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FM Review: Voigtlander 50mm f/2 APO-Lanthar

  
 
Fred Miranda
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p.80 #1 · p.80 #1 · FM Review: Voigtlander 50mm f/2 APO-Lanthar


Cumulus5000 wrote:
Ok, first post here,
So if I'm too out of context, please don't punch me too hard.

This lens seems to be gorgeous. But I have a panasonic S5.
There is a Leica M-Mount version of it.

Would this Leica M-Mount version loose image quality if adapted to a panasonic S5?

I'm considering this lens because of its sharpness and rendering.
But I don't know if it would keep 100% its sharpness and IQ on an S5...


Very likely not, although I have never tried the Panasonic bodies. It does not perform optimally on the A7R IV and Leica SL2 sensors.
It will look great at center but IQ will deteriorate off-axis.



Jan 25, 2022 at 05:09 PM
junglialoh
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p.80 #2 · p.80 #2 · FM Review: Voigtlander 50mm f/2 APO-Lanthar


From my experience, there is not much in curvature effect difference between Sony and Panasonic sensor. So, if it has some softness in Sony image, then Panasonic also have same amount softness.


Jan 25, 2022 at 06:03 PM
Fred Miranda
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p.80 #3 · p.80 #3 · FM Review: Voigtlander 50mm f/2 APO-Lanthar


junglialoh wrote:
From my experience, there is not much in curvature effect difference between Sony and Panasonic sensor. So, if it has some softness in Sony image, then Panasonic also have same amount softness.


The CV 50/2 APO-Lanthar M is also far from optimal on the SL sensor:
https://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1707236/4#15647527



Jan 26, 2022 at 10:37 AM
junglialoh
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p.80 #4 · p.80 #4 · FM Review: Voigtlander 50mm f/2 APO-Lanthar


https://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1707236/4#15647527
The test image clearly tell how M lens works in Leica L/SL and Panasonic S.
Thanks for information



Jan 26, 2022 at 02:11 PM
fjablo
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p.80 #5 · p.80 #5 · FM Review: Voigtlander 50mm f/2 APO-Lanthar


Too bad that CV focuses so strongly on optimizing for Leica M sensors with their M mount lenses. They could be fantastic options for all non-Sony systems if optimized for thicker filter stacks, but are less than ideal as they are. Not sure this was a wise business decision given the (eventual) size of user base on Canon / Nikon mirrorless..


Jan 26, 2022 at 02:27 PM
hesb
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p.80 #6 · p.80 #6 · FM Review: Voigtlander 50mm f/2 APO-Lanthar


junglialoh wrote:
https://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1707236/4#15647527
The test image clearly tell how M lens works in Leica L/SL and Panasonic S.
Thanks for information


I'm not sure these two cameras share the same the same sensor thickness. I've red somewhere that Leica lenses don't behave the same way on SL's and on panasonic cameras because of this.



Jan 26, 2022 at 02:28 PM
highdesertmesa
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p.80 #7 · p.80 #7 · FM Review: Voigtlander 50mm f/2 APO-Lanthar


Fred Miranda wrote:
The CV 50/2 APO-Lanthar M is also far from optimal on the SL sensor:
https://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1707236/4#15647527


I just tested the CV 50 APO on the SL2-S and am getting the same corner sharpness I was getting on my M bodies. The SL2-S is less resolution, but it's enough to see corner issues should there be any.

Some thoughts:

Did your M to L adapter let you hit infinity focus on this lens right at the hard stop? The Leica M Adapter L on my SL2-S is dead-on at the hard stop for infinity just like the M bodies. I found on my R5 that the adapter being even a little short with this lens had a huge impact on corner performance. Once I got a macro helicoid adapter on the R5 that allowed me to set infinity at the hard stop, the corner sharpness was night and day compared to the adapter I used that was too short.

SL2-S is BSI, which could help. Leica could have also tweaked the microlens array and or the cover glass to better support M lenses, though I've never heard them say they did either.

Examples below. First image is the full 2-shot pano camera was in landscape orientation, and I panned upward just to keep the cloud in the sky from being cut off, so nothing along the bottom was stitched. I may be seeing a little bit of magenta tint along the edges of the frame, but I need to test that on a white background to be sure.

This looks as good as I remember from the M10-R at the same f/5.6 aperture:






Full image

  LEICA SL2-S    Apo-Summicron-M 1:2/50 ASPH. lens    50mm    f/5.6    1/160s    100 ISO    +1.0 EV  







Top: Bottom left corner | Bottom: Bottom right corner




Feb 09, 2022 at 08:51 PM
Fred Miranda
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p.80 #8 · p.80 #8 · FM Review: Voigtlander 50mm f/2 APO-Lanthar


highdesertmesa wrote:
I just tested the CV 50 APO on the SL2-S and am getting the same corner sharpness I was getting on my M bodies. The SL2-S is less resolution, but it's enough to see corner issues should there be any.

Some thoughts:

Did your M to L adapter let you hit infinity focus on this lens right at the hard stop? The Leica M Adapter L on my SL2-S is dead-on at the hard stop for infinity just like the M bodies. I found on my R5 that the adapter being even a little short with this lens had a huge impact
...Show more

Yes, it's a sensor with different tech so that could be one of the reasons for the better performance. I don't believe the adapter is the culprit since most of my Leica lenses performed almost as good on the SL2 compared to the M using the same adapter. On my test, I focused at center at f/2 and stopped down to f/5.6. Not sure if you are doing the same.

Something else to keep in mind is that 47MP amplifies the flaws.



Feb 09, 2022 at 09:38 PM
highdesertmesa
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p.80 #9 · p.80 #9 · FM Review: Voigtlander 50mm f/2 APO-Lanthar


Fred Miranda wrote:
Yes, it's a sensor with different tech so that could be one of the reasons for the better performance. I don't believe the adapter is the culprit since most of my Leica lenses performed almost as good on the SL2 compared to the M using the same adapter. On my test, I focused at center at f/2 and stopped down to f/5.6. Not sure if you are doing the same.

Something else to keep in mind is that 47MP amplifies the flaws.


If you had to focus to achieve infinity (moving past infinity then back a bit), then the adapter was too short. Mine hits perfect infinity focus at the hard stop in the center at f/2, so that's how I shot it at f/5.6 for this image I didn't even check focus, I just hit the hard stop and took the shot. And this was handheld with IBIS turned on, so it might sharpen up more on a tripod with IBIS turned off.

It might be worth buying a macro helicoid adapter for your SL2 just so you can see if it performs better when putting the focus ring at the hard stop and then using the helicoid to achieve infinity focus. If other Leica lenses were performing as well on your SL2 as they do on your M but this one did not, it might just be a design that is more negatively affected by the adapter length. Or like we've been saying, that might be one or none of many reasons. But at least that would rule out the adapter as the issue.

Below are the same left and right corners at 300% magnification. I'm not seeing that same stained-glass smearing I see on your corner samples from the SL2, it just looks the same as it did at 100% only with less detail.







Feb 09, 2022 at 10:51 PM
Fred Miranda
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p.80 #10 · p.80 #10 · FM Review: Voigtlander 50mm f/2 APO-Lanthar


highdesertmesa wrote:
If you had to focus to achieve infinity (moving past infinity then back a bit), then the adapter was too short. Mine hits perfect infinity focus at the hard stop in the center at f/2, so that's how I shot it at f/5.6 for this image I didn't even check focus, I just hit the hard stop and took the shot. And this was handheld with IBIS turned on, so it might sharpen up more on a tripod with IBIS turned off.

It might be worth buying a macro helicoid adapter for your SL2 just so you can see if
...Show more

I don't remember if the adapter was at hard stop but I know for sure the center of the image had optimal sharpness and it looked just as good as the lens on the Leica M10-R. The 47MP definitely amplifies the issue but perhaps you are right and the CV 50/2 APO performs better on the SL2-S BSI sensor.



Feb 09, 2022 at 11:04 PM
 


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highdesertmesa
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p.80 #11 · p.80 #11 · FM Review: Voigtlander 50mm f/2 APO-Lanthar


This might put the corners from the SL2-S closer to a level playing field with the SL2. I imported the image into Lightroom and did an Enhance/Super Resolution, added just a little Sharpening to bring out any flaws. This still looks pretty dang good.






Bottom Left







Bottom Center







Bottom Right




Feb 09, 2022 at 11:18 PM
highdesertmesa
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p.80 #12 · p.80 #12 · FM Review: Voigtlander 50mm f/2 APO-Lanthar


Fred Miranda wrote:
I don't remember if the adapter was at hard stop but I know for sure the center of the image had optimal sharpness and it looked just as good as the lens on the Leica M10-R. The 47MP definitely amplifies the issue but perhaps you are right and the CV 50/2 APO performs better on the SL2-S BSI sensor.


There's a big thread on DPR and a few here that discuss the adapter length issue, which is how I found out about it. The lens can be perfectly focused in the center with optimal IQ, and a short adapter can still negatively affect the performance at the edges and/or corners. I believe it was shown the issue was most evident on lenses with floating elements like this one.

But how much of a role the adapter is playing versus the sensor tech, you'd have to go back and see if your CV 50 APO hits infinity at the hard stop on your SL2, and if it did, that would at least rule it out as being part of the issue.



Feb 09, 2022 at 11:24 PM
Majestictone
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p.80 #13 · p.80 #13 · FM Review: Voigtlander 50mm f/2 APO-Lanthar


Fred has gone and done it again... After reading this thread and like the previous one on 40 1.2 Nokton, I just purchased the 50 2.0 from Camera Quest 30 mins ago.... Just like I did with the 40 after reading that thread... My wallet does not like this site...


Feb 11, 2022 at 06:13 PM
highdesertmesa
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p.80 #14 · p.80 #14 · FM Review: Voigtlander 50mm f/2 APO-Lanthar


More samples on the SL2-S here: https://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1743270/0#15863231







CV 50 APO

  LEICA SL2-S    Summicron-M 1:2/50 lens    50mm    f/3.4    1/320s    100 ISO    -1.0 EV  




Feb 13, 2022 at 11:20 PM
Fred Miranda
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p.80 #15 · p.80 #15 · FM Review: Voigtlander 50mm f/2 APO-Lanthar


Majestictone wrote:
Fred has gone and done it again... After reading this thread and like the previous one on 40 1.2 Nokton, I just purchased the 50 2.0 from Camera Quest 30 mins ago.... Just like I did with the 40 after reading that thread... My wallet does not like this site...


hahaha. I don't feel guilty spending your money because these are two amazing lenses which I own myself. :-0



Mar 04, 2022 at 11:53 AM
philip_pj
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p.80 #16 · p.80 #16 · FM Review: Voigtlander 50mm f/2 APO-Lanthar


Think of them as easily recycled assets. Voigtlander lenses are one of the best retained value propositions around, at present the 50/2 is at 70-plus percent resale, going on the reliable Buy and Sell forum. Not many are for sale over some months either.

Cosina might do more 'next tier' lenses for the market, along the lines of the new 50/1 VM using their breakthrough grinding asph tech. What could their design team do for say, $2000? There has always been a place for 'semi-Leica' lens prices in the CZ/CY range and Milvus too. CV have been quietly working away in m43 making some specials, like the 0.8 aperture 29mm which first introduced this tech. So - more cine style lenses, please!



Mar 04, 2022 at 06:16 PM
dalegaspi
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p.80 #17 · p.80 #17 · FM Review: Voigtlander 50mm f/2 APO-Lanthar


i love this and the 35 APO.



L1002186.jpg by bubuli, on Flickr


L1010634.jpg by bubuli, on Flickr



Mar 05, 2022 at 11:45 AM
Majestictone
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p.80 #18 · p.80 #18 · FM Review: Voigtlander 50mm f/2 APO-Lanthar


Fred Miranda wrote:
hahaha. I don't feel guilty spending your money because these are two amazing lenses which I own myself. :-0


... And I did it again with the 21/3.5 Color-Skopar a week ago.... Making a road trip back home to So Cal at the end of the month, looking forward to giving them a workout.



Mar 07, 2022 at 03:17 PM
Fred Miranda
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p.80 #19 · p.80 #19 · FM Review: Voigtlander 50mm f/2 APO-Lanthar


Majestictone wrote:
... And I did it again with the 21/3.5 Color-Skopar a week ago.... Making a road trip back home to So Cal at the end of the month, looking forward to giving them a workout.


How do you like the CV 21/3.5? I've shot with it for a couple years but ended up exchanging it for the Leica 21/3.4 SEM. The latter is capable of more resolution off-axis but the Voigtlander is a great option as well.



Apr 05, 2022 at 05:40 PM
Fred Miranda
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p.80 #20 · p.80 #20 · FM Review: Voigtlander 50mm f/2 APO-Lanthar


Majestictone wrote:
... And I did it again with the 21/3.5 Color-Skopar a week ago.... Making a road trip back home to So Cal at the end of the month, looking forward to giving them a workout.


How do you like the CV 21/3.5? I've shot with it for a couple years but ended up exchanging it for the Leica 21/3.4 SEM. The latter is capable of more resolution off-axis but the Voigtlander is a great option as well. It works quite well on the Sony adapted.



Apr 05, 2022 at 05:40 PM
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