in MFT in Sony FF, for example.



Jan 12, 2020 at 05:18 PM
Wilbus
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · Cost Factors?


When it comes to photography I think pricing in many ways now a days weigh more than brand loyalty. What weights even more seems to be the latest and greatest technology in the cameras though.

People used to be much more brand loyal if I've understood it right. Nikon was Nikon, Canon was Canon and then there were some other small players who had their followers. Lately Sony has taken a huge chunk from Mostly Nikon and Canon, though not based on price I am quite sure but more on the fact the mirrorless indeed does turn out to be the big part of the future (I'm guessing one maybe two generations of DSLR's left? unless they can make a hybrid that shoots just as well without the mirror as with and offers a great EVF and great OVF).

I am not loyal to a brand either though I have stayed with m43 since 2012 now. Before that I used Nikon from 2006 to 2012 so that's 6 years and two cameras + some lenses. I am much more invested in m43 than I ever was Nikon but that's also much because I can (better job, I'm no longer in my early 20's with all the expenses and different lifestyle that means) but also because I've decided to stay with m43 as long as I "can".

While I often lust of some other brands better tracking AF or something else, I also realize I would miss too much from m43 that weights heavier. Size, weight, lenses (with all that comes with the lenses quality, sharpness, size, weight etc). I also realize that it's not my gear limiting me, it's my self and as such I have no reason to by either so called full frame camera or a medium format (not that I could afford it but still).

I also bought the Panasonic G9 (just before the summer of 2019) and love it. In my opinion it's superior to the E-M1 Mk II and I have far more keepers in terms of perfect and sharp AF. Also, the menus are indeed much better but that's not because there are fewer items in the menu compared to Olympus but simply because the UI is that much better. As far as customization goes you can customize the G9 more than the EM1.2 for example (you can set almost any dial or button to almost any function while Olympus have limited the type of functions you can choose much more).

I think you made a great choice on the G9 and the lenses!

/Rasmus



Jan 13, 2020 at 02:19 AM
WanderNWonder
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · Cost Factors?


Panasonic definitely offers more bang for the buck; also many of their lenses have OIS, while only 2 of Oly's popular lenses have OIS. The G9 is the only camera I could not evaluate (due to idiotic regional sales restrictions by Panasonic), and hence not my final choice after many tests, because they won't even service it if it goes bad.

Ironically, I started down the m43 research with the firm resolve to get the G9 + PL 100-400 as a companion for FF. After running through the tests, I am now considering a dual-m43 setup, and planning to use the FF only for wildlife

The recent trend of Pana and Oly to create brand-specific features is unfortunate. Oly has some restrictions that seem illogical (restricting Pro-capture L to Oly m43 lenses). Maybe they have a reason for it. Pana's DFD restriction seems logical that they engineered their camera to benefit their lenses.

The cost of the setup depends on the lens choices. Pana does have some really expensive lenses too, like the 50-200. On the economical side, Olympus has the 14-150 which gives weather sealing. So overall there's a lot of good stuff to choose from from both vendors.



Jan 13, 2020 at 06:52 AM
batchelor22
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · Cost Factors?


Thanks for all of the feedback and information. I would have been content and found a way for either system to work, I believe. Ultimately, the similar Panasonic body and lenses became $2K CDN less than the similar Olympus system. If something was truly compelling with Olympus, I may have bit the bullet but they seem far more similiar than distinct to me. Time will tell.


Jan 13, 2020 at 09:24 AM
Robin Smith
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · Cost Factors?


I chose Olympus for the same reason others did: IBIS and there was no G9. I don't really think that one is much cheaper than the other because the lens lines are not exactly aligned. I generally prefer the Oly lenses as the PROs are particularly well constructed and they have no distracting aperture rings. Never sure why some Pany lenses have them and some don't. If it a big deal for video, why don't they all have them? But having said this I would certainly buy a Pany lens, as we are really spoilt for choice in MFT land. I have the 8-18mm over the 7-14mm, for example.


Jan 13, 2020 at 11:55 AM
AmbientMike
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · Cost Factors?


It seems like people like the more expensive stuff on here. It is rather annoying. For price/performance it is hard to beat the aps dslrs, I shoot Canon but I suppose Nikon is probably pretty good, too.

I wore out my panasonic GH1, pretty much. Really liked it. Wouldn't mind upgrading at some point. I never bought any native lenses though. If you are really into price performance, you should look into adapting alts. One of my fav 70-210's cost like $7 or something? Plus shipping (I think I was ordering something else anyway) and adapters I already had. Look out for focus shift, but generally stop down metering, focusing anyway



Jan 13, 2020 at 11:58 AM
Robin Smith
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · Cost Factors?


True, but adapting MF lenses means no AF or EXIF, and sometimes strange exposures and impaired auto functions. There are not many APS-only lenses and most are FF sized which means they are large on most MFT bodies plus you need an adapter. But there is little arguing about the cost. Non "pro" MFT lenses can be very good, but they tend to be a bit slow which can be more significant with the smaller format.


Jan 13, 2020 at 06:06 PM
bobbytan
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · Cost Factors?


Also most of us here are hobbyists so we treat our gear more like toys than tools. And as long as one can afford it there is nothing wrong in wanting good toys to play with. Some of us are not even very good photographers but we gotta have the best of the best! Nothing wrong with that I guess!

Robin Smith wrote:
True, but adapting MF lenses means no AF or EXIF, and sometimes strange exposures and impaired auto functions. There are not many APS-only lenses and most are FF sized which means they are large on most MFT bodies plus you need an adapter. But there is little arguing about the cost. Non "pro" MFT lenses can be very good, but they tend to be a bit slow which can be more significant with the smaller format.





Jan 13, 2020 at 07:20 PM
Imagemaster
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · Cost Factors?


AmbientMike wrote:
It seems like people like the more expensive stuff on here. It is rather annoying. For price/performance it is hard to beat the aps dslrs, I shoot Canon but I suppose Nikon is probably pretty good, too.


Why does it annoy you how much others spend on gear? Different people want different features that may not be available on any Canon, Nikon, or other cameras.

e.g. silent shutter, Pro Capture, High Res Mode, etc., etc. Name an APS dslr that has all those features.

You buy what you want and can afford. Nothing wrong with that.



Jan 13, 2020 at 08:33 PM
AmbientMike
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · Cost Factors?


Imagemaster wrote:
Why does it annoy you how much others spend on gear? Different people want different features that may not be available on any Canon, Nikon, or other cameras.

e.g. silent shutter, Pro Capture, High Res Mode, etc., etc. Name an APS dslr that has all those features.

You buy what you want and can afford. Nothing wrong with that.


People are allowed to buy it, and I'm allowed to be annoyed by it. It's just such a focus, people sometimes (often?) seem to think they can't get great photos if they didn't spend a lot of money.




Jan 13, 2020 at 08:52 PM
Imagemaster
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · Cost Factors?


AmbientMike wrote:
People are allowed to buy it, and I'm allowed to be annoyed by it. It's just such a focus, people sometimes (often?) seem to think they can't get great photos if they didn't spend a lot of money.



Sure you can get annoyed by it. I see lots of people with the latest and/or most expensive gear taking worse photos than people with the oldest and/or cheapest gear. So what? Does not annoy me in the least.



Jan 13, 2020 at 10:31 PM
batchelor22
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · Cost Factors?


Imagemaster wrote:
Sure you can get annoyed by it. I see lots of people with the latest and/or most expensive gear taking worse photos than people with the oldest and/or cheapest gear. So what? Does not annoy me in the least.


With the results you get, I wouldn’t be annoyed in the least either.




Jan 13, 2020 at 10:34 PM
Robin Smith
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · Cost Factors?


Most of us here are a bunch of primadonnas when it comes to lenses: fast, bokeh, critical sharpness, and my pet aversion,"rendering". So feel completely free to be annoyed. It often does seem to have only a tangential impact on the actual photographic result. However, for some kinds of wildlife and sports photography, for example, equipment does seem to matter more.


Jan 14, 2020 at 10:08 AM
Imagemaster
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · Cost Factors?


batchelor22 wrote:
With the results you get, I wouldn’t be annoyed in the least either.


Thanks for the thumbs up.

But why are you sending your freezing weather and white stuff down to us living in balmy Parksville?



Jan 14, 2020 at 10:33 AM
bobbytan
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p.1 #20 · p.1 #20 · Cost Factors?


Let me try and put this in perspective. It is not that people think they cannot get great photos if they didn’t spend a lot of money on equipment. Most well-heeled “photographers” lacking in experience or skillsets know (quite rightly I might add) that the more expensive gear will help make up for their lack of skills - and it does - to a certain point. It will certainly do nothing for their creative skills (or lack of) but it can help them on the technical side.

For sure the more expensive professional glass is better than a cheapo consumer or kit lens. And, for sure, you will have a much higher keeper rate if you shot with a Sony A9 vs an E-M1 II, etc. So yeah, expensive gear will help you along but it does not mean that you cannot take great pictures with a 20-year-old camera. A highly skilled photographer wins every time regardless of gear used. That’s a given.

AmbientMike wrote:
People are allowed to buy it, and I'm allowed to be annoyed by it. It's just such a focus, people sometimes (often?) seem to think they can't get great photos if they didn't spend a lot of money.





Jan 14, 2020 at 10:40 AM
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