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Archive 2019 · A Nutria

Brev00
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · A Nutria

I never thought that the future of my relationship would come down to the identification of a type of rodent, but there you have it. I took a picture of this animal in a local nature center. Thought it was a beaver at first, but the tail made me think otherwise. The only other animal that seemed similar to me in my limited experience was the muskrat. But, muskrats are too small. I showed the picture to my girlfriend and she said she knew what it was but, being Lithuanian, did not have the English name. Google determined the English word is nutria. I was unsure of this identification and said so at the time. This upset her as she was 100% sure. After she left, I did some more research and am now nearly 100% sure she was correct. But, has a rat come between us for good?

I have presented this to share my sad tale (tail?). At this point I don't think I need additional confirmation.

Jun 06, 2019 at 11:36 AM

rw11
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · A Nutria

the round tail rules out beaver

Jun 06, 2019 at 02:27 PM

PhilPDX
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · A Nutria

That's 100% a muskrat (Ondatra zibethicus). Nutrias look different.

-Phil

Jun 06, 2019 at 03:17 PM

Bobg657
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · A Nutria

Oh boy are you in trouble! “Yes dear” will save your relationship!
Bob

Jun 06, 2019 at 06:57 PM

morris
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · A Nutria

I think it's a bat!

Morris

Jun 06, 2019 at 07:17 PM

Brev00
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · A Nutria

rw11 wrote:
the round tail rules out beaver

That was my thought. I was disappointed that it wasn't. The area is filled with fallen trees with tell tale beaver markings. Dams as well. I wanted to find the fire behind all of the smoke.

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PhilPDX wrote:
That's 100% a muskrat (Ondatra zibethicus). Nutrias look different.

-Phil

Interesting that you say that. Makes me wonder. Looked at images of just muskrats online. Had previously read comparative articles with just a couple of muskrat shots. I think you may very well be right. But, I can't bring that up with my gf! What aspects of a nutria does this critter lack?

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Bobg657 wrote:
Oh boy are you in trouble! “Yes dear” will save your relationship!
Bob

Oh how right you are! I just wish I said that to her!

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morris wrote:
I think it's a bat!

Morris

Someone here is batty. But, funny!

Jun 06, 2019 at 08:30 PM

Ischgl99
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · A Nutria

Did you happen to get a look at its mouth? Nutria have orange teeth that are very distinctive.

http://www.havahart.com/articles/nutria-invasive-rodent-animal

Jun 06, 2019 at 08:45 PM

Imagemaster
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · A Nutria

Brev00 wrote:
I never thought that the future of my relationship would come down to the identification of a type of rodent, but there you have it. I took a picture of this animal in a local nature center. Thought it was a beaver at first, but the tail made me think otherwise. The only other animal that seemed similar to me in my limited experience was the muskrat. But, muskrats are too small. I showed the picture to my girlfriend and she said she knew what it was but, being Lithuanian, did not have the English name. Google determined the English...Show more →

Then ask someone at that local nature center.

Jun 06, 2019 at 08:49 PM

Brev00
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · A Nutria

Ischgl99 wrote:
Did you happen to get a look at its mouth? Nutria have orange teeth that are very distinctive.

http://www.havahart.com/articles/nutria-invasive-rodent-animal
Yes, I read about that. But, no. This was the only view I got.

Jun 06, 2019 at 09:42 PM

Brev00
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · A Nutria

Imagemaster wrote:
Then ask someone at that local nature center.

That sounds like a good idea. Unfortunately, with the flooding here in Tulsa, I don't plan to get back there until things dry out a bit. I will ask.

Jun 06, 2019 at 09:45 PM

PhilPDX
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · A Nutria

Brev00 wrote:
What aspects of a nutria does this critter lack?

Muskrats have thin, black whiskers (your photo is a bit misleading due to reflections), nutrias' are white and thicker. The fur of a nutria is usually dark brown, the one of a muskrat looks just like in your image. The tail of a muskrat is flattened vertically, the tail of a nutria is round. The tail of a nutria isn't moving while the animal swims, the tail of a muskrat is undulating behind the body while swimming. Just to name a few...

-Phil

Jun 07, 2019 at 10:29 AM

rw11
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · A Nutria

not everything can be ID'd in the field

I would not be willing to place much of a bet on either species just from the photo... if forced I'd go for nutria

Jun 07, 2019 at 01:12 PM

PhilPDX
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · A Nutria

rw11 wrote:
not everything can be ID'd in the field

To tell apart nutrias, muskrats and beavers is really not rocket science. ;-)

-Phil

Jun 07, 2019 at 09:46 PM

JohnSil
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · A Nutria

morris wrote:
I think it's a bat!

Morris

Hmmm, not so sure....., most of the bats I’ve seen have wings but let me go ask my Girlfriend, she knows a lot more about bats than I do?!?!?! LoL
John

Jun 08, 2019 at 01:49 AM

JohnSil
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · A Nutria

Jun 08, 2019 at 02:02 AM

PhilPDX
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · A Nutria

JohnSil wrote:
Though this one DOES appear to have a round tail and not flattened vertically...

A muskrat's tail is not as flat as a pancake. Look at this photos of the tail and fur:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/00/Muskrat_swimming_Ottawa.jpg

and then compare it to a nutria...

http://www.naturalhistoryonthenet.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/01/Nutria.jpg

The fur, the whiskers, the ears and the tail are all different.

Hope this helps
-Phil

PS: The photos are not mine.

Jun 08, 2019 at 10:05 AM

Brev00
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · A Nutria

Thanks for all of the responses so far. I have reviewed similar pictures online. If I had a straight on view or one when it was on land it would help. The picture of the muskrat swimming is good evidence but in some images the nutria doesn't look very different. If I could have measured it! The ____ split after this pic so not very cooperative. Cool that a couple are pretty confident in their identifications but have come to opposite conclusions! Would have been so much easier if it was a beaver. Beavers obviously live in this area.

I will return. It is a favorite spot. I will look for the type of structures a nutria builds. Have only seen beaver dams in the past. It is a great place to take photo walks. Often, wildlife sightings are few, but I have seen snakes. In fact, a few of the best nature shots I have taken were of a snake in the process of eating a frog. Didn't worry about exact IDs at the time! I have photographed yellow crested night herons, green and great blue herons, egrets, deer, butterflies, hummingbirds, turtles, the usual Canadian geese and various species of ducks. Maybe some others. Hoping to get a beaver some day. Gotta find the culprit behind all of this tree devastation! Yes, I know this is a natural ecological process. Wonder what predator controls the population of these rodents. Perhaps the snakes which can be pretty big. Need to learn how to identify them as well.

PS: all is cool with my gf. It seems that other things about me still have appeal for her. Go figure.

Jun 08, 2019 at 11:26 AM

rw11
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · A Nutria

PhilPDX wrote:
To tell apart nutrias, muskrats and beavers is really not rocket science. ;-)

-Phil

I'm a professional biologist and have a few chops on mammalian ID, esp. since I taught Mammalogy to grad. students and upper div. ug's....

So, I will stand by my stmt. above. You can of course make a partial guess esp. if it doesn't matter if you are wrong. For a biologist, it does matter.

to quote/paraphrase one poster: A muskrat's tail is not completely flat - think of it as round with fins on it.

the photo alone simply doesn't allow an errorless ID, tho it does look like what you think you are sure of...

Jun 08, 2019 at 02:37 PM

rw11
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · A Nutria

Brev, you "Wonder what predator controls the population of these rodents."

Nutria are an alien invasive species (Mr. McIlhenny - the Tabasco baron) used to breed them on Avery Island, LA. During a hurricane, the cages were toppled and broken and a few escaped. They were able to breed and increase to colonize a good part of N. America.

Both species are preyed upon by all sorts of predators - alligators, big snakes, cats, coyote, etc. depending on where they are.

Louisiana has a bounty on nutria BTW.

Jun 08, 2019 at 02:41 PM

PhilPDX
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p.1 #20 · p.1 #20 · A Nutria

rw11 wrote:
I'm a professional biologist...

You are excused...

Don't you think you're making it a bit too complicated? There's no need to dissect a muskrat to have 100% proof that it really is one, if you know what I mean. I see all three species (nutria, muskrat and beaver) in my local national wildlife refuge on a regular basis. Visiting for over ten years now.

Anyway, in the end I don't care enough to start an argument.

-Phil

Jun 08, 2019 at 03:47 PM

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