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Archive 2017 · New Arca Swiss geared panning head

  
 
elkhornsun
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · New Arca Swiss geared panning head


I wanted to get a geared head for landscape photography and after reviewing what was available settled on the Arca Swiss D4. Arca Swiss recently introduced GP or geared panning versions of the D4 and Cube C1 geared heads but only the Cube 1 GP (geared panning) is currently being sold in the USA.

I found a photo company in the UK, Robert White, that is selling the Arca Swiss D4 GP head and at a very competitive price. I placed the order on December 2, paying $29 for expedited shipping, and the D4 GP head arrived this morning, December 6. I got it faster than had I ordered it from B&H or other US company.

I end up buying most of my nature photography and outdoor audio gear and outdoor clothing from companies in the UK as they have a much greater selection and many items that are not available in the US.



Dec 06, 2017 at 03:33 PM
jcolwell
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · New Arca Swiss geared panning head


I wish my C1 Cube had geared panning, it would be pretty much perfect; except it's expensive, heavy, and has sharp corners... Anyway, I wish mine had geared panning...


Dec 06, 2017 at 07:51 PM
elkhornsun
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · New Arca Swiss geared panning head


There is a version of the Cube C1 that has geared panning. It is the Cube C1 GP and for some reason it sells for $275 less than the Cube C1 non GP head. The GP version is a little bit heavier at 2.65 lbs or about 1/2 lb. heavier than the D4 GP head which weighs 2.1 lb. - not a lot of difference but it does add up.


Dec 08, 2017 at 04:17 PM
rw11
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · New Arca Swiss geared panning head


just put it on your Bridgeport and shave off the sharp edges

it'll be lighter too



Dec 08, 2017 at 04:46 PM
Bacalhau
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · New Arca Swiss geared panning head


Rod klukas is the US representative for AS - he can sell directly too.
I did compared prices with Robert White in the uk, vs RL and B&H before getting my C1 ....the free and faster shipping and easy returns policy from B&H where the deciding factors vs Rod.
prices after currency conversion and customs taxes priced the C1 higher than both, but that was back on March; maybe the exchange is better now



Dec 08, 2017 at 05:04 PM
elkhornsun
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · New Arca Swiss geared panning head


I paid in total $1551.72 for the D4 Geared Panning head. The C1 Cube Geared Panning is a special order (and so not returnable) at B&H and sells for $1,820.20.

The D4 GP weighs 2.1 lbs. versus 2.65 lbs. for the Cube C1 GP head. A half pound weight savings is significant. For even lighter weight the D4 weighs in at 1.76 lbs., but I was willing to have the extra 5 ounces and have the geared pan function.



Dec 21, 2017 at 05:33 PM
danski0224
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · New Arca Swiss geared panning head


The Manfrotto 405 clocks in at 1/3 of the Cube price.

It doesn't look as cool, but I'll take the change in my pocket.



Dec 21, 2017 at 06:44 PM
kdphotography
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · New Arca Swiss geared panning head


The Manfrotto 405 is also no where near the quality nor capability of the AS Cube, D4, or KPS T5.

The price of entry is high but you do get what you pay for.

Ken



Dec 21, 2017 at 07:13 PM
danski0224
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · New Arca Swiss geared panning head


I had the Sunway knockoff of the D4, and it didn't lock down, it moved all by itself at well under the rated weight capacity. I don't know if the genuine article is any better in this regard, no way for me to find out.

I tried a Cube (the real one, not the copy), wasn't impressed with it for the cost. Bought it used and sold it for what I paid for it. It does look cool, though.

The T5 is nice, but it isn't particularly easy to maintain the adjustment range in the "center" nor is there any way to know where one is in the adjustment range, so it is possible to get movement in 2 directions when a knob is turned.

The Manfrotto is cast (aluminum?) and not a fancy exercise in CNC machining. The proprietary quick release sucks, which creates an added cost to move to an Arca-compatible system. Seems to be reasonably durable.



Dec 21, 2017 at 07:47 PM
kdphotography
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · New Arca Swiss geared panning head


The Sunwayfoto knockoff of the D4 is another that is way off base in terms of its claimed capabilities. It should be used with no more than a small mirror-less camera. It should not be considered as a substitute in the company or even near level of quality of the AS Cube, D4, or KPS T5, or even the new AS P0 hybrid.


Dec 21, 2017 at 09:09 PM
Bacalhau
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · New Arca Swiss geared panning head


elkhornsun wrote:
I paid in total $1551.72 for the D4 Geared Panning head. The C1 Cube Geared Panning is a special order (and so not returnable) at B&H and sells for $1,820.20.

The D4 GP weighs 2.1 lbs. versus 2.65 lbs. for the Cube C1 GP head. A half pound weight savings is significant. For even lighter weight the D4 weighs in at 1.76 lbs., but I was willing to have the extra 5 ounces and have the geared pan function.



that's really a good price for the geared version....great job



Dec 22, 2017 at 01:09 AM
danski0224
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · New Arca Swiss geared panning head


kdphotography wrote:
The Sunwayfoto knockoff of the D4 is another that is way off base in terms of its claimed capabilities. It should be used with no more than a small mirror-less camera. It should not be considered as a substitute in the company or even near level of quality of the AS Cube, D4, or KPS T5, or even the new AS P0 hybrid.


If I recall correctly, the Sunwayfoto knockoff of the D4 apparently functions identically as the original version. There was a thread covering this.

The Sunwayfoto version didn't feel like it was poorly made, nor did failure seem imminent. I doubt that Arca Swiss aluminum alloy is of any real difference compared to the aluminum alloy fed into the Sunwayfoto CNC machines....

Apparently, the D4 also lacks any way to lock it down after making an adjustment. Whether or not the D4 moves as readily on its own is unknown to me, but I will agree that the Sunwayfoto version is just about useless for anything but a small camera and small lens that weigh way less (a few pounds maximum) than the claimed weight rating. There was also significant gear slop/lash play, at least in my Sunwayfoto copy.

I sold my Sunwayfoto copy soon after having it shipped to me from Israel.

No one locally to me stocks a D4 to try.






Dec 22, 2017 at 04:56 AM
peter_n
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · New Arca Swiss geared panning head


danski0224 wrote:
The Sunwayfoto version didn't feel like it was poorly made, nor did failure seem imminent. I doubt that Arca Swiss aluminum alloy is of any real difference compared to the aluminum alloy fed into the Sunwayfoto CNC machines....


This has been my experience too, I've had mine now almost two years. The very first reports on it pointed out that it was not suitable for a big DSLR/lens combination but oddly enough my copy handles an all-metal Fotoman panoramic with a 110mm lens. I use it with film rangefinder cameras and Sony mirrorless, the kind of cameras I think it was designed for. It was a bit stiff when I got it first but now it works smoothly, and I've had no problems with it.

Ironically enough the RRS panning clamp I got for it had to be sent back as it was extremely difficult to close the clamp fully on a plate. RRS fixed it and now everything's great.

I'll admit that my rationale for getting the GH-Pro was cost as I don't use a geared head that much. It has worked out fine for my use and I'm not planning to sell it any time soon.












Dec 22, 2017 at 09:16 AM
jcolwell
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · New Arca Swiss geared panning head


I have the Sunwayfoto GH-Pro geared head, which is believe is the "Sunwayfoto D4" being discussed. I also have the Arca Swiss C1 Cube and Manfrotto 410. The GH-Pro is definitely the poorest performer. Its movement knobs are very tight (even in comparison with the smaller C1 knobs), and the gearing for lateral movement (i.e. to level the horizon) has sufficient slack/hysteresis that it will flop over about 3 degrees off the vertical, if you give it the slightest bit of 'help' (e.g. light push from the side). I've tried to sell it a couple of times, but nobody wants it, at least not when I provide an accurate description.


Dec 22, 2017 at 09:16 AM
kdphotography
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · New Arca Swiss geared panning head


For smaller cameras such as mirrorless cameras, the Sunwayfoto GH-Pro geared head may be fine.
But imho, there are times to skimp and save, and there are times to invest. A good set of tripod legs and a quality head is a worthwhile investment----and not the time to skimp.

I shoot with medium format digital, where the investment far exceeds the cost of my truck that transports the same system. My sense is that I want a set of legs and a quality tripod head that will not give me even the slightest pause for thought or concern when in use on location. The second tier doesn't even warrant my consideration here.



Dec 22, 2017 at 12:34 PM
peter_n
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · New Arca Swiss geared panning head


Sunwayfoto in general seems to have a decent reputation, but there are many instances of variation in the user experience of their products, particularly with respect to quality. You only have to read what members have written in this thread about their perception of the GH-Pro's slop, hysteresis, it doesn't lock down, the knobs are tight etc. In general I've found that products branded with Sunwayfoto's name are pretty good, but some of their OEM offerings aren't except for their own OEM brands like Desmond and Fittest.

My experience with the GH-Pro head has been good, but I have v.3 or 4 of the product. Maybe that's the difference because I haven't experienced any of the above issues except for the sticky knobs which became smooth after use. I did my due diligence on the use of the head before purchasing. It has worked well for me so far, and at $400 for a geared head I've had good results from it. Just to repeat I'm using it with comparatively light equipment - Leica rangefinders and Sony mirrorless bodies.



Dec 22, 2017 at 09:55 PM
danski0224
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · New Arca Swiss geared panning head


peter_n wrote:
Sunwayfoto in general seems to have a decent reputation, but there are many instances of variation in the user experience of their products, particularly with respect to quality. You only have to read what members have written in this thread about their perception of the GH-Pro's slop, hysteresis, it doesn't lock down, the knobs are tight etc. In general I've found that products branded with Sunwayfoto's name are pretty good, but some of their OEM offerings aren't except for their own OEM brands like Desmond and Fittest.

My experience with the GH-Pro head has been good, but I have v.3 or
...Show more

And without a head to head comparison to the original, there is no way to know if there are any real differences.

The gear slop sounds bad as a description, but it is what I would consider a normal amount. My problem is that it made fine adjustments for macro work nearly impossible- especially if there was a change in direction.

Guess what. The Really Right Stuff macro rails also have a considerable amount of slop and gear lash play, and that is a $350.00 product. I got rid of mine.

The Cube doesn't have any slop at all, but the gear design is different from the GH Pro.

The Sunwayfoto GH Pro is (was) advertised as having a load capacity in excess of 10 pounds, and it was useless with a 5D body and 180mm lens combination that weighed much less than 10 pounds. Once over a certain point, the head would just flop over. On the other hand, it was great with a Sigma dp3 Merrill.

From what was discussed in the other, older GH Pro thread, the original Arca Swiss product also lacks an actual lock down for the adjustment knobs, but it wasn't clear if it also flops over. It could have a better/different gear mesh design that Sunwayfoto didn't copy.




Dec 23, 2017 at 05:43 AM
peter_n
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · New Arca Swiss geared panning head


danski0224 wrote:
The Sunwayfoto GH Pro is (was) advertised as having a load capacity in excess of 10 pounds, and it was useless with a 5D body and 180mm lens combination that weighed much less than 10 pounds.


Yes, my own theory on this phenomenon is that the marketing departments of many companies consult a random number table for the specs of some of their products. It takes a while to figure out which ones are reliable and who's not. If you're not sure, its best to wait and see what others experience and judge accordingly.




Dec 23, 2017 at 06:40 AM
Fotografpaul
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · New Arca Swiss geared panning head


danski0224 wrote:
The Manfrotto 405 clocks in at 1/3 of the Cube price.

It doesn't look as cool, but I'll take the change in my pocket.


It's not about looking cool, the 405 is nice head for the money, but it's huge and it's no way near the quality of the cube or the D4. Having owned 3 units of the 405 two which developed/had a defect, also had two 410 both which had a small amount of slop/play.

In short, you do get what you pay for, depending on the application the difference in precision/quality can be a dealbreaker.






Dec 23, 2017 at 07:55 AM
danski0224
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p.1 #20 · p.1 #20 · New Arca Swiss geared panning head


What kind of defect did your copies of the 405 have?

Having actually handled the Cube and the 405, the 405 is much more intuitive for me and the size certainly helps. The 405 isn't any taller than something like the KPS geared ballhead, but it is wider.

I found the small knobs and dials on the Cube to be a major PITA to operate, with the locking dials to be the worse of the two. Oh, and those teeny tiny levers that lock the rotation.



Dec 23, 2017 at 08:26 AM
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