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Archive 2018 · Travel and only bring iPhone. Fulfilling? (please note edit in #1)

kevindar
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p.5 #1 · p.5 #1 · Travel and only bring iPhone. Fulfilling? (please note edit in #1)

I would not do it. Unless moderate cost is an issue, there are so many better options which will give you a lot more flexibility, without need for switching lenses.
How about an sl2 and 18-135, even smaller, a sony a6000/a6300 and 18-135? will cost less than 1K. give you much better af, much better range, etc.

Aug 28, 2018 at 11:10 PM

AmbientMike
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p.5 #2 · p.5 #2 · Travel and only bring iPhone. Fulfilling? (please note edit in #1)

I should add, to my previous post, someone took a photo of me recently, on vacation, using an S8 (?) and I wasn't that impressed with the resolution. I thought my dslr beat it handily. Although, I suppose idk if it was at full res.

If you want a really lightweight wildlife lens, the 55-250 is about 88-400mm ff equivalent. I'd rather have longer, but people seem to use the 100-400 on ff.

And my T6 is really lightweight. The SL2 is supposed to be even lighter. A good 18-55 + 55-250 covers a lot of ground, and isn't bad to carry. I think the 10-18 is like 7 oz.

Aug 28, 2018 at 11:51 PM

rek101
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p.5 #3 · p.5 #3 · Travel and only bring iPhone. Fulfilling? (please note edit in #1)

Just to source the iphone print comment. I had two friends who worked at wallmart tell me the number one complaint they had from customers was that their prints of photos taken with cell phones didn't print well if the photo was larger than 4x6. The most common phone was an iphone...this is just on average of course.

Can certain photos come out great with an iphone, absolutely. You can also nail focus with manual focus at the Kentucky derby. You can also get an A in a class studying at the last minute. There are countless situations in life that work sometimes, but do not consistently deliver good results. I believe when we bring our cameras and decide to take pictures, our hope is to reliably capture something our eye sees and if the photo is particularly important/good, produce some kind of print or "something".

Telling users that their iphone prints with regularity are going to look good printed big is simply wasting their time and bragging. Is there some kind of allergy on forums to giving people information that is of some value rather than bragging? I doubt it...but seriously, if you think you're going to get good quality large prints from your iphone, I have bridge you may be interested in purchasing.

Aug 29, 2018 at 07:04 AM

rabbitmountain
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p.5 #4 · p.5 #4 · Travel and only bring iPhone. Fulfilling? (please note edit in #1)

chez wrote:
I travel for photography and that is why I moved to a mirrorless based system...bulk and weight. No way will I leave my travel kit at home and just go with my iPhone...not a chance.

Why is it we spend so much money on our gear and then don't take it with us to some fantastic places around the world.

Thanks for all your comments. Each of us have our own context and requirements. So let me rephrase the reason for starting this topic.

I wanted to have a way of speeding up the photographing process. Also, I considered leaving some gear at home to reduce weight.

When we go hiking on family vacations, I am the only photographer in the family so on previous trips everybody always had to wait for me to take off my backpack, take out the gear, change lenses, fiddle with filters and then stow everything back in the backpack. This leads to some tension.

Please note that I did bring my 5D4 + 100-400II + 1.4xiii along for the occasional wildlife shots. I also tossed in my 24-70/4IS.

The whole point was to shoot 70-80% of the shots with a fast handling device, so as to not frustrate my family. I chose the iPhone 8 plus for this task but it could also be a dedicated P&S, as long as it is small enough to slip into my pocket.

We just returned from our trip.

Let me emphasise this was an experiment. I wanted to see if:
#1 Using a small device would in fact improve the speed of taking photographs
#2 the IQ was satisfactory

On #1 it definitely was a success. I had my 5D4 + 100-400ii in the top compartment of my backpack, ready to grab. So wherever I wanted to use that, I did not need to fiddle with lenses, just shoot and put it back.
on #2 it was OK-ish. On this trip, with ample light, 90% of shots turned out pretty good.

What am I going to do on my next trip?
It depends. Whatever I do, I want to be able to grab fast and shoot. So I will keep changing lenses to a minimum. I thought of two options:

A. Leisure trip
Bring a good P&S with a larger sensor and moderate zoom lens, preferably very small so it will fit into my shirt/pants pocket.

B. Larger trip with wildlife opportunities
Bring the same P&S as in A, but add 5D4 + 100-400ii / 1.4xiii

C. Larger trip with wildlife and landscape opportunities
Bring the P&S, 5D4 + 100-400ii / 1.4xiii and 5DsR with 16-35/4IS

So this is the end of my experiment and I'm quite happy I did it. Now all I need to find is a decent P&S that is both small/flat and has very good IQ. A small dSLR is certainly too big for what I want.

Thanks,
Ralph

Aug 29, 2018 at 09:46 AM

Jeff Nolten
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p.5 #5 · p.5 #5 · Travel and only bring iPhone. Fulfilling? (please note edit in #1)

Thank you for your analysis Ralph. I understood where you were going with your thread although the title confused me.

Ever since my kit matured into 5Dc + 24-105 + 100-400 v1, I've been experimenting with lighter alternatives. I've been using G series for backpacking but they never provided the reach and its really only been with the G1X series that the IQ has been good enough to substitute for a 24-105 FF or 15-85 crop.

Like Chez, I won't leave my good camera kit home when going somewhere scenic for the first time. The 5D# + 24-105 has become an extension of my eyes. Its fast to pull out and shoot, great general range, and excellent, reliable image quality in all lighting circumstances. There are certainly better choices for specific circumstances but like you, I'm generally in a group or family that are ready to move on.

The 100-400 has been my fantasy lens since the 90s. I love photographing wildlife and this lens especially on crop or with an extender does that portably. But its a heavy sucker and the new version, acknowledging its improvements, is heavier still. I carry it to known wildlife locations but I feel it.

Two decent alternatives that I've used are the Sigma 100-400 and the Canon 55-250 STM. [The Tamron is probably equivalent to the Sigma.] These are compromises, e.g. I won't use the Sigma with extender, but are remarkably good lenses for their cost and weight.

So with regard to your travel alternatives A. B. and C., here are my travel kit choices:

77D + 55-250 + G1X3 ....................... 2.93 lb 1.3 kg
77D + 100-400 Sigma + G1X3 .......... 4.65 lb 2.1 kg
77D + 10-18 + 35 Macro + 55-250 + G1X3 3.9 lb 1.8 kg
77D + 100-400 Sigma ....................... 3.75 lb 1.7 kg
Note an SL2 would be about 3 oz, .19 lb, or .09 kg lighter.

80D + 100-400 Sigma ....................... 4.5 lb 2.0 kg ①
① + 35 Macro + G1X3 ....................... 5.92 lb 2.7 kg
① + 10-18 + 35 Macro + 55-250 + G1X3 7.36 lb 3.3 kg
All above hiking or travel A options

5D4 + 24-105 + 100-400 II .............. 7.12 lb 3.2 kg
+ V20 + G1X3 + 1.4xIII ................. 9.25 lb 4.2 kg
This is my default air travel kit with wildlife, B. C.
V20 is the 9 oz Voightlander 20mm Color Scopar

5D4 + 24-105 + Sigma ...................... 6.30 lb 2.9 kg
+ V20 + G1X3 ................................ 7.90 lb 3.6 kg
This is my default without wildlife

The first option, 77D + 55-250 + G1X3, is remarkably light, portable and capable. I'll take this to the zoo, beach, hiking, or generally. The G1X3 has a really good panorama builder and the 55-250 focuses close and can take a Canon 58mm 500D diopter. Both are great video cameras. No lens changes!

Edited on Aug 29, 2018 at 12:47 PM · View previous versions

Aug 29, 2018 at 11:31 AM

MatthewK
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p.5 #6 · p.5 #6 · Travel and only bring iPhone. Fulfilling? (please note edit in #1)

Jeff Nolten wrote:
Fine if you want a 35 mm equivalent prime. Costs a bit more too. No evidence its optically any better other than f2. No image stabilization? If thats what I was after I'd go for a 35 L for my 5D4, costs the same. We agree on the 100-400 though.

Different strokes

I've come to hate lugging a DSLR kit on travel (unless it involves wildlife/birds), and the x100 is perfect for my needs. Don't need test chart winning optics (not much can touch the 35L II regardless) when all I'm after is having fun and capturing moments without being that guy with the camera. Fits in a pocket, is fun to shoot, and has great IQ.

In the past though, when I did bring my 5D, I'd usually have the 16-35 f/4 + 50L + 100L or 100-400, depending.

Aug 29, 2018 at 11:56 AM

Jeff Nolten
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p.5 #7 · p.5 #7 · Travel and only bring iPhone. Fulfilling? (please note edit in #1)

Yes we are lucky there are so many fine options. Tough to choose among them, a real first world problem.

I'll add that I will offer and defend my equipment choices when I've used them and think they are good. But I am in no way suggesting that they will meet every one's photography style or needs.

Aug 29, 2018 at 12:03 PM

rabbitmountain
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p.5 #8 · p.5 #8 · Travel and only bring iPhone. Fulfilling? (please note edit in #1)

That's great Jeff, thanks for your elaborate reply! Highly appreciated. The G1X mk III sure seems like a good camera, though it feels a little pricey. And at 400g it weighs a lot more than my iPhone. I do like the viewfinder, 14 bit RAW, the lens that disappears completely into the body, IS, and more. I would be a little concerned about dust though.

It could be quite good in combination with the 5D4 w/ 100-400ii w/ 1.4xiii combo. I must say that I am surely glad I brought that combo to Australia. I put it to good use for crocs, rainbow bee eaters, a kingfisher, koalas and such. Especially the bee eaters are fast. Even the 5D4 AF could hardly keep up. But I got a few good ones.

I am wondering what the smallest / flattest compact would look like that shoots RAW and still has a sensor significantly larger than that of my iPhone. I certainly will go and have a look at some other smaller cameras to see what is there. As a long time dSLR user I must say I never gave them much thought.

Well, so I learned something today

Thanks,
Ralph

Aug 29, 2018 at 12:43 PM

technic
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p.5 #9 · p.5 #9 · Travel and only bring iPhone. Fulfilling? (please note edit in #1)

Jeff Nolten wrote:
Yes we are lucky there are so many fine options. Tough to choose among them, a real first world problem.

I'll add that I will offer and defend my equipment choices when I've used them and think they are good. But I am in no way suggesting that they will meet every one's photography style or needs.

It is good to ponder the many options but much depends on the photographer, style, subject etc.

A family member recently did a trip to Australia using a Rebel with the kit zoom and 55-250STM, which in general is a capable and compact travel combo. Two things were clear to me when viewing the results: dust (due to changing lenses ...) was a problem and the 55-250STM doesn't help much for the average wildlife in Australia as the magnification was usually way too low. On the other side, the scenic images were great and probably a bit better than what an experienced photographer could get with a good 1 inch sensor compact. Personally I would not take a big lens like the 100-400 with me on such a general trip, that's only an option if you know beforehand there is going to be plenty of opportunity to use it.

On a trip over 10 years ago to New Zealand I used a Sony DSC-F717 (a bit similar to current RX10 series, but smaller/lighter) instead of my DSLR gear. Due to travel conditions I was afraid of dust problems and potential gear damage. The Sony got a lot of nice images with little effort; they would have been significantly better with a DSLR but for most shots the IQ difference does not really matter. I still think I made the right decision and would seriously look at a similar solution nowadays. However, if you have more control of travel conditions, have more time available to shoot and have a good idea beforehand what focal length etc. will work then a DSLR kit is worth the extra weight.

Aug 29, 2018 at 12:55 PM

technic
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p.5 #10 · p.5 #10 · Travel and only bring iPhone. Fulfilling? (please note edit in #1)

rabbitmountain wrote:
I am wondering what the smallest / flattest compact would look like that shoots RAW and still has a sensor significantly larger than that of my iPhone. I certainly will go and have a look at some other smaller cameras to see what is there. As a long time dSLR user I must say I never gave them much thought.

I suggest to start looking at 1 inch sensor cameras like RX100-VI and Panasonic TZ-200 if you want a reasonably compact camera with wide-to-medium tele reach. If you don't need the tele range then the older RX100 models and several other options are available. They all have their compromises compared to a DSLR kit (and they are all bigger than a cell phone ...) so it is important to figure out what you really want.

If you can live with just a WA lens then cameras like Ricoh GRII and some Fuji models might be an option (great image quality, very easy to use, very compact for a camera with APS-C sensor). Compared to the cell phone you get (better) RAW options, better ergonomics and depending on conditions better IQ. Unfortunately dust can be a problem with the GRII, hopefully there is an improved version at Photokina ;-)

Aug 29, 2018 at 01:01 PM

Jeff Nolten
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p.5 #11 · p.5 #11 · Travel and only bring iPhone. Fulfilling? (please note edit in #1)

rabbitmountain wrote:
I would be a little concerned about dust though.

I've been using G series for years and especially with the G9, G10 and G1X#s they are very tough. I have never had a dust or other issue and used them many years each backpacking and always with me. The G1X3 is weather sealed, the first to be so labeled. I used it recently in the Serengeti, extremely dusty!, with no issues. It takes a 37mm screw on lens filter that I don't mind wiping off with my handkerchief. I dropped it (lens retracted) on to a linoleum floor with no issues. As I said above, the 1D of compacts IMHO.

I've read good things about the Sony RX100 series but I don't like the bar of soap ergonomics. It has a reputation for good IQ and better lens range. The G7X is several hundred cheaper, 1 inch sensor. I really like Canon's 24 MP DPAF sensor. I'm sure there are other good options like Mathew's Fuji. I've been following DPR's Canon Powershot forum and the main hesitation seems to be cost. I get that but considering the other Canon lenses and bodies I have and how much I'll use it... I don't intend to sound brow beating but this is by far the best G I've ever had.

I'm glad Canon is willing to fill this admittedly small market segment.

Aug 29, 2018 at 01:25 PM

Jeff Nolten
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p.5 #12 · p.5 #12 · Travel and only bring iPhone. Fulfilling? (please note edit in #1)

technic wrote:
A family member recently did a trip to Australia using a Rebel with the kit zoom and 55-250STM, which in general is a capable and compact travel combo. Two things were clear to me when viewing the results: dust (due to changing lenses ...) was a problem and the 55-250STM doesn't help much for the average wildlife in Australia as the magnification was usually way too low. On the other side, the scenic images were great and probably a bit better than what an experienced photographer could get with a good 1 inch sensor compact. Personally I would not take...Show more →

Australia is still on my bucket list but I can certainly relate to dust! In the Serengeti my granddaughter used an SL1 with 55-250 and did almost as well as my 100-400 considering the variety of wildlife opportunities. She supplemented it with her cell phone!

She had no camera dust issues because she didn't change lenses in the field. I firmly believe in a two body system in such situations. No compact is going to have quality reach and two DSLRs will generally out weigh what you can take on an in-country hopper flight. Plus what do you do with the one you're not using if its very big? The solution, I think, is a DSLR to match the lens you're using for reach and a quality compact that can provide the landscape quality you desire. Lots of options but many trade-offs.

Aug 29, 2018 at 01:46 PM

rabbitmountain
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p.5 #13 · p.5 #13 · Travel and only bring iPhone. Fulfilling? (please note edit in #1)

Jeff Nolten wrote:
Australia is still on my bucket list but I can certainly relate to dust! In the Serengeti my granddaughter used an SL1 with 55-250 and did almost as well as my 100-400 considering the variety of wildlife opportunities. She supplemented it with her cell phone!

Aug 29, 2018 at 01:59 PM

rabbitmountain
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p.5 #14 · p.5 #14 · Travel and only bring iPhone. Fulfilling? (please note edit in #1)

So here is a sample photo I took in Windjana gorge, Kimberly, WA. First the original, then an edited version where I lifted the shadows, then a 800x1200 crop.

http://www.yulaniss.nl/FM/180829iphone/FHCB0817-unedited.jpg
http://www.yulaniss.nl/FM/180829iphone/FHCB0817-Edit.jpg
http://www.yulaniss.nl/FM/180829iphone/FHCB0817-Crop.jpg

Aug 29, 2018 at 02:01 PM

rabbitmountain
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p.5 #15 · p.5 #15 · Travel and only bring iPhone. Fulfilling? (please note edit in #1)

Then just for the hell of it: some freshies shot with the 5D4 w/ 100-400ii @400mm, cropped to 3200px wide, then resized to 1200px. Man am I glad I brought that lens...

http://www.yulaniss.nl/FM/180829iphone/IMG_8068.jpg

Aug 29, 2018 at 02:05 PM

rabbitmountain
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p.5 #16 · p.5 #16 · Travel and only bring iPhone. Fulfilling? (please note edit in #1)

Here is another one. Shows the value of RAW editing. First the JPEG SOOC, then the DNG edited to reveal the background.

http://www.yulaniss.nl/FM/180829iphone/DKZI9325.JPG
http://www.yulaniss.nl/FM/180829iphone/DKZI9325-DNG.jpg

And a 800x1200 crop:
http://www.yulaniss.nl/FM/180829iphone/DKZI9325-Crop.jpg

Aug 29, 2018 at 02:14 PM

gdanmitchell
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p.5 #17 · p.5 #17 · Travel and only bring iPhone. Fulfilling? (please note edit in #1)

rek101 wrote:
Just to source the iphone print comment. I had two friends who worked at wallmart tell me the number one complaint they had from customers was that their prints of photos taken with cell phones didn't print well if the photo was larger than 4x6. The most common phone was an iphone...this is just on average of course.

Can certain photos come out great with an iphone, absolutely. You can also nail focus with manual focus at the Kentucky derby. You can also get an A in a class studying at the last minute. There are countless situations in life...Show more →

Several important points here.

1. Most people are never going to print photographs from an iPhone at all. They mostly share them electronically, never viewing larger than a computer screen.

2. Few are claiming that you are going to get great large prints from an iPhone, at least not if you mean what I mean by "large prints." My story, however, demonstrates that a skillful photographer who knows what she is doing an produce a convincing 12" x 18" print of a number of subjects. That is a lot larger than the 4" x 6" maximum mentioned in the post I replied to.

3. Personally, I would not rely on an iPhone for my own travel photography, and for several reasons. An iPhone is not sufficiently responsive for my needs, it doesn't permit the lens flexibility I need, and my target output is larger than 12" x 18" prints.

So the answer to the question about whether you can or cannot use an iPhone for vacation photography comes down to the photographer's expectations. What kind of photographs is one making? In what conditions? How important is weight/size in the grand scheme? Will one print? How large? What quality level is acceptable.

For some the iPhone can be fine. For others it won't.

There is no one right answer.

Aug 29, 2018 at 02:56 PM

Jeff Nolten
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p.5 #18 · p.5 #18 · Travel and only bring iPhone. Fulfilling? (please note edit in #1)

Ralph, I see you are from the Netherlands, we stopped in Amsterdam on the way. Some of these I've posted before.

Aug 29, 2018 at 03:13 PM

Jeff Nolten
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p.5 #19 · p.5 #19 · Travel and only bring iPhone. Fulfilling? (please note edit in #1)

And a few from Africa inspired by your crock shot.

BTW, inspired by Dan's comments: I was amazed that over half our African safari group only used cell phones and showed no real interest in my offer to share my images. Proves our expectations are all different.

Aug 29, 2018 at 03:19 PM

rabbitmountain
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p.5 #20 · p.5 #20 · Travel and only bring iPhone. Fulfilling? (please note edit in #1)

rabbitmountain wrote:
Here is another one. Shows the value of RAW editing. First the JPEG SOOC, then the DNG edited to reveal the background.

I forgot to mention, as I thought it was obvious, that all samples above (except the crocs) were shot with the iPhone 8 Plus, using Halide camera app, in RAW (DNG).

I was pleasantly surprised about the amount of highlights I could pull back from the iPhone DNG RAW files. For very contrasty scenes I started to compensate manually by EV-0,5 to EV-1,5 stop so I could still pull back the highs OK and brighten up the darker areas. Of course I do get more noise in those shadow areas, but at the WA light levels the phone is using very low ISO values and as long as the shadows contain busy subjects, noise is acceptable.

Also, with the dedicated RAW shooting camera apps (like Halide but also ProCam) you can use manual mode and select your desired ISO setting and shutter speed.

Ralph

Edited on Aug 29, 2018 at 06:42 PM · View previous versions

Aug 29, 2018 at 06:05 PM

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