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Archive 2018 · How wide is your apperture for group shots?

Ayuntalo
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · How wide is your apperture for group shots?

Im a sucker for wide open shots, it just looks magical.
I own a sigma 1.4.

And i have to admit, even tho it looks great.
When theres multiple person, 1.4 is a big gamble even if you try to postion them on the same plane.

What appertures do you normally use?
Will these be a good start?
1 person - f1.4 - f2
2 person- f1.8 - f2
3 person- f2 -2.8
4 person f2 - f4

Nov 28, 2018 at 04:05 PM

Peter Figen
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · How wide is your apperture for group shots?

It all depends on how much you want in focus. The background might be magical but an out of focus subject less so, unless that's what you're after. And it depends on how you have your people arranged. All in a straight line will be quite different than a staggered group. So easy to test this and arrive at your own conclusions.

Nov 28, 2018 at 05:52 PM

Ayuntalo
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · How wide is your apperture for group shots?

Im sorry. I didnt notice i dont have the camera and focal length on my post.

Im talking about a 85 1.4 prime on full frame. I know at 35 1.4 you can get away, a little bit more.

But at 85 1.4. What are the usual go to apperture settings for group shots like family shoot or wedding formals

Nov 28, 2018 at 06:01 PM

friscoron
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · How wide is your apperture for group shots?

Just like Peter said. If they're all in a line and you're standing back far enough, f/1.4 can largely work. Depending on how far you are from them, that will determine your DOF. If you come up on them so it's waist up and the four people fill the frame, then the DOF will likely be pretty shallow. So like Peter said, it all comes down to how much you want in focus.

If they're staggered, or in two lines, or three lines, then you need to stop down. A lot of again depends on how much you're filling the frame with them. You can shoot at f/8 pretty tight and still get some sweet bokeh behind them if what's in the background is far enough away. If they're five feet in front of a brick wall, then the wall will likely be pretty much in focus at f/8.

so the answer is, it depends.

Nov 28, 2018 at 06:12 PM

friscoron
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · How wide is your apperture for group shots?

By the way, to me it's too general to say that you're going to use any given f/stop for a certain number of people. Using my 85 f/1.4G lens, I can shoot a tight shot of a single person at f/6.3 because I want more of their facial features in focus. Whereas if I shot it at f/1/4 or even f/4, only part of their face may be completely in focus, depending on how tight I shoot them. If it's full body, f/1.4 can get them in pretty good focus. But tight, f/1.4 will be very shallow.

Nov 28, 2018 at 06:16 PM

Ayuntalo
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · How wide is your apperture for group shots?

True.
I feel like full body 4 person, you can nail some shots at 1.4. But high chance of someone being out of focus. So maybe not really advisable.

To me im gonna try this next time at f2 most likely upto f4.
Was just wondering how others people do it

friscoron wrote:
By the way, to me it's too general to say that you're going to use any given f/stop for a certain number of people. Using my 85 f/1.4G lens, I can shoot a tight shot of a single person at f/6.3 because I want more of their facial features in focus. Whereas if I shot it at f/1/4 or even f/4, only part of their face may be completely in focus, depending on how tight I shoot them. If it's full body, f/1.4 can get them in pretty good focus. But tight, f/1.4 will be very shallow.

Nov 28, 2018 at 06:20 PM

Sauseschritt
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · How wide is your apperture for group shots?

I dont go below f5.6 on group shots. You want everyone in sharp focus. Reduced depth of field is thus not an option.

If you can get them all in one single line, sure you can get lower. I wouldnt have any rule of thumbs for that though. Its a gamble.

Nov 29, 2018 at 04:18 AM

Ayuntalo
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · How wide is your apperture for group shots?

Can you be a little more specific on what you mean on “group shot”?
Because if its 2-3 i think you can go much wider than 5.6z

Sauseschritt wrote:
I dont go below f5.6 on group shots. You want everyone in sharp focus. Reduced depth of field is thus not an option.

If you can get them all in one single line, sure you can get lower. I wouldnt have any rule of thumbs for that though. Its a gamble.

Nov 29, 2018 at 08:44 AM

Peter Figen
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · How wide is your apperture for group shots?

"Can you be a little more specific on what you mean on “group shot”?
Because if its 2-3 i think you can go much wider than 5.6z"

You can do whatever you want and use whatever aperture suits you, but if you want to get everyone in focus, then you have to consider every variable that makes up your image. You talk about moving from f/1.4 all the way to f/2. Really? That's going make almost no difference in your depth of field or bokeh. Most of the group shots I make, and it's almost always a band photo with half a dozen peeps, are shot at f/11. That's just what it takes for what I do. If you're groups are further away and smaller in the frame then maybe you can get away with a larger aperture. It's really your job as a photographer to be able to figure this out on the fly as your shooting. Every situation is different.

Nov 29, 2018 at 11:49 AM

sungphoto
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · How wide is your apperture for group shots?

Agree with the sentiments are expressed in the thread. Basically that the f-stop one chooses depends on a lot of factors.

Generally if one of the most important things that one is trying to achieve is getting everyone in sharp focus - weddings for example, I'll go for f8-10 for groups larger than 3-4. Even at f8 and around 50mm, if you're about 8-10 ft from your subjects your depth of field is going to be around 3 ft, which is not a lot of room to play with if you have a group of people that are staggered into rows, or if the group of people are not arranged in a straight line. If you're a bokeh addict, you're probably leaning towards the longer focal lengths like an 85, and at f8 and 8-10 ft from your subject you have only about a 2 ft of depth of field, which is still not much for a group.

My advice would be to think about how to separate your subjects from the background in ways other than just shooting wide open with a fast lens. Really scouting a location well and finding areas that provide solid contrast and are not distracting/ugly is a great way to do that, as well as understanding how the available light will play in the area you're shooting throughout the day. Using off camera flash is also a great way to "solve the problem".

Nov 29, 2018 at 10:01 PM

NCAndy
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · How wide is your apperture for group shots?

sungphoto wrote:
Agree with the sentiments are expressed in the thread. Basically that the f-stop one chooses depends on a lot of factors.

Generally if one of the most important things that one is trying to achieve is getting everyone in sharp focus - weddings for example, I'll go for f8-10 for groups larger than 3-4. Even at f8 and around 50mm, if you're about 8-10 ft from your subjects your depth of field is going to be around 3 ft, which is not a lot of room to play with if you have a group of people that are staggered into rows,...Show more →

I completely agree with sungphoto. I've been burned with group shots even at f8 with an 85mm lens. There are ways to soften a background in post if needed but there is only so much that can be done to sharpen a soft subject. If you're running and gunning grabbing group shots sometimes you have to place priority on subject sharpness over bokeh, or use a flash to separate the subject from the ambient background. In a perfect world you could place your group where you could achieve separation from the background and get the look you want stopped down, but in reality most often you have to make choices in each situation.

Nov 30, 2018 at 05:58 AM

rcaday3
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · How wide is your apperture for group shots?

Are you going for full body shots? The DOF of a [email protected] from 20ft away is about 15in.

Does anyone else use a DOF calculator? I like to use one when I plan my shots. I'm always amazed at how narrow of a DOF you can achieve with a 1.4 or even 1.2!

Nov 30, 2018 at 11:14 AM

Ayuntalo
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · How wide is your apperture for group shots?

sound advices. and yes will have to look at DOF calculator to start out.

interesting to see the f8-11 for 3-4 group shots tho.
havent really used those unless its a landscape

Nov 30, 2018 at 12:03 PM

Peter Figen
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · How wide is your apperture for group shots?

Just remember that DoF calculators assume a certain size circle of confusion and print size and should only be used as a rough guide in making your decision. It all goes back to what you need and want and a little testing will tell you more than anything else and then you'll know.

Nov 30, 2018 at 01:04 PM

Oscarsmadness
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · How wide is your apperture for group shots?

+1 for sungphoto's advice

Nov 30, 2018 at 05:19 PM

John Caldwell
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · How wide is your apperture for group shots?

A point made already perhaps: Subjects are equidistant from lens, rather than in one plane. Using a string to create a placement arc can work.

While not what you're asking perhaps, using a composite of separate shots with focus signed to one subject at at time can work. No objection if someone calls that woefully impractical.

Other than this, solving the problem with the f8 approach, and doing your best to separate the group from the background is the safest.

John-

Nov 30, 2018 at 06:15 PM

Peter Figen
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · How wide is your apperture for group shots?

John - Those are both great suggestions, especially if your lens doesn't not have so flat a field of focus. The separate focus works too but you have to have the time and ability to cobble it all together later.

Nov 30, 2018 at 07:45 PM

Danpbphoto
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · How wide is your apperture for group shots?

Ayuntalo wrote:
Im a sucker for wide open shots, it just looks magical.
I own a sigma 1.4.

And i have to admit, even tho it looks great.
When theres multiple person, 1.4 is a big gamble even if you try to postion them on the same plane.

What appertures do you normally use?
Will these be a good start?
1 person - f1.4 - f2
2 person- f1.8 - f2
3 person- f2 -2.8
4 person f2 - f4

The background usually dictates my aperture. Next how they line up.

Dec 01, 2018 at 10:02 AM

elkhornsun
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · How wide is your apperture for group shots?

Check out one of the DOF calculators online. If I have a group of 30-40 people then I need enough DOF to go from the center person in the front row to the outer edges of the row furthest back. That is about 8 feet and it is important to realize that if at 24mm the DOF calculator shows 8 feet that the DOF behind the point of focus is only 4 feet.

The problem is best solved by getting up on a ladder so that the distance to the people in the rear is not so much greater than the people in the front. I have made use of balconies and staircases to get the best vantage point with very large groups of 100 or more people.

When I am photographing a group what is important is that people looking at the print or album can recognize everyone in it. If the back ground is busy then I get higher or lower than my subjects or move them so the background is not a problem. With very busy backgrounds using a larger aperture to induce blurring is only partially effective and so not something I would do except as a very last resort (and with all my wedding group shots I have only had to do this one time).

Dec 04, 2018 at 07:17 PM


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